Mighty Avengers (2014) Appreciation

[JudicatorPrime]

I don't have the scan, but I remember a story written by Jurgens where Thor summoned lightning without the hammer to revive an ailing Hogun after an attack.

Thor is the son of the Elder Goddess, Gaea, which in theory should endow him with energy manipulative/mystical abilities -- to say nothing of true immortality -- that are neither linked to Mjolnir, nor Odin. But as we've all seen in the past, most writers tend to ascribe his energy based feats to his hammer... which is a shame.

[Trident]

It says it right on the hammer. Those worthy gain the power of Thor. We saw that with Beta Ray for example.

But it is Thor's power. He was the god of Thunder BEFORE he got the hammer. He's an elemental god because his father is a sky father and his mother is elder god of earth. I do think the hammer helps him focus and control it though.

So if he wanted he could take the power from Lady Thor?

Didn't Beta Ray Bill have his own hammer?

Again outside of the his time on Avengers I don't follow Thor so the whole hammer thing is unclear to me. Just always seemed essential to the character. I also just thought Odin some how placed/tied all of Thors non-natural Asgardian abilities into the hammer, so if their was ever a time he didn't "deserve" the power he would loose the power. It's kinda interesting that he really doesn't need it at all....

[JudicatorPrime]

That's interesting.

So I guess my question is now.....if Lady Thor has the hammer does that mean that all of Thors powers are taken from Thor and given to Lady Thor? Or does the hammer simply replicate Thor's already existing powers? And if it simply replicates his powers what is the point of the Hammer in the first place outside of playing wacko-mole with villains ?

At least with Beta Ray Bill, we know that Storm Breaker mirrors most of Mjolnir's abilities, but there are some feats that only Thor can achieve with Mjolnir as it taps specifically into Thor's Asgardian/Godhead heritage. My hunch is that the same applies to any other non-Asgardian being that won the hammer.

I haven't read the Lady Thor comic, but if she IS Thor, then I think we probably have to view her in the same light that we would an alternate reality or time displaced past/future counterpart of Thor. She isn't a stand in, she's the real thing, only in female form. As such anything the male Thor can do with Mjolnir, she can do.

[JudicatorPrime]

This is true. But Jim did manage to actually set Sentry on fire and possibly burn him a little.

It was really hard to determine in these scans and the only reason why it is in question among some fans is because Jim has managed to actually hurt people who were said to be immune to fire in the past.

Granted, I didn't read that issue, but I wonder? I don't think he hurt Sentry. If I understand the Sentry correctly, he has to concentrate for fear of losing control to the Void persona. It appears that Hammond was trying to overload Sentry by adding one more "exploding sun" to the mix. That surge in power probably felt a little too good to Sentry and he felt his control slipping. He probably sped away to prevent the Void from manifesting. Again, I didn't read the issue, but that might be one possible explanation as to why Sentry left the battle early.

[MindofShadow]

Not really following Thor but it sorta seems that he doesn't have all his powers without the hammer right now. Maybe it was retcon? I'm fairly positive that he was riding on top of Quinn jet as opposed to flying in one of the previews.

In Aaron's run, pre-Mjolnir young Thor still has most of his powers, including the ability to summon lighting

However, without Mjolnir, he wasn't able to fly and I don't think on panel Thor has ever teleported/dimension dump anyone without Mjolnir.

[Trident]

Now I honestly don't understand the point of being "worthy" of the hammer. If Thor has most if not all of his abilities without it why bother caring about the glorified mallet anyway. The concept seems kinda dumb to me now.

[JaggedFel]

Thor is ability to shoot lightning is not really relevant we just saw Zeus fire a bolt that did nothing to Monica. What Thor needs is his energy absorption abilities which seem hammer dependent.

[JudicatorPrime]

Now I honestly don't understand the point of being "worthy" of the hammer. If Thor has most if not all of his abilities without it why bother caring about the glorified mallet anyway. The concept seems kinda dumb to me now.

There are some powers that are specific to Mjolnir, like absorbing, amplifying and expelling energy of any kind; flight; teleportation; time travel; creating force fields; etc. Some writers have also intimated that Thor can't expel his godforce energies without the hammer. Other writers still have indicated that Thor has a greater degree of control of elemental forces with the hammer. It's not that he can't summon lightning or rain, but he wouldn't be able to control it with the same degree of precision as he does with Mjolnir in hand. I'll let you all decide whether or not that's complete b/s. As is typically the case, different writers spin Thor's (and Mjolnir's) powers differently.

At the end of the day, though, Odin's primary enchantment on Mjolnir is that it bestows all of Thor's inherent abilities in addition to the powers that Mjolnir contains onto anyone who wins the hammer. Considering how powerful Thor is, that makes it a highly desirable ball-peen, despite the Arthurian sword and stone stipulation of "worthiness" attached.

[XPac]

Thor is ability to shoot lightning is not really relevant we just saw Zeus fire a bolt that did nothing to Monica. What Thor needs is his energy absorption abilities which seem hammer dependent.

I don't think it's ever been flat out stated that his energy manipulating abilities are hammer dependent. Then again to my knowledge he's never done it without the hammer. Which isn't surprising since he rarely uses those abilities in any context. So there's a question mark there. He might be less powerful without his hammer. Then again he might be MORE powerful with a celestial killing ax. Thats a possibility as well. Anything that can one shot a freaking Celestial is probably something to worry about.

[JudicatorPrime]

He might be less powerful without his hammer.

He is definitely less lethal without his hammer. Offensively and defensively Thor with Mjolnir is a different beast. That was Odin's point of creating the hammer. And let's not forget that Thor initially needed the Járngreipr, his gauntlets in order to wield Mjolnir in the first place. Without them a boomeranging Mjolnir might have injured the young Thor's hands.

Then again he might be MORE powerful with a celestial killing ax. Thats a possibility as well. Anything that can one shot a freaking Celestial is probably something to worry about.

This is what I'm curious to know as well.

The Celestial Killing Axe might be Thor's next great prized possession, in addition to Mjolnir, his gloves, his belt/girdle of strength, and his staff, Gríd (which I don't think has turned up in the Marvel Continuum yet, but exists in the old mythologies). Or the axe might turn out to be one of those weapons that's only good for killing Celestials and not much else aside from normal convential use.

Knowing Marvel writers, I doubt they'd leave Thor without an ultimate weapon.

[MindofShadow]

There are some powers that are specific to Mjolnir, like absorbing, amplifying and expelling energy of any kind; flight; teleportation; time travel; creating force fields; etc. Some writers have also intimated that Thor can't expel his godforce energies without the hammer. Other writers still have indicated that Thor has a greater degree of control of elemental forces with the hammer. It's not that he can't summon lightning or rain, but he wouldn't be able to control it with the same degree of precision as he does with Mjolnir in hand. I'll let you all decide whether or not that's complete b/s. As is typically the case, different writers spin Thor's (and Mjolnir's) powers differently.

At the end of the day, though, Odin's primary enchantment on Mjolnir is that it bestows all of Thor's inherent abilities in addition to the powers that Mjolnir contains onto anyone who wins the hammer. Considering how powerful Thor is, that makes it a highly desirable ball-peen, despite the Arthurian sword and stone stipulation of "worthiness" attached.

Yeah, most of Thor's lightning feats without the hammer are simply strikes from the sky... no "pointing and blasting" or any of that stuff. Just like a rain cloud overhead the comes crashing down.


Plus... the hammer is made of Uru... so it won't disentegrate when he hits something with it

[JudicatorPrime]

Yep. And the fact that Mjolnir has an enchantment on it preventing just about everyone else from using it tells me that it's a mighty weapon indeed.

Wow, we certainly covered lots of ground for a character that isn't even a Mighty Avenger. Someone tell Lady Thor to sign up. She and She-Hulk would become best friends in no time.

[mugiwara]

AXIS tie-in!

• You’ve dreaded it! You’ve dreamed of it! Now - it’s here! THE AVENGERS/AVENGERS WAR!

• With Captain America and Iron Man bringing the full power of the Avengers against the Gem Theater, can our heroes possibly survive?

• Guest-starring Spider-Man! But which side is the wall-crawler on?

There is something I don't understand: according to the second sentence, Captain Falcon and Iron Man are against the Mighty Avengers.
But the last Avengers/New Avengers cover suggests that Sam is part of the SHIELD team fighting the Illuminati.

The what's happening here?

[Harpoon]

There is something I don't understand: according to the second sentence, Captain Falcon and Iron Man are against the Mighty Avengers.
But the last Avengers/New Avengers cover suggests that Sam is part of the SHIELD team fighting the Illuminati.

The what's happening here?

This isn't part of the Time Runs Out storyline, it's part of AXIS; a bunch of characters end up getting "inverted" into being their exact opposites, and some heroes end up not being so "heroic" any more.

[dkrook]

I just want to see Adam vs Thor, letting Adam cut loose on a being that could test strength and power set to the limits