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  1. #1471
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    Everyone is entitled to their opinions, obviously. Mine is pretty different from most everyone's in this thread so far. I thought the changes they made to Elektra really worked quite well. Yes, it's different from the comic, but that's because the show is trying to tell a story too, and needed the character to help say something. Thematically Elektra is one of the richest characters in the season, as her inner struggle mirrors Matt's. I'll keep the rest of my thoughts in spoilers below.

    But it also bugs me that so many people are willing to take some very bad people at their word. More on this in the spoiler tag as well.

    spoilers:
    Seriously, we're taking the Hand at their word? Nobu was telling Elektra what he wanted her to hear so that she'd cooperate. Nothing we saw is inconsistent with season 1 at all. The child Black Sky that Stick killed was not yet "activated", but was clearly a weapon of great power. Elektra was another of these valuable weapons, but was similarly "un-activated." Nobu was singing the song that would lure Elektra willingly, so as to get his weapon without a fight. I suspect that Black Skies are merely capable of being vessels for The Beast, and this was the show's roundabout way of skipping some of the more hardcore mysticism. That would explain why they tried to convince Elektra she would lead them. Because she would, once she had been "activated" and possessed by whatever dark force they worship.

    People are bringing up the adoption, or saying that her father's death is integral to the character. And you're right, as far as the comic version. But Stick is this version's dad, in every way that counts. Stick's betrayal serves the same purpose as the death of her father, in motivational terms, and keeps the emphasis on characters the audience is already familiar with. And the adoption angle plays very much into the show's core of the character, who wants a familiy to belong to; who wants someone, anyone to love her. In the end that person can ONLY be Matt, who sees her for who she is and accepts her anyway.

    I don't know, I guess the changes just work for me. I found the character captivating. The way she acknowledges that the reason she left Matt in college is that he refuses to embrace the darkness within, and she doesn't want to keep trying to taint that, that she chose protecting him over her mission for Stick, really speaks to me. She and Matt are perfect for each other, and yet completely awful for each other. He brings out the best in her, and she the worst in him, and yet they both love it. It makes her sacrifice, her final act of heroism, so much more powerful. She's finally the woman Matt wishes she could be in that moment, free of the darker impulses of her soul. *shrug* To each their own, I guess.
    end of spoilers

  2. #1472
    Elektra Natchios vitaminbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeroBG82 View Post
    Everyone is entitled to their opinions, obviously. Mine is pretty different from most everyone's in this thread so far. I thought the changes they made to Elektra really worked quite well. Yes, it's different from the comic, but that's because the show is trying to tell a story too, and needed the character to help say something. Thematically Elektra is one of the richest characters in the season, as her inner struggle mirrors Matt's. I'll keep the rest of my thoughts in spoilers below.

    But it also bugs me that so many people are willing to take some very bad people at their word. More on this in the spoiler tag as well.

    spoilers:
    Seriously, we're taking the Hand at their word? Nobu was telling Elektra what he wanted her to hear so that she'd cooperate. Nothing we saw is inconsistent with season 1 at all. The child Black Sky that Stick killed was not yet "activated", but was clearly a weapon of great power. Elektra was another of these valuable weapons, but was similarly "un-activated." Nobu was singing the song that would lure Elektra willingly, so as to get his weapon without a fight. I suspect that Black Skies are merely capable of being vessels for The Beast, and this was the show's roundabout way of skipping some of the more hardcore mysticism. That would explain why they tried to convince Elektra she would lead them. Because she would, once she had been "activated" and possessed by whatever dark force they worship.

    People are bringing up the adoption, or saying that her father's death is integral to the character. And you're right, as far as the comic version. But Stick is this version's dad, in every way that counts. Stick's betrayal serves the same purpose as the death of her father, in motivational terms, and keeps the emphasis on characters the audience is already familiar with. And the adoption angle plays very much into the show's core of the character, who wants a familiy to belong to; who wants someone, anyone to love her. In the end that person can ONLY be Matt, who sees her for who she is and accepts her anyway.

    I don't know, I guess the changes just work for me. I found the character captivating. The way she acknowledges that the reason she left Matt in college is that he refuses to embrace the darkness within, and she doesn't want to keep trying to taint that, that she chose protecting him over her mission for Stick, really speaks to me. She and Matt are perfect for each other, and yet completely awful for each other. He brings out the best in her, and she the worst in him, and yet they both love it. It makes her sacrifice, her final act of heroism, so much more powerful. She's finally the woman Matt wishes she could be in that moment, free of the darker impulses of her soul. *shrug* To each their own, I guess.
    end of spoilers
    spoilers:
    Consider me securely in your boat. I was ok with most of the changes. I even get so angry and mad when she got it by the sai. I didn't expect it at all, even despite that lovely conversation between her and Matt as the whole Bullseye thing is pretty much a staple to the character. The black sky thing was a little weird for me and I think with one more pass at the final few episodes, it could have had some issues ironed out. It didn't bother me a whole lot though. Elodie played a better Elektra than Jennifer Garner.

    I thought the character herself was a nice change from the sullen and brooding Frank Castle storyline that slowly started to weigh me down as the season went on.

    When movies like Elektra and Daredevil do Elektra more justice (in terms of fighting ability, death and resurrection) than a NC-17 Netflix Show, you've got problems.
    No... Just no.

    end of spoilers

  3. #1473
    Mighty Member scouse mouse's Avatar
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    I think I sounded like I really disliked this version of Elektra and I don't it's just I would've preferred a more faithful backstory for her. Also regarding the final episode: spoilers:
    I think the reason her death/resurrection is being done this way is because they want to use the Bullseye's other big murder, Karen Page instead. Which if I'm honest I'm okay with because Karen is a bit annoying. She always looks like she is going to cry lol! I thought she showed way more chemistry with The Punisher this season (and Foggy last season) than she has ever shown with Matt.
    end of spoilers

  4. #1474
    Astonishing Member Arfguy's Avatar
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    I felt they really nailed the character of Elektra in this season. She was sexy and crazy. Sometimes, that just goes hand in hand, but man...she really sold me on the caged crazy. We finally got an awesome Elektra. I also hope that the final scene is a hint at a more aesthetically pleasing costume in the future. There was too much black in the current one. I get it, it's a realistic show but man...the prominence of the black on her upgraded outfit was hard to look at. I actually thought the update to her classic comic costume was pretty good, but too much black and not enough red.
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  5. #1475
    Mighty Member scouse mouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arfguy View Post
    I felt they really nailed the character of Elektra in this season. She was sexy and crazy. Sometimes, that just goes hand in hand, but man...she really sold me on the caged crazy. We finally got an awesome Elektra. I also hope that the final scene is a hint at a more aesthetically pleasing costume in the future. There was too much black in the current one. I get it, it's a realistic show but man...the prominence of the black on her upgraded outfit was hard to look at. I actually thought the update to her classic comic costume was pretty good, but too much black and not enough red.



    I thought that spoilers:
    it would be revealed that she had been at least a former member of the Hand based on her costume. The colours used were the exact same ones of The Hand ninjas outfits. In fact having it revealed that Stick had sent her to infiltrate The Hand and then got corrupted would've been a twist.
    end of spoilers

  6. #1476
    Elektra Natchios vitaminbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scouse mouse View Post
    I thought that spoilers:
    it would be revealed that she had been at least a former member of the Hand based on her costume. The colours used were the exact same ones of The Hand ninjas outfits. In fact having it revealed that Stick had sent her to infiltrate The Hand and then got corrupted would've been a twist.
    end of spoilers
    I'm hoping that spoilers:
    she gets the outfit she had in the final episode, only either all red or swap what was black with what was red and add the head scarf. I hope she doesn't get a basic Hand ninja outfit in The Defenders/DD S3.
    end of spoilers

  7. #1477
    Astonishing Member Arfguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scouse mouse View Post
    [/B]
    I thought that spoilers:
    it would be revealed that she had been at least a former member of the Hand based on her costume. The colours used were the exact same ones of The Hand ninjas outfits. In fact having it revealed that Stick had sent her to infiltrate The Hand and then got corrupted would've been a twist.
    end of spoilers
    See, that would have been a pretty brilliant twist. I guess if you do that, then you can't really have the ending they built from that episode going forward.
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  8. #1478
    Mighty Member scouse mouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vitaminbee View Post
    I'm hoping that spoilers:
    she gets the outfit she had in the final episode, only either all red or swap what was black with what was red and add the head scarf. I hope she doesn't get a basic Hand ninja outfit in The Defenders/DD S3.
    end of spoilers
    I hope so too. spoilers:
    I definitely want the headscarf or a mainly red costume for season 3
    end of spoilers

  9. #1479
    Spectacular Member Lightengale's Avatar
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    LOVED Elektra. I felt her storyline fizzled as the season progressed and I scrunched my nose up at the big change, but it didn't take away from her because the character hit all the right beats for me. Elodie was fantastic.

    However...

    spoilers:
    After nearly being killed, then actually being killed, I might actively protest if they bring in Bullseye to kill her yet again. With the liberties taken already, I would love to see the tables turned with Elektra killing Bullseye. Why not? Also, sanctimonious Matt really wore my nerves but no more than when he almost got Elektra killed by distracting her in the fight and was never called out for that. It's both infuriating and tragic that Matt almost gets her killed and then Stick tries to have her killed when she was making an attempt to live her own life, regardless of his attempting to prevent her Black Sky nonsense.
    end of spoilers

  10. #1480
    Spectacular Member Lightengale's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scouse mouse View Post
    [/B]
    I thought that spoilers:
    it would be revealed that she had been at least a former member of the Hand based on her costume. The colours used were the exact same ones of The Hand ninjas outfits. In fact having it revealed that Stick had sent her to infiltrate The Hand and then got corrupted would've been a twist.
    end of spoilers
    Yes! I was actually confused when I realized that wasn't happening. I was sure that was the route they were going.

  11. #1481
    Shou-Lao The Bitch Dragon Iron Fist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by icantstandthisindecision View Post
    I think there's been a few misinterpretations here.

    spoilers:
    The Black Sky, all throughout the first season, was hyped up as not being human. It was something inhuman or subhuman or just not on the registry of human at all - but then we find out that it's Elektra. Elektra, who all her life has been broken because she was raised by Stick. Elektra, who has wanted nothing else than to feel good since the moment that she was a child. Elektra, who has been told by so many people that she would account to nothing and has been called 'It' by multiple people. She's very much human, she's very much flawed, and she's very much the woman that Matt has fallen in love with twice and there's no way that she could be the Black Sky that Matt has been trained to fight against. That Elektra has been trained to fight against. And it's not like it's the first time that the Hand, and Stick, would be wrong in regards to the matter. They had the kid in season one who was obviously not the actual Black Sky.
    end of spoilers
    spoilers:
    I don't agree, largely because of season 1.

    S: If you'd have focused beyond your crybaby feelings, you would've sensed what that kid really was.
    M: He was just a kid.
    S: You're blind as you ever were.

    Stick wouldn't have said this if Black Sky weren't actually something mystical, which I believe was the original intention. But this season they back tracked to make it Elektra.

    I should also point out that I LOVED Elektra and the actress they picked in this show, my problems with the character only came up as soon as the writing dipped ie the last 2-3 episodes of the season where Elektra is Black Sky and Stick orders a hit on Elektra for zero reason. But for the rest of the reason, Elektra being sexy, blood thirsty and hot headed like threatening the witness, that was amazing stuff. I just think the forced 'origin' and it's revelations really ruined a lot of that stuff.
    end of spoilers


    Quote Originally Posted by scouse mouse View Post
    spoilers:
    I'm thinking now that having Elektra not die at the hands of Bullseye will result in Karen getting killed by him in future seasons. There's no way they will kill Elektra twice that would literally be "overkill" but Karen getting her death at his hands would have more emotional impact in the long run.
    end of spoilers
    This would be AWEESOME. Especially given how the season ended.

  12. #1482

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeroBG82 View Post
    Everyone is entitled to their opinions, obviously. Mine is pretty different from most everyone's in this thread so far. I thought the changes they made to Elektra really worked quite well. Yes, it's different from the comic, but that's because the show is trying to tell a story too, and needed the character to help say something. Thematically Elektra is one of the richest characters in the season, as her inner struggle mirrors Matt's. I'll keep the rest of my thoughts in spoilers below.

    But it also bugs me that so many people are willing to take some very bad people at their word. More on this in the spoiler tag as well.

    spoilers:
    Seriously, we're taking the Hand at their word? Nobu was telling Elektra what he wanted her to hear so that she'd cooperate. Nothing we saw is inconsistent with season 1 at all. The child Black Sky that Stick killed was not yet "activated", but was clearly a weapon of great power. Elektra was another of these valuable weapons, but was similarly "un-activated." Nobu was singing the song that would lure Elektra willingly, so as to get his weapon without a fight. I suspect that Black Skies are merely capable of being vessels for The Beast, and this was the show's roundabout way of skipping some of the more hardcore mysticism. That would explain why they tried to convince Elektra she would lead them. Because she would, once she had been "activated" and possessed by whatever dark force they worship.

    People are bringing up the adoption, or saying that her father's death is integral to the character. And you're right, as far as the comic version. But Stick is this version's dad, in every way that counts. Stick's betrayal serves the same purpose as the death of her father, in motivational terms, and keeps the emphasis on characters the audience is already familiar with. And the adoption angle plays very much into the show's core of the character, who wants a familiy to belong to; who wants someone, anyone to love her. In the end that person can ONLY be Matt, who sees her for who she is and accepts her anyway.

    I don't know, I guess the changes just work for me. I found the character captivating. The way she acknowledges that the reason she left Matt in college is that he refuses to embrace the darkness within, and she doesn't want to keep trying to taint that, that she chose protecting him over her mission for Stick, really speaks to me. She and Matt are perfect for each other, and yet completely awful for each other. He brings out the best in her, and she the worst in him, and yet they both love it. It makes her sacrifice, her final act of heroism, so much more powerful. She's finally the woman Matt wishes she could be in that moment, free of the darker impulses of her soul. *shrug* To each their own, I guess.
    end of spoilers
    I'm in pretty firm agreement. This was a good adaptation of the character that gave us something a little new while keeping the essence of the character.

    I wish more time had been spent on the ep 12 reveal, but ultimately I'm incredibly pleased by Elodie's take on Elektra.

  13. #1483
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Fist View Post
    spoilers:
    ... Stick orders a hit on Elektra for zero reason.
    end of spoilers

    Except it's absolutely not "for no reason."

    spoilers:
    The season 1 episode with Stick? That's how they normally treat a Black Sky. Death, with extreme prejudice. Elektra got a pass because Stick got to her before the Hand did. He was raising their ultimate weapon to destroy them. Because he's a sentimental old bastard, when you get right down to it. But the mission comes first. That's why he abandoned Matt when he was forming a bond with him. So when Elektra left the Chaste to become an independent operator, she became too dangerous to let live, from Stick's perspective. He could treat her like a real person so long as she was useful, but as soon as she started thinking for herself she became as good as Hand. Far from "for no reason", it's actually perfectly consistent behavior from Stick. He can even love you, so long as you play his game. But when you stop, you're just in his way.
    end of spoilers

  14. #1484
    Elektra Natchios vitaminbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Fist View Post
    spoilers:
    I don't agree, largely because of season 1.

    S: If you'd have focused beyond your crybaby feelings, you would've sensed what that kid really was.
    M: He was just a kid.
    S: You're blind as you ever were.

    Stick wouldn't have said this if Black Sky weren't actually something mystical, which I believe was the original intention. But this season they back tracked to make it Elektra.

    I should also point out that I LOVED Elektra and the actress they picked in this show, my problems with the character only came up as soon as the writing dipped ie the last 2-3 episodes of the season where Elektra is Black Sky and Stick orders a hit on Elektra for zero reason. But for the rest of the reason, Elektra being sexy, blood thirsty and hot headed like threatening the witness, that was amazing stuff. I just think the forced 'origin' and it's revelations really ruined a lot of that stuff.
    end of spoilers



    This would be AWEESOME. Especially given how the season ended.
    spoilers:
    I wonder if she will be the Defenders villain or show up in S3. If she is, is she going to come back as Elektra or Elektra zombie? Or will she be Elektra under a trance and Matt needs to struggle with saving her or killing her. There's a whole lot of questions and I hope she doesn't end up dead at the end of wherever she appears next.

    Just hope she isn't flung around like this in it.
    end of spoilers

  15. #1485
    Mighty Member scouse mouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vitaminbee View Post
    spoilers:
    I wonder if she will be the Defenders villain or show up in S3. If she is, is she going to come back as Elektra or Elektra zombie? Or will she be Elektra under a trance and Matt needs to struggle with saving her or killing her. There's a whole lot of questions and I hope she doesn't end up dead at the end of wherever she appears next.

    Just hope she isn't flung around like this in it.
    end of spoilers
    Oh God the worst appearance of Elektra I have ever read LOL! And that includes all her nineties appearances! I have never been as happy about Skrull-ektra as when we knew for definite this mess was her and not the real deal! spoilers:
    I would be fuming if Luke Cage does that to her though!
    end of spoilers

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