So, is Carol Danvers now officially Marvel's "Wonder Woman"?

[Juggernaut Punch]

Marvel does not now nor will they ever have a Wonder Woman.

*cough* Power Princess *cough*

[gurkle]

But that's the problem with Wonder Woman. Comic fans seem really deluded about her role in pop culture. Until 3 years ago, I'd have struggled to tell you much about her. The average person has no hope. "She's... wonderful!" She's a hollow icon. Most people only remember that hideous Lynda Carter show as a bit of trivia, if they're old enough to even know about it at all.

I think if anything comic fans seem to think she's less important in pop culture than she is. Wonder Woman's comics have rarely been particularly popular and mostly they've never been very good. But outside of comics, she is truly an icon. People know the name, people know the costume, people even know some of her accessories like the invisible plane and the lasso.

Now, people don't know these things from comics, because most people don't read the comics. They know it because Wonder Woman is much more popular in licensing and merchandising than she is in comics: kids know her from shirts, from picture books, from toys, and yes, from reruns of the TV show, which was very popular in reruns for many years and sold well on DVD. She's an icon because she's the first female superhero who gets put on any merchandising from DC, because her costume is instantly recognizable. She's not as recognizable as Batman or Superman (no cartoon, for one thing) but there are plenty of places for people to get to know her.

It's sort of like the Hulk has always been one of Marvel's best-known and best-loved characters with the general public, even though his comics often don't sell that well and even his solo movies don't do that well. The combination of marketing, merchandising and a well-remembered TV series has made him stick in the minds of people who would never read a Hulk comic in their lives. Wonder Woman's the same thing; people don't know her comics, but they do know she's a sexy Amazon who wears star-spangled panties and ties men up with a lasso.

Carol is probably not going to make it to that level - of someone whose name and costume the average non-comics reader can identify - but very few superheroes do. I don't think any of the X-Men have ever made it except Wolverine, for example. She certainly will get more famous and marketable once her film comes out.

I worry that Carol's push as Marvel's Greatest Superheroine is draining her of the interesting things about her character, the lovable screw-up that Claremont and Reed and other writers gave us. I'm one of the people who complains that the current Carol is being looked up to with awe by everyone around her even though a) We don't really know why, and b) Like Spider-Man and many other Marvel heroes, she's more entertaining when she's not given the respect she deserves. But that's the plan and that's the push, and it's worked to the extent that it got a film greenlit.

[Mutant God]

I'm more curious how they will do the Carol Film. I mean, what story of hers is movie material?

I say, given her backstory the plotlines include: sexist father, joining the air force, meeting Walter Lawson/Mar-Vell (and maybe SHIELD), learning about aliens/the Kree, stopping a Kree invasion on Earth or help create an uprising on the Kree planet

[Blacksun]

Lois Lane? I'd argue Mary Jane can be considered more iconic than her. Storm as well.

I grew up more with mary jane and lois lane than WW. i didn't read comics, but watched the tv shows, cartoons and movies

[Doomuniverse]

Marvel does not now nor will they ever have a Wonder Woman.

Wonder Woman and Lois Lane are the two most iconic females in all of superhero comics and no other female even comes within 5% of them (if you go outside superhero comics then Betty, Veronica, and Minnie Mouse are on the list and still above anyone from Marvel).

The most iconic female Marvel has is Black Widow thanks to the ScarJo movie version. Mystique is probably second at this point because she's played by Katniss Everdeen. If Marvel Studio's hits a home run with the casting of Carol and her first appearance (probably in GoTG 2) is amazing and her movie is amazing then maybe she supplants ScarJo Widow but she still won't even be 5% of Wonder Woman. Seriously WW is up there with Superman, Batman, and Spiderman in terms of icon status and her name has become an adjective because of the character. The Wonder Woman movie could flop utterly and she'd still be far more iconic than any Marvel female.

I think it's been pretty obvious for quite some time that nobody at this forum have any clue how big Storm really is. Lol@this post. Lois Lane hasn't been relevant in a very long time to the international community.

[Expletive Deleted]

If "Wonder Woman" is shorthand for the highest profile superheroine, then yes. If it means anything more specific, then no.

[gurkle]

I think it's been pretty obvious for quite some time that nobody at this forum have any clue how big Storm really is. Lol@this post. Lois Lane hasn't been relevant in a very long time to the international community.

Um, I think you're going to have to prove that more than just saying "LOL." Lois Lane is the second-most famous character in the most famous superhero franchise of all time (or maybe the second-most, if you put Batman first). Storm is one of many characters in X-Men, and not one of the better characters in the movies, which is where most people know the characters from. I don't see how she could be bigger in pop culture overall than Lois Lane - maybe to comics readers (and not necessarily) but that's a very small part of where characters are known from.

I have lots of favorite characters who mean nothing to the average person who doesn't read comics; that doesn't make them bad, it just means they're not household words like Lois Lane.

[DebkoX]

She's the equivalent. But not 'Marvels version'

DCs characters tend to be god-like compared to the average human.

[Zero Hunter]

I think people are missing the point. The TC seems to be talking about the comparisons in a "flagship heroine" sense.

They get the point but they would rather wail and scream. Anyone who does not realize what he meant by the Wonder Woman comparison needs to reread it. And yes Marvel is putting Carol into a posistion where she will be their premiere female heroine just like Wonder Woman is DC's premiere heroine. NOT there literal Wonder Women, but the main female character that people will think about when they think Marvel. That is why Marvel keeps trying to get her series to take off.

A fun little tidbit this months Captain Marvel #8 is actually Carol's 100th (adding up all the Ms. Marvel and Captain Marvel issues) issue I believe. The only other female character to carry over 100 issues of their own series at Marvel is She Hulk who has something like 144 through all her series so far.

[ed2962]

It depends on in what sense you mean. Regardless of how well or poorly her comic sells over the years, Wonder Woman is a cultural icon. She's known the world over as not only a fictional character but also as a symbol of ideas beyond just what in the comics. I'm not sure Carol's going to have the same level of status even if her film is a big hit.

I think the "Carol is Marvel's WW" thing comes from fans just being into some of the superficial similarities between the two characters. Diana of course being a feminist hero, Carol being sorta "feminist" in the 70's, power sets while being not exactly the same comparable (flying power house with super strength).

I never thought that Marvel was trying to promote Carol in particular as their premiere superheroine. I mean, after the turn of the century, Marvel's rebooted She-Hulk and Black Widow as well. I'm not sure they pushed Carol substantially more than those characters.


If anything, I'd say the closest Marvel has to iconic female character is Storm, although not at quite the same level.

[neohuey89]

Carol Danvers is officially Marvel's Captain Marvel.

[NewMutant]

Who is Wonder Woman?

[Tofali]

The idea has never caught on. WB/DC's PR has been trying to make her into a big thing and aligning her with Batman and Superman calling them the big three/Trinity but considering the story arcs and team-up these three have had over the years/decades in the comics you know it's utter hogwash. There's just the idea of WW that has been pushed around over the years but there is no story arcs to support her wonderfulness.

[mathew101281]

In order to be comparable to Wonder Woman any female Superhero would need to well known(and not just for being part of a famous team.) I don't think any female marvel character fits that description.

[Trident]

I wonder if the average person can even tell you what are all of Wonder Woman's powers? I be the could get the strenght and flight down but do they even know the others?