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  1. #1231
    World's Greatest Hero blackspidey2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HypnoHustler View Post
    Except in entertainment value. I’d rather watch either of the MCU films a dozen times again before sitting through the mess that was ASM 2 again even once.
    Funny, I enjoy ASM2 more than the vast majority of MCU movies, including any of the Iron Boy films.
    "Anyone can win a fight when the odds are easy! It's when the going's tough - when there seems to be no chance - that's when it counts!" - Spider-Man

  2. #1232
    Astonishing Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackspidey2099 View Post
    Funny, I enjoy ASM2 more than the vast majority of MCU movies, including any of the Iron Boy films.
    ASM2 is my second favorite Spider-man movie. It didn't quite hit the awesomeness of the original Spider-man 2... but it's better than any of the rest. Not sure how I compare it to 'the vast majority of MCU' but I like it a whole lot better than the MCU spider-man shows for sure.

  3. #1233
    All-New Member 80sForever's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Skeleton View Post
    Clone Saga should've been reversed in OMD/BND instead of Peter and MJ's marriage

    Peter should never have been forgiven for striking MJ in both Clone Saga and Spider-Man 3 and thus, ruined the character for life for me. I don't like that people forgot about if, but still wanna give Hank Pym slack.
    Peter has passive-aggressive "nice guy" traits. Smart and sensitive but tends to snap when the stress piles up. I knew a pillar of the community who had Peter's personality. He pushed his pregnant wife when she threatened to have an abortion. They went back together and lived happily ever after. Domestic abuse is ugly and confusing.

    On a related note, as a kid I hated Reed being so condescending and treating Sue like his daughter (drawn like he was her grandad) during Byrne's run, including slapping Malice in the face.

  4. #1234
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    Quote Originally Posted by 80sForever View Post
    Peter has passive-aggressive "nice guy" traits. Smart and sensitive but tends to snap when the stress piles up. I knew a pillar of the community who had Peter's personality. He pushed his pregnant wife when she threatened to have an abortion. They went back together and lived happily ever after. Domestic abuse is ugly and confusing.

    On a related note, as a kid I hated Reed being so condescending and treating Sue like his daughter (drawn like he was her grandad) during Byrne's run, including slapping Malice in the face.
    It's something I like about his current interpretations. If he actually reached those levels of douche, he'd actually be called out on it.

  5. #1235
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    Quote Originally Posted by 80sForever View Post
    Peter has passive-aggressive "nice guy" traits. Smart and sensitive but tends to snap when the stress piles up. I knew a pillar of the community who had Peter's personality. He pushed his pregnant wife when she threatened to have an abortion. They went back together and lived happily ever after. Domestic abuse is ugly and confusing.

    On a related note, as a kid I hated Reed being so condescending and treating Sue like his daughter (drawn like he was her grandad) during Byrne's run, including slapping Malice in the face.
    I think that's why a lot of people don't like Reed Richards

    Why do you think Peter gets a pass but not Hank?

  6. #1236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I think that's why a lot of people don't like Reed Richards

    Why do you think Peter gets a pass but not Hank?
    Peter is more popular.

  7. #1237
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Peter is more popular.
    Seems unfair, though. All characters who mistreat their spouses should get flack for it.

  8. #1238
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I think that's why a lot of people don't like Reed Richards

    Why do you think Peter gets a pass but not Hank?
    It's because Spider-Man and the Fantastic Four had pretty big fanbases and consistent characterizations by that point, so Peter and Reed's actions were registered as them acting out of character due to bad writing.

    Whereas Hank at that time was more of a blank slate in people's minds, so the wife-hitting memes stuck to him like glue more.

    It's the superhero version of "first impressions count".

  9. #1239
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaitou D. Kid View Post
    It's because Spider-Man and the Fantastic Four had pretty big fanbases and consistent characterizations by that point, so Peter and Reed's actions were registered as them acting out of character due to bad writing.

    Whereas Hank at that time was more of a blank slate in people's minds, so the wife-hitting memes stuck to him like glue more.

    It's the superhero version of "first impressions count".
    How big is the F4 fanbase still? I assumed it had declined since the 80s (I could be wrong)

  10. #1240
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    How big is the F4 fanbase still? I assumed it had declined since the 80s (I could be wrong)
    Sure, it's not as big as it was, but the F4 are the foundation of the Marvel Universe as we know it, and are Stan and Jack's babies.

    (They'll definitely be huge again once the MCU movies come out.)

  11. #1241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    Sure, it's not as big as it was, but the F4 are the foundation of the Marvel Universe as we know it, and are Stan and Jack's babies.

    (They'll definitely be huge again once the MCU movies come out.)
    I guess maybe it's my personal bias, but I just don't care for them at all. However, aside from that, I feel like their profile has declined ever since the X-Men and then the Avengers became Marvel's flagship team. Their movies failed, their comics haven't always done well, and I've heard a lot of people say they're boring, dated or bland. And I know they're important to Marvel's history, but that doesn't mean they're still as relevant. But again, I'm willing to admit that's my bias or limited experience.

  12. #1242
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    IMO, any IP that can sustain an ongoing comic book, a couple of cartoons, and have multiple films with at least one of them being decently successful (the 2005 film wasn't that big a flop) counts as a 'big franchise'. Yeah, they've gone a bit downhill recently, but a lot of that has to do with studio politics and the effect of the 2015 film. I wouldn't be surprised if they're back on track soon.

  13. #1243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaitou D. Kid View Post
    IMO, any IP that can sustain an ongoing comic book, a couple of cartoons, and have multiple films with at least one of them being decently successful (the 2005 film wasn't that big a flop) counts as a 'big franchise'. Yeah, they've gone a bit downhill recently, but a lot of that has to do with studio politics and the effect of the 2015 film. I wouldn't be surprised if they're back on track soon.
    Ok. I hope they do well, but I'm not looking forward to them.

  14. #1244
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    I'm sick and tired of fans wanting to put Peter in the same box as Hank Pym. It's clearly not the same, even if it's true Sal Buscema's exaggerated style didn't help the scene. I agree with Glenn Greenberg's take, which most of you will already know:

    "Now, on to the matter of Peter "hitting" Mary Jane. We got some heat over this, and some bad publicity. But come on, it's not like Peter Parker was suddenly being presented as a wife-beater! Consider the circumstances. Peter was in a rage, his whole world had been turned upside down, and he was in the middle of a brutal fight with the man he believed had just robbed him of his life. Mary Jane was warned by Seward Trainer not to go near them, that Peter and Ben were both out of control, but she ignored Seward and tried to get in the middle of them and stop the fight. She is clearly shown grabbing Peter's arm, and in the next panel, Peter is shown flinging that arm outward, to shove her away from him so that he can continue the fight. That's how I always interpreted the scene. Peter was so angry, so on the edge, that he wasn't fully aware of what he was doing. Had he been the slightest bit rational at that moment, he surely would have taken into account the fact that he had super-strength, and that he couldn't just shove a normal human being away like that. And I know that's how Tom DeFalco intended the scene to be interpreted. Looking at the issue now, though, I'll grant that maybe some of these subtleties did not come through in the art as clearly as they should have. And that provided enough fodder for anyone who was really looking to make a big stink about the scene". http://lifeofreillyarchives.blogspot...03/part-9.html

    Not to mention the fact that Peter was immediately horrified by what he had just done.

  15. #1245
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shunt View Post
    I'm sick and tired of fans wanting to put Peter in the same box as Hank Pym. It's clearly not the same, even if it's true Sal Buscema's exaggerated style didn't help the scene. I agree with Glenn Greenberg's take, which most of you will already know:

    "Now, on to the matter of Peter "hitting" Mary Jane. We got some heat over this, and some bad publicity. But come on, it's not like Peter Parker was suddenly being presented as a wife-beater! Consider the circumstances. Peter was in a rage, his whole world had been turned upside down, and he was in the middle of a brutal fight with the man he believed had just robbed him of his life. Mary Jane was warned by Seward Trainer not to go near them, that Peter and Ben were both out of control, but she ignored Seward and tried to get in the middle of them and stop the fight. She is clearly shown grabbing Peter's arm, and in the next panel, Peter is shown flinging that arm outward, to shove her away from him so that he can continue the fight. That's how I always interpreted the scene. Peter was so angry, so on the edge, that he wasn't fully aware of what he was doing. Had he been the slightest bit rational at that moment, he surely would have taken into account the fact that he had super-strength, and that he couldn't just shove a normal human being away like that. And I know that's how Tom DeFalco intended the scene to be interpreted. Looking at the issue now, though, I'll grant that maybe some of these subtleties did not come through in the art as clearly as they should have. And that provided enough fodder for anyone who was really looking to make a big stink about the scene". http://lifeofreillyarchives.blogspot...03/part-9.html

    Not to mention the fact that Peter was immediately horrified by what he had just done.
    Wasn't Hank's incident an accident too, if I'm not mistaken? Not saying they're the same.

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