Tim Drake: Robin, Red Robin Appreciation 2018

[Assam]

If Tim's origin is back then I'd like to think his history with Dick is too, up to a point.

You're of course free to think that, but considering the obvious holes in Tim's history currently that keep it from resembling what we know in any way, and the fact that in this case the idea that they're close is just being used as a bad justification for why only these characters are here? Yeah, I'll believe it when I see it.

[CPSparkles]

I like to think that slowly things are being restored. Give it time everything can't be fixed in one story. The process is gradual.

[Assam]

I like to think that slowly things are being restored. Give it time everything can't be fixed in one story. The process is gradual.

Cass and Steph (and Helena and JPV) aren't going to get their histories back, the first two because of editorial and the latter two because not enough people care. Even if Kon, Cassie, Bart and Tim all end up remembering each other, the actual books they were in together sure as Hell can't be canon because of all the other characters and events involved.

There are more examples, but unless Doomsday Clock does what you say can't be done, fix everything in one story, which it won't, we are never going to have any idea about the history of this world.

[CPSparkles]

So partially because of curiosity and partially because i think that we need some possitivity, i wanted to ask, what was your first Tim Drake story and why do you like him?

my 1st Tim drake story was in Nightwing The boys. Tim was Robin when I was growing up so I've kind of grown up with him. I liked that he was just regular in a world everyone seems extraordinary. I loved watching him grow from an awkward kid to a more confident hero.

[CPSparkles]

Cass and Steph (and Helena and JPV) aren't going to get their histories back, the first two because of editorial and the latter two because not enough people care. Even if Kon, Cassie, Bart and Tim all end up remembering each other, the actual books they were in together sure as Hell can't be canon because of all the other characters and events involved.

There are more examples, but unless Doomsday Clock does what you say can't be done, fix everything in one story, which it won't, we are never going to have any idea about the history of this world.

I'm talking about Tim and while i am aware that we will never get everything back exactly as it once was I am confident that we will get as close as possible to what once was.

[Assam]

I'm talking about Tim and while i am aware that we will never get everything back exactly as it once was I am confident that we will get as close as possible to what once was.

Yes, I know we're talking about Tim, and that's why I brought up characters who played major/significant roles in his history. Without Tim's history with those characters, among others, it's basically unrecognizable, some obviously impacting it more than others.

[CPSparkles]

Yes, I know we're talking about Tim, and that's why I brought up characters who played major/significant roles in his history. Without Tim's history with those characters, among others, it's basically unrecognizable, some obviously impacting it more than others.

Crap I didn't think about it from that angle. Still with the character he became in 52 it's still a win and I'm more than prepared to suspend my belief.

[TheCape]

Frankly, i think that Steph and the YJ crew are the indispensable ones, without those Tim is not him. Helena?, well we lost Cry of the Huntres, but the biggest contribution of that mini was meeting Ariana and Jack Drake awakening from his coma, JPV contribution was kicking him out of the batcave wich force him to go solo, i think that you can find easy explanations for that one. Steph was a constant supporting characther so she is the most problematic, specially for coming oit of Batman Eternal, YJ could still work thougth. The other one is Cass, but she wasn't mucy of constant presence in his life in spite of their friendship, so if Tynion get over his ass and actually show us both interacting, if not difficult to bring then back as they were in the preflashpoint canon.

[Frontier]

You're of course free to think that, but considering the obvious holes in Tim's history currently that keep it from resembling what we know in any way, and the fact that in this case the idea that they're close is just being used as a bad justification for why only these characters are here? Yeah, I'll believe it when I see it.

What makes it a "bad justification" rather then just a justification, since we've at least had tangential hints in Rebirth that Dick cared about Tim?

Cass and Steph (and Helena and JPV) aren't going to get their histories back, the first two because of editorial and the latter two because not enough people care. Even if Kon, Cassie, Bart and Tim all end up remembering each other, the actual books they were in together sure as Hell can't be canon because of all the other characters and events involved.

There are more examples, but unless Doomsday Clock does what you say can't be done, fix everything in one story, which it won't, we are never going to have any idea about the history of this world.

I wouldn't say nobody cares about Helena' history, otherwise it wouldn't have been reflected as much as it has been in Rebirth.

[Assam]

YJ could still work thougth.

It really can't though, sadly. There are just far too many characters, events and relationships which are no longer in continuity.

The other one is Cass, but she wasn't mucy of constant presence in his life in spite of their friendship, so if Tynion get over his ass and actually show us both interacting, if not difficult to bring then back as they were in the preflashpoint canon.

On paper, this would be a reason I'd like to think my theory that Kate, Steph, Luke and JPV will all be departing from the team temporarily is true...but then I remember what I think of Tynion's Tim.

What makes it a "bad justification" rather then just a justification, since we've at least had tangential hints in Rebirth that Dick cared about Tim?

Because it's being used to try and justify the presence of what was essentially the Nu52 "Fake" BatFamily. (No Jason admittedly, but he got his own story in this thing)

[TheCape]

It really can't though, sadly. There are just far too many characters, events and relationships which are no longer in continuity.*

I mean, not exaclty like before, that's impossible, but a sort of vague "we were in a team together" kind of think, they made some sligth references but nothing too specific, of course in order for thid to happen they need to exist again first (forgetting Bar-Tor should be the first step).

[WhipWhirlwind]

Cass and Steph (and Helena and JPV) aren't going to get their histories back, the first two because of editorial and the latter two because not enough people care. Even if Kon, Cassie, Bart and Tim all end up remembering each other, the actual books they were in together sure as Hell can't be canon because of all the other characters and events involved.

There are more examples, but unless Doomsday Clock does what you say can't be done, fix everything in one story, which it won't, we are never going to have any idea about the history of this world.

I kind of hope there is some kind of event that while not snapping back continuity, at least gives these characters the memories and experiences of their pre52 selves.

Tim just remembering another life where he lost all of his friends and parents would do wonders for his direction going forward.

[godisawesome]

DC leadership would be against it, since it would hit their traumatic spot of "confuses new readers."

Not that I'd agree; good stories will attract readers regardless of whatever their background is.

[TheCape]

Good news, Tim is appearing in Batman ninja, i'm glad that is using his RR symbol.
12-1-.jpg
Añthougth the line beetween ninja and samurai is thin in this movie.

[KrustyKid]

Good news, Tim is appearing in Batman ninja, i'm glad that is using his RR symbol.
12-1-.jpg
Añthougth the line beetween ninja and samurai is thin in this movie.

Lol, Damian and Tim's hair though. And the Red 'Hood', LMAO!