Azz innovations you liked.

[Dr. Poison]

Wow........it's kind of scary how many of those panels look alike. Then again, I haven't read the book in a long time so this is the first or second time I'm seeing most of these pictures.

[Carabas]

Those close-ups are of course rather cherry-picked.

And the poster also seems to think facial expressions consist of lips and lips only.

[Razor Tiara]

Those close-ups are of course rather cherry-picked.

And the poster also seems to think facial expressions consist of lips and lips only.

They're symptomatic of how I see Ching's Wonder Woman. It's the same thing over and over again and the fill in artists are worse. It's just not an aesthetic I find appealing. I prefer a more realistic art style.

[coveredinbees]

I really like Azz's Orion. He's fun and irritating. They would've been a fun couple.

[Amazon Swordsman]

I wouldn't call anything he's done "innovative". That's quite a reach, IMO.

[Dr. Hurt]

I wouldn't call anything he's done "innovative". That's quite a reach, IMO.

Well sure, but he did introduce a lot of new elements in this franchise, so they are "innovations" as far as it is concerned. Or maybe my english is failing me.

My point was, did you like any of the aforementioned stuff?

[Amazon Swordsman]

Well sure, but he did introduce a lot of new elements in this franchise, so they are "innovations" as far as it is concerned. Or maybe my english is failing me.

My point was, did you like any of the aforementioned stuff?

No. I don't really see anything he's done as innovative because I think a few writers from past eras have touched on certain things he's done. Not precisely in the same way mind you, but ever so slightly. For example, having some kind of father figure, romance, goddess of something, armor adjustments, seemingly irredeemable/uncivilized amazons, different design for gods, altering supporting caste, a primitive Themyscira, etc...

However, the things that may possibly be unique to azz's interpretation are the significance of male influences, the detachment from traditional heroics and emphasis on the mythological journey, and the slow pacing.

So, no. I can't say that I liked any of that stuff.

[klinton]

There are many things on that list that I liked that have happened despite Azzarello's stewardship, not because of him. Such as Steve's new role in the DCU.

The one thing that I do enjoy is her role as the God of War. Even that, though, I like due to it's handling under Soule's pen more than anything that Az has written.

While I don't like that he completely tossed out her clay origin - at all - I do like her status as an equal of her gods. It never quite made sense to me that she blindly worshipped these flawed beings in previous incarnations. Having them as 'family' does make a bit more senes.

[Dr. Poison]

No. I don't really see anything he's done as innovative because I think a few writers from past eras have touched on certain things he's done. Not precisely in the same way mind you, but ever so slightly. For example, having some kind of father figure, romance, goddess of something, armor adjustments, seemingly irredeemable/uncivilized amazons, different design for gods, altering supporting caste, a primitive Themyscira, etc...

However, the things that may possibly be unique to azz's interpretation are the significance of male influences, the detachment from traditional heroics and emphasis on the mythological journey, and the slow pacing.

So, no. I can't say that I liked any of that stuff.

I feel the same way about a lot of these items that others see as Azz's innovations. Other Wonder Woman writers have done them or something very similar before:


Diana as goddess of War - Byrne had WW become the Goddess of Truth.
God mode - New 52 variant of Pre-Crisis Berserker Mode
Designs (Wondy, Gods, N.Gods, F.Born, etc) - Changed several times over the years, especially in Rucka's run.
More grey-ish, whimsical Olympians, eg: Ares as an antihero of sorts - Done one & off through the years in Perez, Rucka, and Simone's runs.

[Dr. Hurt]

I dont mean to defend Azz, especially now that i've grown disillusioned with his run, but i think that even all the stuff you mentioned werent always in the WW comics. Yes, we had berseker mode... in the Golden Age. We had Diana as the goddess of Truth, but not War. We've had various designs over the years, but these are the new ones.

So all i was asking is whether you like the redesign, update, reinterpretation and reintroduction of all this stuff. I didnt know the word "innovation" would cause so much trouble, i was merely trying to find a word for all the things Azz added to WW which she didnt have a few years ago. And for example the berseker mode wasnt here 5 years ago.

[Dr. Poison]

I dont mean to defend Azz, especially now that i've grown disillusioned with his run, but i think that even all the stuff you mentioned werent always in the WW comics. Yes, we had berseker mode... in the Golden Age. We had Diana as the goddess of Truth, but not War. We've had various designs over the years, but these are the new ones.

So all i was asking is whether you like the redesign, update, reinterpretation and reintroduction of all this stuff. I didnt know the word "innovation" would cause so much trouble, i was merely trying to find a word for all the things Azz added to WW which she didnt have a few years ago. And for example the berseker mode wasnt here 5 years ago.

I didn't mean to really question your use of the word "innovation" as you're right, most of these things weren't present in Wonder Woman a few years ago. I just don't see many of them as "new" given that similar things have been done in the past and then there's those on the list that Azz pulled from Greek myth(i.e. Amazon behavior). The swiss-army bracelets, Zola, and the Ares training are definitely new as far as Azz is concerned and the Superman romance, sword as standard accessory, and Steve Trevor upgrade are new in the rest of the New 52.

I would not call your current perspective on Azz's run to be delusional. I would classify it as objective or just simply less interested than you had been. Delusional would imply some sort of mental illness on your part and I don't think that's the case with you although I may need to run more tests to be 100% sure.

[Dr. Hurt]

Well the more i think about it, the more i think you guys are right. There are very few actual innovations there. I guess i should have said something like "innovations or reintroductions".

[dshipp17]

So, Azz has brought a lot of new things to the table. Vote the ones you liked. You can select multiple choices.

Some explanations:
- Option with Orion: Let's assume Azz was allowed to do it and therefore had developped him into a proper love interest. I feel like he stopped using him too much when DC forbid him from going there, so Orion stayed a bit of a pig and therefore not in a position to be anyone WW would want to date.

- Last few options: I had a few more options free, so i decided to ask you about some other new ideas that came from the rest of the new52 and not from Azz. I guess we could change the thread title into "new52 innovations you liked".

- I put the sex piracy thing in a different option from the realistic Amazons one, because i feel it's so special and controversial. I for one believe that we could have these same more realistic Amazons and they could have mated just the same without killing anyone. Masquarading themselves as normal women and seeking dates at bars would be a viable option for example.

I had to pick Bracelets off and the sex pirate thing. The bracelets off has the potential to bring the other end of the spectrum back (e.g. becoming weak, when the bracelets are bound) and the sex pirates thing is how the Amazons should have always been portrayed; the only problem now, from that one point, is Wonder Woman's personality disconnection from the rest of the Amazons. I liked how Azz began the process of showing fragments of Wonder Woman's personal life; now, I want to see a lot more of her personal life.

[SteveGus]

Why is she always the "God" of War now? Has she lost her sex or something?

[Carabas]

Why is she always the "God" of War now? Has she lost her sex or something?

It's similar to how 'actor' has become largely gender-neutral while 'actress' is being slowly phased out and becoming archaic. Language evolves.