Wonder Woman's All Star Dark Knight

[Agent Z]

I don't think Hiketeia and League of One should be discounted for featuring other heroes. Dark Knight Returns and Red Son are considered great Batman and Superman stories respectfully, despite featuring other heroes.

[Agent Z]

The Hiketeia was about the concept of Hiketeia, something Rucka attached to Wonder Woman for the sake of a story. It has nothing to do with what Wonder Woman stands for, overall. It's not like she's sitting there at her embassy waiting for people to come appeal to her against the furies.

That's the problem of most of these Wonder Woman projects. It's more about saying, "What if wonder Woman..." -- as opposed to looking at Wonder Woman herself.

I don't see how the Hiketeia is less about Diana any more than TDKR is less about Batman and more about a future dystopia

[Blacksun]

We know you're hope is not to be. I doubt this Morrison book will be unlike his others.

anything like pax americana i will be happy. well anything like yhe multiversity one shots and i will be happy. morrison is destroying with it.

i will defend rucka, his ww is pretty great. he just wrote her with a duty, like a soldier or a secret.agent. and she was a soldier with a mission from both amazons and gods. she didnt obey everything, she did the right thing from her heart and was rewarded for that. also rucka didnt finished his run, ww was on her own by his final issues. it was a great way to redefine her missipn and role as ww, but then editorial screwed up.
gabriel hardman used ruckas as reference for his ww story and he nailed her better than majority of new 52. for me rucka.is underated, perez and azzarello are more referenced than him

[SeanT]

I don't see how the Hiketeia is less about Diana any more than TDKR is less about Batman and more about a future dystopia

But Batman's always been fighting to push back against the social forces that cause Gotham to devolve into chaos. It's simply another iteration of the mission he's always had.

The Hiketeia is Wonder Woman put into a Greek tragedy. The ending is a total bummer, Diana crying to herself. That's not what Wonder Woman is about.

[SeanT]

I think a big problem with the few WW graphic novels is that they show Wonder Woman operating in a vacuum. They don't represent her world, which is the Amazons, Paradise Island, her mother, Steve, Etta, etc. And they don't try to dig down to her core values. Then again, a lot of runs ignore these people and values too.

So you have Hiketeia where Wonder Woman is working alone in her embassy. Or League of One where her only cast members are two nymphs we've never met before. Spirit of Truth only shows Hippolyta standing in the background, and the only person she talks to is Clark.

Amazonia is probably the closest story to examine Diana's core values, and it does include Steve and Etta and her homeland.

[Thor-Ul]

Yes, something like that is what I see. The world of Wonder Woman isn't well represented in any of the few graphic novels I mean.
In DKR you got Alfred, you got Gordon, you got Joker. And Robin, a new one but still relevant.
In ASS you got Lois, Jimmy, Luthor, the Kents, even Krypto.
But I don't remember any other story where the world of Diana have also a meaning, a relevance to put in context inside the hypotetic OGN. I must confess I had not read Amazonia, but if SeanT said is the closet thing to what I ask for, maybe I had to give it a read. And about Spirit of Truth, I belive than in every work of that series (Power of Hope, Peace on Earth and War on Crime) follows the same pattern, a very intimate story which follows the main character and doesn't goes to much deep in their backgrounds.

[Agent Z]

But Batman's always been fighting to push back against the social forces that cause Gotham to devolve into chaos. It's simply another iteration of the mission he's always had.

The Hiketeia is Wonder Woman put into a Greek tragedy. The ending is a total bummer, Diana crying to herself. That's not what Wonder Woman is about.

Anymore of a bummer than the majority of Azzarello's run I kid, but on a serious note, I like the Hiketeia because it treats Diana like a person and shows her strengths and vulnerabilities. Yes, the ending is sad, but it's not glossed over and we see Diana's reaction to it and it further disproves any ludicrous notions of her "not being human". I think any writer who wants to get into Diana's head could learn a thing or two from Rucka's work with her.

[Blacksun]

Anymore of a bummer than the majority of Azzarello's run I kid, but on a serious note, I like the Hiketeia because it treats Diana like a person and shows her strengths and vulnerabilities. Yes, the ending is sad, but it's not glossed over and we see Diana's reaction to it and it further disproves any ludicrous notions of her "not being human". I think any writer who wants to get into Diana's head could learn a thing or two from Rucka's work with her.

sure, gabriel ahrdman and corrina bechcko that wrote some issues of sensation comics used rucka WW as one of the references. Gabriel admited he wasn't a big fun and didn't knew much about her

[TimothyLaskey]

I was just gonna say A League of One, it co-stars the JLA from that era, but it focuses a lot on Wonder Woman and her place in the DCU. It would also make for an awesome animated movie!

The Perez run as a whole has some really defining story arcs. Challenge of the Gods in particular...

Gail Simone's first arc, The Circle, is a great tale that touches on a lot of Wonder Woman's root ideas. She also had a great story that showed what would happen if Diana lost her soul, which depicted a possible future with her as a conquering warlord, the JLA males worshiping at her feet.

She needs more good trade paperbacks!

[Pinsir]

I was just gonna say A League of One, it co-stars the JLA from that era, but it focuses a lot on Wonder Woman and her place in the DCU. It would also make for an awesome animated movie!

The Perez run as a whole has some really defining story arcs. Challenge of the Gods in particular...

Gail Simone's first arc, The Circle, is a great tale that touches on a lot of Wonder Woman's root ideas. She also had a great story that showed what would happen if Diana lost her soul, which depicted a possible future with her as a conquering warlord, the JLA males worshiping at her feet.

She needs more good trade paperbacks!

that don't cost $50+

[daBronzeBomma]

ALL-STAR SUPERMAN and THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS were self-contained, industry award-winning stories (with a clear beginning and end) that greatly influenced what came later for their respective heroes (DKR influenced the entire Iron Age of Batman comics, ASS influenced the New52 Age of Superman comics).

Wonder Woman is still waiting for that kind of story for herself. It has not happened yet.

Ideally, such a story would focus on Diana, her supporting cast and her rogues; as well as leave the reader with an unshakeable feeling of why the character is so great. It would require a writer with a fresh perspective and clear love of Wonder Woman; and it would have to be unbound by any continuity.

It'll be an awesome story, if someone ever makes it.

[Darius]

Rucka's Diana was all about "duty." She never seemed to be doing what she wanted to do. She always seemed to be much more doing what she felt she needed to do. Either because Athena ordered her to or, in the case of The Hiketea, because of some code of conduct. As such, the Rucka WW never really resonated with me as she seemed to be devoid of self determination. She did what she had to do, whether she wanted to or not. Not my ideal for the primary super heroine in comics.

I have high hopes for Morisson's book, even though I was not a fan of his take on her in JLA (or indeed Paquette's tenure on the book).
That he admits that he never understood the character before.
That he has done a lot of research
That he says that it is unlike anything he has ever written
That he mentions Steve Trevor's importance
That he has never used the term "bad ass"
That Paquette is not rushing through the art
That it is all going to be published together

Those are all at least cause for optimism.

I feel much the same about Rucka's run ... I enjoyed the stories for the most part, but I never felt connected to Diana herself ... IMO he never quite captured her spirit. Hiketeia was IMO his best effort, but I'd in no way call that her "All-Star-Dark-Knight" story. That hasn't been written yet **fingers crossed that Morrison nails it**

[daBronzeBomma]

Maybe, instead of using a Franken-term like Wonder Woman's All-Star Dark Knight, a more concise term would Wonder Woman's Solo Future Epic Non-Canon Tale (SFENCT, pronounced "Svenkt" ... think German pronouncation). That is one way of grouping all the similarities between ALL-STAR SUPERMAN and THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS that we'd be hoping for in such a tale for Diana.

Superman's SFENCT was about his final battles with his classic arch-enemy Lex Luthor and a newer enemy Solaris as well as confrontations with Bizarro and sorta Doomsday.

Batman's SFENCT was about his final battles with his classic arch-enemy the Joker and a newer enemy the Mutant Leader as well as confrontations with Two-Face and Superman.

I'd like Wonder Woman's SFENCT (that term probably won't catch on) to feature a thorough presentation of her classic arch-enemy the Cheetah as well as new enemies yet uncreated, plus Circe and Ares. I'd like to see Donna Troy involved. And of course: Steve Trevor is an absolute must, IMHO.

One thought: I'd like to see what happens if in this future, Hippolyta were to finally die (no resurrections allowed here) and a grieving Diana has to assume the reigns as Queen of Themyscria full-time. How would Queen Diana's new reign as monarch be different from her predecessor's long one? Would she alter the rules to allow men (or at least some chosen men) to set foot on the island? Would Steve Trevor be her husband/royal consort? What of the Greco-Roman gods? What is their status now? What new interpretation of the Cheetah would we see and what scheme would she be up to?

Also: other non-Wonderverse characters might make a very brief cameo at most or maybe just be mentioned (a la Superman or Batman or the Justice League), but overall WW's SFENCT should be a self-contained story closed off to the larger DCU and focused entirely on the Wonderverse characters and settings, IMHO.

Finally: written and drawn by individuals not previously associated with Wonder Woman for a truly fresh take on the WW mythos.

[greenish lantern]

Wonder Woman has had some wonderful runs, but let's not kid ourselves, none of her stories come even close to the level of TDK (Year One, Mad Love or other Batman classics) or All-Star Superman (Or red son, Secret Identity and other Superman classics). Morrison's Trial of Diana Prince is hopefully going to change that.

[TheDarkKnightReturns]

Morrison's Trial of Diana Prince is hopefully going to change that.

Is this upcoming book canon ?