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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxpower00044 View Post
    I don't think the problem is the Nightwing persona, at all. The problem was him getting stuck in redundancy. If they can find a way to make Nightwing not just seem like he's fighting Batman's hand me downs, I'd be all for it. As for now, I'll stick with the awesomeness that is Grayson.


    I'd like to stress before people comment on this, that a change in local isn't enough. There needs to be something more.
    Oh, yeah. I was mentioning this before. And people wee mentioning all the Batman-lite approaches. There are ways to do Nightwing without retreading Bruce's territory. Globe trotter, more gregarious, etc. etc. etc.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by gwangung View Post
    Oh, yeah. I was mentioning this before. And people wee mentioning all the Batman-lite approaches. There are ways to do Nightwing without retreading Bruce's territory. Globe trotter, more gregarious, etc. etc. etc.
    But . . . that would take a writer with . . . imagination . . . (gasp) . . .

  3. #78
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    I wouldn't mind if Tim Drake took over the Nightwing role.

  4. #79
    Mighty Member Rakiduam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnsmith View Post
    I wouldn't mind if Tim Drake took over the Nightwing role.
    I would. The guy doesn't even care Dick is dead, he has no right to use his name.

  5. #80
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    The only character that I would want to see take up the Nightwing mantle is Damian Wayne.

    Maybe he's too young, but we all know age wouldn't stop Damian from becoming Nightwing if he wanted to.

  6. #81
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    Damian should be Nightwing even less than Tim.


    Dick's Nightwing, his clothes don't matter. I have no doubt he'll be back in spandex, but right now getting him an identity that's out from under Batman is a great move and will (should) serve the character well when he superheroes up again.

  7. #82
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Personally id be ok with Damian, because of my fondness for their relationship. Tim no. Though no one should take up the Nightwing name. To do so misses the point of Nightwing.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Personally id be ok with Damian, because of my fondness for their relationship. Tim no. Though no one should take up the Nightwing name. To do so misses the point of Nightwing.
    This. Nightwing isn't a job position, like Robin. Damian as Nightwing for a short-term period could make sense, if Damian wanted to pay tribute to Dick.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by HellHere View Post
    Damian should be Nightwing even less than Tim.


    Dick's Nightwing, his clothes don't matter. I have no doubt he'll be back in spandex, but right now getting him an identity that's out from under Batman is a great move and will (should) serve the character well when he superheroes up again.
    He sort of is. I mean to get proprietary about it, Clark Kent was Nightwing first, and Chris Kent was Nightwing while Dick was Batman. "Nightwing (and Flamebird)" are sort of demotions considering that these are the cats who were originally Robin and Batgirl, right? And from a nomenclature standpoint, "Nightwing" is one of those things that sounds like a young guy invented it to be edgy and cool sounding ... but noncommittal, too. Batman goes out at night. Bats have wings. So do birds. Nightwing. Bat-Man is a thing ... a bat and a man. Robin is a bird and a legendary outlaw. These are legendary pieces of iconography.

    A nightwing could be anything. It's a blank slate.

    Kind of like post-Robin Dick Grayson. All that history, no identity. Night as in "eternally in Batman's shadow" ... Wing as in "eternally waiting in the wings, the wingman." No animal patronus ... no "-man" to indicate to the world that he's not a boy anymore.

    That's why I think I like the idea of wrapping up Dick in all that owl iconography, actually. Besides the fact that the owl history already exists in his own catalog of publications in multiple universes is the closest thing he has to a direct 1:1 competitive aspect to Bruce's legendary status. Because an owl feels like "a grown up bird" (as well as a Bird of Prey, wink wink). Because Hawkman and Birdman are taken. And so is "Night-Owl", actually.

    ... I was never opposed to making Dick Grayson into Owlman, provided that he's not a zombie or a traitor or anything like that. After all, Bruce has a history of stealing the Earth-2 Owlman persona and setting up his friends - Roy Raymond Jr. joined Alfred's Outsiders as Owlman very recently. Dick would surely make a lot more dramatic changes to the costume. Less Earth-2, less Talon, far more Nightwing maybe with a dash of his time as Batman.

    Well I'm done playing hypothetical.

    But to finish up I'll say I don't want Tim to become Nightwing. But I DO want him to finally drop Robin and become Redwing. Redwing is such a perfect name for him. It has history as Robin's various cars and motorcycles, it homages Nightwing but keeps the Red part.
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  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzy Cactus View Post
    This. Nightwing isn't a job position, like Robin.
    In fairness, neither was Robin - right up until it was.

    Quote Originally Posted by K. Jones View Post
    He sort of is. I mean to get proprietary about it, Clark Kent was Nightwing first, and Chris Kent was Nightwing while Dick was Batman. "Nightwing (and Flamebird)" are sort of demotions considering that these are the cats who were originally Robin and Batgirl, right? And from a nomenclature standpoint, "Nightwing" is one of those things that sounds like a young guy invented it to be edgy and cool sounding ... but noncommittal, too. Batman goes out at night. Bats have wings. So do birds. Nightwing. Bat-Man is a thing ... a bat and a man. Robin is a bird and a legendary outlaw. These are legendary pieces of iconography.

    A nightwing could be anything. It's a blank slate.

    Kind of like post-Robin Dick Grayson. All that history, no identity. Night as in "eternally in Batman's shadow" ... Wing as in "eternally waiting in the wings, the wingman." No animal patronus ... no "-man" to indicate to the world that he's not a boy anymore.

    That's why I think I like the idea of wrapping up Dick in all that owl iconography, actually. Besides the fact that the owl history already exists in his own catalog of publications in multiple universes is the closest thing he has to a direct 1:1 competitive aspect to Bruce's legendary status. Because an owl feels like "a grown up bird" (as well as a Bird of Prey, wink wink). Because Hawkman and Birdman are taken. And so is "Night-Owl", actually.

    ... I was never opposed to making Dick Grayson into Owlman, provided that he's not a zombie or a traitor or anything like that. After all, Bruce has a history of stealing the Earth-2 Owlman persona and setting up his friends - Roy Raymond Jr. joined Alfred's Outsiders as Owlman very recently. Dick would surely make a lot more dramatic changes to the costume. Less Earth-2, less Talon, far more Nightwing maybe with a dash of his time as Batman.

    Well I'm done playing hypothetical.

    But to finish up I'll say I don't want Tim to become Nightwing. But I DO want him to finally drop Robin and become Redwing. Redwing is such a perfect name for him. It has history as Robin's various cars and motorcycles, it homages Nightwing but keeps the Red part.
    Hmmm, I'm not sure I'm sold. "Nightwing" not being of the 'Batman' naming convention is something I think it has in it's favour rather than held against it. You could hear the line-up of the New Teen Titans without someone jumping out at you as "the Batman one". The name can stand alongside other hero names, and look like it belongs with them rather than inherently in the Broody Brucey Dark.

    Whereas "Owlman" just sounds like a tweaked Batman thing.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Claude View Post
    In fairness, neither was Robin - right up until it was.



    Hmmm, I'm not sure I'm sold. "Nightwing" not being of the 'Batman' naming convention is something I think it has in it's favour rather than held against it. You could hear the line-up of the New Teen Titans without someone jumping out at you as "the Batman one". The name can stand alongside other hero names, and look like it belongs with them rather than inherently in the Broody Brucey Dark.

    Whereas "Owlman" just sounds like a tweaked Batman thing.
    True enough, although I mean, "Batman" is essentially just a tweaked Superman thing. "They've got this Super-Man, see? Well we're gonna have our guy be "Bat-Man", see? Get inventing, Bill! Yeah yeah, underwear on the outside, symbol on the chest, big cape." (I imagine Bob Kane with a 1930s gangster voice.)
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  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by K. Jones View Post
    He sort of is. I mean to get proprietary about it, Clark Kent was Nightwing first, and Chris Kent was Nightwing while Dick was Batman. "Nightwing (and Flamebird)" are sort of demotions considering that these are the cats who were originally Robin and Batgirl, right?
    Wellllllll . . . not exactly.

    If you want to be technical about it,



    Nightwing and Flamebird were Superman and Jimmy Olsen, and they modeled themselves on Batman and Robin while in the bottle city of Kandor.

    (Of course, that was pre-CoIE.)

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Wellllllll . . . not exactly.

    If you want to be technical about it,



    Nightwing and Flamebird were Superman and Jimmy Olsen, and they modeled themselves on Batman and Robin while in the bottle city of Kandor.

    (Of course, that was pre-CoIE.)
    Hahahaha wow! In the parlance of Bat-Mite; "PAGING DOCTOR FREUD".

    In a post-Batman, R.I.P. world we've got to think about this differently. Batman goes to a world wherein he has the powers of Superman - "I know!" he says, "I'll do as Superman does."

    Superman goes to a world (well, bottle city) where everyone has the same powers as him (under a fake red sun, right?). "I know!" says Superman, "Here I'll be Batman."
    Retro315 no more. Anonymity is so 2005.
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  14. #89
    Fantastic Member wickedmountain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Wellllllll . . . not exactly.

    If you want to be technical about it,



    Nightwing and Flamebird were Superman and Jimmy Olsen, and they modeled themselves on Batman and Robin while in the bottle city of Kandor.

    (Of course, that was pre-CoIE.)
    wow lol interesting

  15. #90
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    I hope it doesn't happen anytime soon. Dick has finally gotten a book that he can call his own with a distinctive identity and unique tone that you hardly see in superhero comics these days.

    The experiment is a success so far and it has made the character much more interesting than ever.

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