Thread Drift: Scarlet Witch's Sins and Redemption(?)

[anyajenkins]

Didn't cyclops come to an 'understanding' with cap in a+x? And dark beast was the one sending the sentinels after him?

Nah..their whole plan was to scapegoat Magneto and hide like cowards instead of creating a House of Quicksilver like he would of preferred. This idiot wished his daughter never lived. Pietro is sick and a complete phony.

U forget Excalibur the series...Magneto saved Wanda from death at the end of Disassembled in Avengers 503. Hoped Xavier could save her but the heroes came calling and forced the whole thing...if u want to get technical.

They weren't trying to scapegoat mags, they were trying to make him 'happy'. The other heroes jumped to the conclusion that it was mags fault because he the one whose usually the megolmanic in the family (but they also said they were going kill his 'whole family, so clearly no plan to throw the blame to mags and get off Scott free)

[GenericUsername]

Well, given that Cyclops is considered a terrorist for what he did in AvX, so................................................ .........


And as we learned in AvX: Consequences, its not like you actually need any kind of trial if you really want to send someone to jail.................................

Whole what would be equal to like two days in the slammer, put in there by the UN, then played up as joke and forgotten about completely. At least Scott didn't end in limbo for nearly a decade. There ended up being two of him, lol.

[Iron Maiden]

she Did It Again on AXIS or uncanny avengers. she has no full control over her mutant ability . WANDA is mentally ill she needs a therapy!

Wanda is not mentally ill. Please stop perpetuating these half truths you've picked up from other posters. I've read some claims were she was mentally ill even when Stan Lee was writing her. Some posters will go to any lengths, even misrepresenting a story they read so that it lines up with their own biased views. You probably never read any of the Avengers runs were she was a capable and trusted member of the team.

[Sea Hound]

House of M is bound to come up at the moment because in story Wanda is flying off to get revenge on Doom for whatever it was he did. It's directly relevant to the Sixis.

I wonder if part of the reason why it comes up so much is that the full story was never told? Arguably the most important event in X-verse history, in terms of universe changing and we've never been told exactly what happened, why, and how. It's like reading a novel where the most important chapter is summarised in a line, and then the story moves on. It's massively annoying as a reader.

Children's crusade read a bit like the Young Avenger's tie in to an event book to me; where you're given a one line summary of what's going on in the (non existent) main book so you can keep up. Because the current explanation Marvel has given for M-Day is literally a single panel, where Doom says something like: "think you have the power woman? It was me. Tee hee." (Sorry I don't have the scans.)
Even in story the X-Men listening thought it was implausible.

If Remender does anything with this whole Wanda/Von Doom encounter, I hope he fills in some of the gaps. Like what he thought he was doing, did he want to harm mutants, what exactly he did.... Important stuff, if you're an x-book reader. An on panel flashback would be a huge improvement on what we have.

[Doomuniverse]

Didn't cyclops come to an 'understanding' with cap in a+x? And dark beast was the one sending the sentinels after him?


They weren't trying to scapegoat mags, they were trying to make him 'happy'. The other heroes jumped to the conclusion that it was mags fault because he the one whose usually the megolmanic in the family (but they also said they were going kill his 'whole family, so clearly no plan to throw the blame to mags and get off Scott free)

When the HELL HAS Wanda or Pietro ever gave a damn about what Magneto wanted? Lol. They hate that guy 85% of the time and whine about him nonstop when they screw up and can't get the job done on their own. Magneto never wanted a world without Anya or Luna..so it was a perversion of what he wanted to pacify the manipulator in Pietro and the magic wielding Wanda. But u fell for the bad continuity and the lazy writing that Bendis put before u just like u fell for that hack job Morrison tried to do in 2004. Laziness is laziness. Lol@having Wanda scream about him not raising her. That doesn't even make any damn sense and was backwards as it gets.

[GenericUsername]

When the HELL HAS Wanda or Pietro ever gave a damn about what Magneto wanted? Lol. They hate that guy 85% of the time and whine about him nonstop when they screw up and can't get the job done on their own. Magneto never wanted a world without Anya or Luna..so it was a perversion of what he wanted to pacify the manipulator in Pietro and the magic wielding Wanda. But u fell for the bad continuity and the lazy writing that Bendis put before u just like u fell for that hack job Morrison tried to do in 2004. Laziness is laziness. Lol@having Wanda scream about him not raising her. That doesn't even make any damn sense and was backwards as it gets.

Wanda's rant about Magneto at the end of HoM, I attribute to the possession, because it's the only thing that makes sense. She's never whined about him when she messed up. It was never my daddy didn't love me, when she didn't win a battle. He just wasn't a figure in her life. For many years it was all Avengers stuff and her relationship with Vision.

[Iron Maiden]

Well, given that Cyclops is considered a terrorist for what he did in AvX, so................................................ .........

And as we learned in AvX: Consequences, its not like you actually need any kind of trial if you really want to send someone to jail.................................

and he got the same treatment as the terrorists we have in Gitmo so there is a RW parallel there. None of them were piloting a jet that flew into the WTC or the Pentagon but they have been suspected of other acts of terrorism on a global scale. Most of them have yet to go to trial. I guess you could say Cyclops is in that same situation.

[Iron Maiden]

House of M is bound to come up at the moment because in story Wanda is flying off to get revenge on Doom for whatever it was he did. It's directly relevant to the Sixis.

I wonder if part of the reason why it comes up so much is that the full story was never told? Arguably the most important event in X-verse history, in terms of universe changing and we've never been told exactly what happened, why, and how. It's like reading a novel where the most important chapter is summarised in a line, and then the story moves on. It's massively annoying as a reader.

Children's crusade read a bit like the Young Avenger's tie in to an event book to me; where you're given a one line summary of what's going on in the (non existent) main book so you can keep up. Because the current explanation Marvel has given for M-Day is literally a single panel, where Doom says something like: "think you have the power woman? It was me. Tee hee." (Sorry I don't have the scans.)
Even in story the X-Men listening thought it was implausible.

If Remender does anything with this whole Wanda/Von Doom encounter, I hope he fills in some of the gaps. Like what he thought he was doing, did he want to harm mutants, what exactly he did.... Important stuff, if you're an x-book reader. An on panel flashback would be a huge improvement on what we have.

I hope so to but it looks like Remender is falling for the same line in Children's Crusade. I agree when you say that Heinberg pulls it out rather abruptly and you get this sudden confession. One of my takes on that is that Doom is going some kind of reverse of the effect of the Life Force and he's just spouting typical supervillain-y rhetoric. The odd thing about this Life Force confession is why he would even use Wanda to go after the Avengers and later the mutants. Wouldn't he send her after Reed Richards first? Was Wanda under some kind of Manchurian candidate effect? Doom would have been down in Hell right after Unthinkable and that takes place well before Disassembled. He doesn't return until arond the time Civil War gets underway. So why does it take the mention of her children by Jan to set her off? Was this a far thinking Doom planting this trigger? Seems a bit far fetched to me but that's the only way it makes sense. Bendis never got around to explaining his own story very well and left it to others.

That was another odd effect of HoM BTW...the Fantastic Four, with the exception of Ben, suffer a grim fate after the rocket ship crashes. They suffer from radiation poisoning and the do not survive their mutation with the exception of the It, or the Thing as we know him. Doom keeps him around as the muscle of his version of the Fantastic Four. Doom's whole situation in HoM really doesn't make a lot of sense, what with his long dead mother and his former lover Valeria being alive and then him having to bow to the Maximoff family.



IMO the other explanation which Heinberg provides in story and I find more likely is that Doom is lying. Even Cyclops and Wolverine thought as much and they may be the author's voice in the story. But in Avengers World's preview, Dooms dialogue is a bit vague but indicate feelings of guilt on his part. Of course, Spencer may have some kind of swerve planned so we have to wait and see. I can see TPTB letting Doom take the fall for something he really had very little part in as part of Wanda's redemption. No writer is going to lose any sleep over trying to repair his repuation and he is somewhat expendable in that way. But IMO it's a bit cheap to add him to the plot almost 10 years after Disassembled came out. The one thing I did like that came out of his was that he did have a bit of a conflict in reconciling his feelings for Wanda and his perpetual lust for power. I really think the confession was a last minute attempt to cover for her in front of all those assembled heroes.

[Mikekerr3]

No, a more appropriate example would be if you went looking for a drink but got injected with hallucigenic drugs instead against your will and was put behind the wheel of an 18 wheeler.

That pertains more to Wanda because she didn't intentionally get herself possessed.

She went looking for what she got, so she owns the results

[Mikekerr3]

Fans need to move on too honestly. It's been 10 years and it's entering the realm of the dreaded "circular argument" territory.

it has not he even been ten moths since the last time she attacked the whole mutant race, and that time it was of her own free will and intentional, the villains kept her form committing mass-murder again though

[Mikekerr3]

Wanda is not mentally ill. Please stop perpetuating these half truths you've picked up from other posters. I've read some claims were she was mentally ill even when Stan Lee was writing her. Some posters will go to any lengths, even misrepresenting a story they read so that it lines up with their own biased views. You probably never read any of the Avengers runs were she was a capable and trusted member of the team.

If she is not mantaly Ill why the crazy plan in UA that involved murdering mutants? She would have to be crazy as a loon to think her plan was not murderous.

[Iron Maiden]

it has not he even been ten moths since the last time she attacked the whole mutant race, and that time it was of her own free will and intentional, the villains kept her form committing mass-murder again though

Wait a minute, are you talking about them being teleported to that ark or whatever it was? Aren't you exaggerating by calling it mass murder? Then I guess Franklin committed mass murder in the last issue of Onslaught.

[AcesX1X]

Wait a minute, are you talking about them being teleported to that ark or whatever it was? Aren't you exaggerating by calling it mass murder? Then I guess Franklin committed mass murder in the last issue of Onslaught.

she willingly tossed in helpless mutants at the archangel twins with only the assurance from simon that the x-men would take the lead and protect the weaklings.

[Mikekerr3]

Wait a minute, are you talking about them being teleported to that ark or whatever it was? Aren't you exaggerating by calling it mass murder? Then I guess Franklin committed mass murder in the last issue of Onslaught.

She kidnapped the entire mutant race with the intent that they fight, including kids, the essentially powerless and the unwilling. Dropping people into a combat situation is like dropping them into a Shark feeding frenzy. Many are going to die. She intentally, ruthless and murderous placed them in harms way.

[XPac]

That has nothing to do with mental illness. She might need better magic training or Doom could be messing with her again. The story hasn't played out yet.

The thing with Axis was simply that they were losing the fight and didn't have a better option. Wanda and Doom did the only thing they could do.

Didn't work perfectly, but I'm not yet convinced Red Onslaught isn't still worse than the inverted heroes. If anyone had any better options, they should have tried that instead but as far as I could tell at that point they all had nothing. Wanda and Doom was all they had, so they went with all they had.