Bruce Banner: The Hulk Appreciation 2018

[Hulkboy]

Art is not the end all, be all of a story. There are themes, pathos, foreshadowing, narration, etc.

And in that regard, PAD was rarely less than excellent

Never care about PAD'S, like how i never care about Maestro. They try and try another times to bring this character back, and not work.

Talk to me about Bill Mantlo/Sal Buscema, the rest let's forget all!

[GreenScar1990]

How about... NO!

Bill Mantlo did add to the mythology/lore/history of Bruce Banner and the Hulk, but so did Peter David and Greg Pak to an equally great extent. In other words, to disregard all the great things they've contributed to the character is just pure idiocy! If you don't like it, then fine. Congratulations. You are probably among the extremely few minority.

[GreenScar1990]

How about... NO!

Bill Mantlo did add to the mythology/lore/history of Bruce Banner and the Hulk, but so did Peter David and Greg Pak to an equally great extent. In other words, to disregard all the great things they've contributed to the character is just pure idiocy! If you don't like it, then fine. Congratulations. You are probably among the extremely few minority.

[McFarlane's Green Hulk]

Art is not the end all, be all of a story. There are themes, pathos, foreshadowing, narration, etc.

And in that regard, PAD was rarely less than excellent

For myself, I consider HULK #179 thru #426 the sweet spot for the Hulk.
Wein/Stern/Mantlo, etc.
Post-Pantheon material was hit and miss for me, a lot of it was out of PAD's hands because of what was going on at Marvel...and it showed. I enjoyed most of it, but it could have been better in some aspects.

[Mantis Dad]

Agree with you both GS and MGH! Good call.

[Hulkboy]

How about... NO!

Bill Mantlo did add to the mythology/lore/history of Bruce Banner and the Hulk, but so did Peter David and Greg Pak to an equally great extent. In other words, to disregard all the great things they've contributed to the character is just pure idiocy! If you don't like it, then fine. Congratulations. You are probably among the extremely few minority.

Greg Pak who KILL a important character created by Mantlo, that guy lost his respect, and the same writer who responsible to Amadeus "sucks' Cho. A guy who writer a 635 issues of family's hulk nothing!

Now let's talk about Peter "the limit" David:

1- Starts with Grey Hulk (ok, is good)

2- Personality conflict (good, too)

3- A new Hulk "Merged", is good, but after Fall Of Pantheon, is sucks, and sucks so hard than another boring is coming: the Maestro, a Hulk from the future. By the way, this Maestro's Hulk just die in this miniseries, but Marvel wants bring him back, and FAIL! And, Gerry Duggan do a better work with this character, much more than PAD'S.

4- PAD'S is out of Hulk's title because nobody care!

5- PAD'S return on Tempest's Fugit, good, but not memorable.

Peter David is a good writer, but NEVER better than Bill Mantlo! And poor Pak, the only thing he did well is Planet Hulk/World War Hulk, the rest, is totally buried (like Amadeus sucks Cho).

[HulkSmash!]

Peter David is a good writer, but NEVER better than Bill Mantlo!

Bill Mantlo was a confirmed two-time plagiarist (at minimum) who nearly cost Marvel a fortune in legal fees when he got caught.

Not saying this to get a rise out of anyone, just stating a fact.

How many times has PAD--or really, any other Hulk writer--been accused of plagiarism?

-HS

[Hulkboy]

Bill Mantlo was a confirmed two-time plagiarist (at minimum) who nearly cost Marvel a fortune in legal fees when he got caught.

Not saying this to get a rise out of anyone, just stating a fact.

How many times has PAD--or really, any other Hulk writer--been accused of plagiarism?

-HS

Mantlo do a unique run, nobody do this after him. He just put the Hulk in a respect position. Peter David do nothing but writer a Grey Hulk from another perspective, but Stan Lee do this first, fact.

[FrazettaHulk]

Mantlo do a unique run, nobody do this after him. He just put the Hulk in a respect position. Peter David do nothing but writer a Grey Hulk from another perspective, but Stan Lee do this first, fact.

I totally disagree with you Grimlock. PAD took a Grey Hulk sub-plot he inherited from Al Milgrom. Brings back Grey Hulk while immediately giving him depth. Depowers Rick Jones Hulk while re-inventing The Leader. Creates Half-Life. X-Factor crossover. Creates Mercy. Does an epic Wolverine story. Has Betty pregnant and Hulk handles it heart! Ground Zero plot while turning Byrne leftovers into real threats. And puts Hulk into a conoketely unique status quo for him as a Vegas enforcer with the alias Mr. Fixit. All this in a little over his first year.

Not going to do this for years 2-12. Suffice to say at the very worst PAD delivered good to great issues for most of his run. Creating at least 2 unique Hulks of his own (The Merged and Maestro). While going back into the past to really build up Grey Hulk and Gravage Hulk. Which MOST Hulk fans are thankful for that.

[Hulkboy]

I totally disagree with you Grimlock. PAD took a Grey Hulk sub-plot he inherited from Al Milgrom. Brings back Grey Hulk while immediately giving him depth. Depowers Rick Jones Hulk while re-inventing The Leader. Creates Half-Life. X-Factor crossover. Creates Mercy. Does an epic Wolverine story. Has Betty pregnant and Hulk handles it heart! Ground Zero plot while turning Byrne leftovers into real threats. And puts Hulk into a conoketely unique status quo for him as a Vegas enforcer with the alias Mr. Fixit. All this in a little over his first year.

Not going to do this for years 2-12. Suffice to say at the very worst PAD delivered good to great issues for most of his run. Creating at least 2 unique Hulks of his own (The Merged and Maestro). While going back into the past to really build up Grey Hulk and Gravage Hulk. Which MOST Hulk fans are thankful for that.

Pad's did nothing but direct Grey Hulk to another perspective. All that clap about Peter David is a lie, and nobody want to see the true of the story. Nobody want to writer the Hulk's book anymore! Byrne starts post-Mantlo's Crossroads, and the only thing he did is make married between Banner and Betty, the rest is just a mindless Hulk (again, something Mantlo did much better!), Byrne out's and Milgrom put the end of this with a original Hulk by Lee/Kirby, Peter David take this Hulk's Milgrom and turn him into a Grey and independent monster, he become a Joe Fixit (i know people who HATED this run) with a cool plot and nothing more.

Like i say before, Pad's run is good, but only good, i have these issues and i don't want to read anymore. Bill Mantlo put the drama of tv show in his Hulk's run, people who loves Pad's don't know nothing about this tv show, even Pad's put elements from this in his run. Years passed and people love the Hulk only by "smash" (really? I think i go sleep now...), Pak give that "smash", and what happen? He FAIL to follow with good stories.

Even Bruce Jones's run can kick Peter David run!

These new Hulk's generation of readers is worst than Twilight fans!

[Mantis Dad]

I totally disagree with you Grimlock. PAD took a Grey Hulk sub-plot he inherited from Al Milgrom. Brings back Grey Hulk while immediately giving him depth. Depowers Rick Jones Hulk while re-inventing The Leader. Creates Half-Life. X-Factor crossover. Creates Mercy. Does an epic Wolverine story. Has Betty pregnant and Hulk handles it heart! Ground Zero plot while turning Byrne leftovers into real threats. And puts Hulk into a conoketely unique status quo for him as a Vegas enforcer with the alias Mr. Fixit. All this in a little over his first year.

Not going to do this for years 2-12. Suffice to say at the very worst PAD delivered good to great issues for most of his run. Creating at least 2 unique Hulks of his own (The Merged and Maestro). While going back into the past to really build up Grey Hulk and Gravage Hulk. Which MOST Hulk fans are thankful for that.

I agree with you F'sHulk. PAD's run was one of the greatest, and I have read every single Hulk comic book (several times in some cases). You have to look for the quality in each run, and PAD's run will stand with the best of them.

[Hulkboy]

I agree with you F'sHulk. PAD's run was one of the greatest, and I have read every single Hulk comic book (several times in some cases). You have to look for the quality in each run, and PAD's run will stand with the best of them.

Good, but away by the greatest. That's how people know Pad's, "by the greatest".

These three writers Paul Jenkins, Bruce Jones and Gerry Duggan) is enough to break a Peter David's idolatry.

PAD'S and his Merged's Hulk:
Knock-down by Captain America and ever Superman (Captain lift this Hulk and Superman knock him out with a single punch). Let's talk serious here, this is the worst Hulk version! Glad to Jenkins to change that.

[SMASHERDEVOURER]

I'm a huge fan of the Savage Hulk and like Mcfarlanes Green Hulk my favourite arcs are the Wein/Stern/Mantlo arcs. Nobody since has been able to correctly write savage Hulk properly especially Loeb. As much as I love Mantlo he totally stole Barry Windsor Smiths abusive father story and used it for IH#312.
HULKBOY you do Byrne a massive disservice by saying his only contribution was marrying Bruce and Betty. Without him there would be no gray Hulk as he was the only person to acknowledge the difference in colour in IH#1. All previous flashbacks portrayed the Hulk as green in his first appearance.
His stint on the book was cut short as former editor in chief got cold feet over his plans so he left. He planned to kill off the Hulk who was separated from Banner but have Banner re expose himself to gamma rays again and become another Hulk still Green but smaller weaker and more in line with Jack Kirbys original Hulk look. The people would believe that the Hulk was dead but he would be pursued by a female reporter who was convinced he was still alive, (sound familiar)?
PAD was also cut short because editorial getting cold feet over his plans.
Jenkins was okay but I wasn't particularly a fan of hundreds of different Hulks running around inside Bruce's head but the introduction of Ryker, Flux and the fight with Abomination were cool.
I hated Bruce Jones run personally apart from Deodatos art which was phenomenal

[McFarlane's Green Hulk]

I'm a huge fan of the Savage Hulk and like Mcfarlanes Green Hulk my favourite arcs are the Wein/Stern/Mantlo arcs. Nobody since has been able to correctly write savage Hulk properly especially Loeb. As much as I love Mantlo he totally stole Barry Windsor Smiths abusive father story and used it for IH#312.
HULKBOY you do Byrne a massive disservice by saying his only contribution was marrying Bruce and Betty. Without him there would be no gray Hulk as he was the only person to acknowledge the difference in colour in IH#1. All previous flashbacks portrayed the Hulk as green in his first appearance.
His stint on the book was cut short as former editor in chief got cold feet over his plans so he left. He planned to kill off the Hulk who was separated from Banner but have Banner re expose himself to gamma rays again and become another Hulk still Green but smaller weaker and more in line with Jack Kirbys original Hulk look. The people would believe that the Hulk was dead but he would be pursued by a female reporter who was convinced he was still alive, (sound familiar)?
PAD was also cut short because editorial getting cold feet over his plans.
Jenkins was okay but I wasn't particularly a fan of hundreds of different Hulks running around inside Bruce's head but the introduction of Ryker, Flux and the fight with Abomination were cool.
I hated Bruce Jones run personally apart from Deodatos art which was phenomenal

Not sure who would really get credit for acknowledging the Gray Hulk's existence before Byrne.
There is a letter response from issue #273 that makes reference to the color change; "Ever-unpredictable, gamma rays have run Jade-Jaws thru the mill, changing him from his original grey to his present green skin hue. And changing his vocalizations as his mental level was altered."
And this panel from Hulk #302;

As far as PAD leaving -- he was actually fired for not agreeing to write a non-speaking Hulk who would just be inserted into crossover stories.
"The death of Betty, I was told, was to launch a storyline which would take the Hulk back to brainless, inarticulate savagery. Big fights, ideally with the Avengers, and crossover storylines would be the order of the day. I tried to come up with storylines that would address what Marvel wanted while, at the same time, maintaining something of what I wanted to bring to the storyline. The highers up didn’t like any of it."

[Mantis Dad]

Yeah I hated the merged being changed to Professor too. It was dumb.

I was not a fan of that either. Weird direction at the time Smasher.