Ewing Forces "Loki" to Confront His Greatest Sins

[Raye]

I doubt it. I mean, King Thor is alive in the future and all... complete with missing arm, so it's not likely to be him reincarnated into a new body or something like that.

I am sure Secret Wars will feature him, and a lot of other characters not shown on the covers, I mean the MU is a big place they can't fit EVERYONE on the few covers released so far, especially the ones that seemed to be focusing on alternate versions of characters. I'm also sure Secret Wars will have some lasting impact on the MU and may come with some retcons to some characters pasts or something like that. but I find a full reboot very unlikely, it's just people assuming the worst.

Something occurred to me, though. Al Ewing said towards the end of the interview that things get 'very big' with Loki, and that 14 onward would feature 'epic action across the Realms'... there was a thing a little while back where they teased that a character who was popular in other media would see his profile raised in the comics as well in the coming year. Most people assumed Iron Man. Which is a pretty safe bet, yeah, they're clearly doing some big things with him, and he's clearly one of the best aspects of the MCU... though he seems to be a bad guy for the next while comics wise. But... Loki is pretty big in the movies too. And he has been a recurring villain on that Ultimate Spider-Man show... just a thought.

[Rosebunse]

Sometimes I suspect a lot of his over the top villainy is an act of sorts, but then he does something that makes me think he really is bad to the core. He's a little hard to get a read on. As Asiea said, I have this wacky theory he's not entirely real, but was created by the REAL future Loki in the same way that Kid Loki created Leah to mess with the Serpent, using the shadow of Gram. But that's not to say he can't be his own person as well, story-Leah became her own person once her part in the Serpent's story was done. That could explain some of the inconsistencies. Where he's seemingly helping one minute (even if it's disguised as villainy) then gleefully trying to destroy everything the next.

Anyway, speaking of him. Al said in this interview that this panel was key:



And that everything he says there is the truth. But I am sure it can't be as simple as a literal reading of that, there must be more to it. so... hm.... something to ponder.

Wait, wait, think about what King Loki is saying in this panel. He's saying that he is the Loki that will be, that everyone wants him to be...

I think that panel proves it. Think about what he's saying. He's saying that he's the Loki that will be, like what Scrooge went through in A Christmas Carol. This is the Loki that will be if Loki can't make himself change...maybe he's evil, but he doesn't want to be and he's the Loki that never could change?

I know the writers will never do it because it wouldn't make a good story, but is there a reason Young Loki can't just say "**** all this" and go away forever? There are billions of parallel universes, mystical dimensions, microverses, planets...etc., where he could settle and live as he wished.

I mean, his worst fear is becoming the actor playing the villain again, isn't it? Why doesn't he leave the stage, then?

But then he will never be the better person he wants to be.

The tooth is also missing in Thor: God of Thunder #25, if you look close, as well as the broken horn on his headress thingy. Looks like his upper-left canine or premolar. Clearly, this beatdown has been planned and discussed between at the very least Ewing and Aaron, but I would assume Gillen as well, for quite some time, and the tooth will stay gone. There are other things that are different, as well, like Loki being a part of Axis (and thus lifting Mjolnir, and probably more importantly, what happened to Lorelei and Sigurd) only happened due to King Loki's meddling, he said something about how the 10th Realm stuff happened differently, probably more that's slipping my mind.

*edit - here's the pic, you can definitely see a gap in his teeth, in addition to the new costume which is a strange mix of his Siege/King Loki costume, and Thor's armor:

Someone explain the pointy ears. You're right, it's obvious this has all be planned between the three writers, all of whom are pretty good about continuity. So someone explain the ears. Frost Giants don't have giant ears.

[Habis]

But then he will never be the better person he wants to be.

He could spend the rest of his immortal life healing sick orphans, or protecting outcasts against oppression, or something. Create his own new legend as a good god. And nobody would be pushing him to be evil for their own selfish motives.

As I said, it wouldn't make a good story if he really DID that, but Young Loki should at least consider it.

[Raye]

Wait, wait, think about what King Loki is saying in this panel. He's saying that he is the Loki that will be, that everyone wants him to be...

I think that panel proves it. Think about what he's saying. He's saying that he's the Loki that will be, like what Scrooge went through in A Christmas Carol. This is the Loki that will be if Loki can't make himself change...maybe he's evil, but he doesn't want to be and he's the Loki that never could change?

That's it! I was stuck in him talking as if it was HIS past he was talking about, like his actual past, but the Christmas Carol thing fits! He's the Ghost of Christmas Future. Kid Loki phantoms he keeps seeing is the Ghost of Christmas Past. It's A Christmas Carol! (sorta)

But then he will never be the better person he wants to be.

Scrooge changed.

Someone explain the pointy ears. You're right, it's obvious this has all be planned between the three writers, all of whom are pretty good about continuity. So someone explain the ears. Frost Giants don't have giant ears.

... frost giant thing? I dunno.

[gwangung]

Hm. "The Destiny you run from--but will never escape. Because nobody else wants you to!"

Hm. Where does this leave Verity? (Because....we all get by with a little help from our friends....)

[Riimi]

The tooth is also missing in Thor: God of Thunder #25, if you look close, as well as the broken horn on his headress thingy. Looks like his upper-left canine or premolar. Clearly, this beatdown has been planned and discussed between at the very least Ewing and Aaron, but I would assume Gillen as well, for quite some time, and the tooth will stay gone. There are other things that are different, as well, like Loki being a part of Axis (and thus lifting Mjolnir, and probably more importantly, what happened to Lorelei and Sigurd) only happened due to King Loki's meddling, he said something about how the 10th Realm stuff happened differently, probably more that's slipping my mind.

*edit - here's the pic, you can definitely see a gap in his teeth, in addition to the new costume which is a strange mix of his Siege/King Loki costume, and Thor's armor:

My favorite part is that it looks like the horns are different. I know it's probably because of the different artist (and they've obviously done a great job communicating here), but it amuses me to no end to imagine Loki getting another headdress and then breaking one of the horns

[Rosebunse]

He could spend the rest of his immortal life healing sick orphans, or protecting outcasts against oppression, or something. Create his own new legend as a good god. And nobody would be pushing him to be evil for their own selfish motives.

As I said, it wouldn't make a good story if he really DID that, but Young Loki should at least consider it.

But first he needs to get the whole thing with kidLoki figured out. It's just been hanging over everything since he did it.

Hm. "The Destiny you run from--but will never escape. Because nobody else wants you to!"

Hm. Where does this leave Verity? (Because....we all get by with a little help from our friends....)

I don't think it means everyone, just that most people believe he'll turn out that way. Verity doesn't really know him. To her, he's just some weird guy who likes hanging out with her and who has a weird life. Verity hasn't met his family besides Thor, she doesn't know about kidLoki, about Siege, about all the other horrible stuff he's done. Even if she's looked it up on Google, she wasn't there, she didn't meet him. She's like a lot of fans who only know AoA Loki, who only know him as a cute, charming rogue with a dark side. The question is, will she stay with him even when she finds out about the real him?

My favorite part is that it looks like the horns are different. I know it's probably because of the different artist (and they've obviously done a great job communicating here), but it amuses me to no end to imagine Loki getting another headdress and then breaking one of the horns

No, it seems to be that he's going to lose a horn and it's going to stay cracked for a while.

[Riimi]

But first he needs to get the whole thing with kidLoki figured out. It's just been hanging over everything since he did it.

I don't think it means everyone, just that most people believe he'll turn out that way. Verity doesn't really know him. To her, he's just some weird guy who likes hanging out with her and who has a weird life. Verity hasn't met his family besides Thor, she doesn't know about kidLoki, about Siege, about all the other horrible stuff he's done. Even if she's looked it up on Google, she wasn't there, she didn't meet him. She's like a lot of fans who only know AoA Loki, who only know him as a cute, charming rogue with a dark side. The question is, will she stay with him even when she finds out about the real him?

No, it seems to be that he's going to lose a horn and it's going to stay cracked for a while.

Yeah, I got that, I meant that the headdress looks different (the horns in the picture look like they're made out of bone, whereas his current horns, the ones that are going to get broken, are gold). So I was imagining Loki going out and buying a new one to replace the gold one, and then breaking those horns.

At any rate, it's easily explained by illusion magic, it's probably easier for Loki to change the horns' look based on his current costume than to buy new ones. Now I'm just left wondering about whether or not there's a Ye Olde Asgardian shoppe that supplies all of their apparel. Or even competing chains. Loki and Verity should go on a shopping spree there, pretty please. I'm pretty sure there's at least one place that only sells cloaks, and Thor shopped there and assumed it was all the upper body clothing he'd need, and that's why he hasn't been wearing a shirt.

On a relevant point, someone else mentioned that the chipped horns + missing tooth were some of the branching points of this timeline from the other timeline. I've wondered about that myself after I saw the pictures, but I don't feel like it's a large enough change to affect the final outcome, in and of itself (many small changes might add up to large change, however). Mostly because it seems to easy.

As for Al reminding us that everyone King!Loki said when he had a truth sword through his chest was true (well, emphasizing that fact)--I'm kinda torn in my opinion about what that means. On the one hand, didn't he say we were supposed to wrap up the King!Loki stuff in issue 12? On the other hand, it reminded me a lot about "predestination", which ties into Freya wanting a certain future (as well as Al mentioning she'd show up in issue 15), and the fact that the next arc is supposedly "mythic" in nature. Furthermore, Cul is back (he says hi). So maybe they're facing another Ragnarok. Again. Or something having to do with the repercussions of ending that cycle. But I don't know how they could get King!Loki so easily if that were the case.

[Rosebunse]

I doubt it. I mean, King Thor is alive in the future and all... complete with missing arm, so it's not likely to be him reincarnated into a new body or something like that.

I am sure Secret Wars will feature him, and a lot of other characters not shown on the covers, I mean the MU is a big place they can't fit EVERYONE on the few covers released so far, especially the ones that seemed to be focusing on alternate versions of characters. I'm also sure Secret Wars will have some lasting impact on the MU and may come with some retcons to some characters pasts or something like that. but I find a full reboot very unlikely, it's just people assuming the worst.

Something occurred to me, though. Al Ewing said towards the end of the interview that things get 'very big' with Loki, and that 14 onward would feature 'epic action across the Realms'... there was a thing a little while back where they teased that a character who was popular in other media would see his profile raised in the comics as well in the coming year. Most people assumed Iron Man. Which is a pretty safe bet, yeah, they're clearly doing some big things with him, and he's clearly one of the best aspects of the MCU... though he seems to be a bad guy for the next while comics wise. But... Loki is pretty big in the movies too. And he has been a recurring villain on that Ultimate Spider-Man show... just a thought.

What if there's a league of Lokis who meet to discuss Loki related stuff and they call in AOA Loki for unLoki behavior or something?

[ROSA13]

Im not going to get into it on an internet forum. I know what abuse is. Abuse to real, live human beings, not fictional characters. I have lived on the recieving end of it. Im not going to confuse reality with fiction though.

Double Standards. 2014-if they are fictional characters then you can not blame Loki for kid Lokis death .
(he is not to blame, it is old loki.)ts always a double standard when it comes to me. You can say whatever you like and its fine.My only question…what is wrong with people?

Way to throw a dysfunctional relationship with heavy domestic abuse undertones into the storyline, WWE. **** off.

(See where I said story line? I know it’s not real. It still isn’t something I want my kids to see, especially if they’re seeing it at home)
the big brother abuse his little brother .. Don’t hit people at all and he's a fucking women abuser(she Thor).

TW: Domestic abuse/violence

Violence is NOT always visible. This is a really important point that a lot of people seem to dismiss. The two things I hate are ignorance and abuse.

And, above all:

"Do not mock a pain that you haven’t endured." –


Friendly reminder that if someone in your home life is emotionally abusive, it is 100% okay to not take their crap. You don’t have to listen to what they tell you.Now, I can get why people might take issue with this Loki is mentally ill in a sort of temporary way. I mean the stats on domestic violence is crazy and how amazing would it be for someone to read Loki standing up and saying NO MORE! I hope Loki standing up to him, not taking his ****, and being an amazing role model for anyone ever in that situation.THIS IS NOT OKAY” and iunno that’s just super important to me and I know not everyone agrees because of their own opinions on Thor.

[asiea]

But first he needs to get the whole thing with kidLoki figured out. It's just been hanging over everything since he did it.

I don't think it means everyone, just that most people believe he'll turn out that way. Verity doesn't really know him. To her, he's just some weird guy who likes hanging out with her and who has a weird life. Verity hasn't met his family besides Thor, she doesn't know about kidLoki, about Siege, about all the other horrible stuff he's done. Even if she's looked it up on Google, she wasn't there, she didn't meet him. She's like a lot of fans who only know AoA Loki, who only know him as a cute, charming rogue with a dark side. The question is, will she stay with him even when she finds out about the real him?

No, it seems to be that he's going to lose a horn and it's going to stay cracked for a while.

what if the original siege Loki is back and he has his life body back ?perhaps we experience the kid loki was not real
it was all just an imagination.we get the truth about the kid loki stuff.
he looks like a frost giant
maybe he thinks **** the people of asgard I am a jotun!!!he is his own person now and finally had enough of thor..and he hates thor now really.perhaps thor is now dead for loki.We do not know what happens in the comic..
al says thor regrets what he does to loki ..but he realized it too late..


I think loki has created fake loki for the world and he is hiding and living a new life in the future free of thor and is his own person.

[Pat Thomas]

Double Standards. 2014-if they are fictional characters then you can not blame Loki for kid Lokis death .
(he is not to blame, it is old loki.)ts always a double standard when it comes to me. You can say whatever you like and its fine.My only question…what is wrong with people?

Way to throw a dysfunctional relationship with heavy domestic abuse undertones into the storyline, WWE. **** off.

(See where I said story line? I know it’s not real. It still isn’t something I want my kids to see, especially if they’re seeing it at home)
the big brother abuse his little brother .. Don’t hit people at all and he's a fucking women abuser(she Thor).

TW: Domestic abuse/violence

Violence is NOT always visible. This is a really important point that a lot of people seem to dismiss. The two things I hate are ignorance and abuse.

And, above all:

"Do not mock a pain that you haven’t endured." –


Friendly reminder that if someone in your home life is emotionally abusive, it is 100% okay to not take their crap. You don’t have to listen to what they tell you.Now, I can get why people might take issue with this Loki is mentally ill in a sort of temporary way. I mean the stats on domestic violence is crazy and how amazing would it be for someone to read Loki standing up and saying NO MORE! I hope Loki standing up to him, not taking his ****, and being an amazing role model for anyone ever in that situation.THIS IS NOT OKAY” and iunno that’s just super important to me and I know not everyone agrees because of their own opinions on Thor.

Loki isn't just some guy who has heckled Thor and made his life miserable. Most of the character's life has been spent trying to kill Thor. For some bizarre reason, Thor
has always held out hope that his brother could change, when in reality he should have pounded Loki long ago. Let me repeat that: Loki has spent most of his adult life
attempting to murder Thor (and Odin) so he can be king. This isn't a case of Thor bullying anybody. If Loki doesn't want violence against him, maybe he should stop trying
to kill the one person who tries to take care of him. Don't be fooled by the fact he is now presented as somebody young. He is still the God Of Evil, which people seem to
forget all about. If Thor is abusing Loki here, then Loki does the same to Thor by trying to kill him. To top it off, Thor is pissed at the world right now. Anybody with a lick
of sense should know to stay away from him. He's not right in the head and is liable to go off. Thor in normal times, even on bad days, doesn't abuse his power.

[asiea]

Loki isn't just some guy who has heckled Thor and made his life miserable. Most of the character's life has been spent trying to kill Thor. For some bizarre reason, Thor
has always held out hope that his brother could change, when in reality he should have pounded Loki long ago. Let me repeat that: Loki has spent most of his adult life
attempting to murder Thor (and Odin) so he can be king. This isn't a case of Thor bullying anybody. If Loki doesn't want violence against him, maybe he should stop trying
to kill the one person who tries to take care of him. Don't be fooled by the fact he is now presented as somebody young. He is still the God Of Evil, which people seem to
forget all about. If Thor is abusing Loki here, then Loki does the same to Thor by trying to kill him. To top it off, Thor is pissed at the world right now. Anybody with a lick
of sense should know to stay away from him. He's not right in the head and is liable to go off. Thor in normal times, even on bad days, doesn't abuse his power.

but AOA Loki is not old Loki he is a separate person like kid loki..You can not punish him for the sins of old loki--he's just a weapon of old loki...

is Kid loki guilty of the sins of old loki ?otherwise it would be hypocritical.aoa loki is younger than kid Although his body is older..


who is the killer, the weapon or the person ?

[SiegeLoki]

If you dont want your kids to see comic violence, then please, show them more 'appropriate' kid things. That's neither here nor there. Agent of Asgard is rated Teen.

Thor and Loki have been in conflict in comics since the 1960s. This isnt new. The outfits change, the stories change, but they will always slide back to that conflict in some way or another.

Thor punching Loki is not the worst Thor has done to Loki. Loki has done WORSE things to Thor than Thor has ever done to him. If there was a scoreboard for 'being sh*tty to your sibling', Loki would have Thor beat by a mile.

I'm not saying that their relationship with each other is healthy. It's not. It never has been. I'm not saying Thor is this paragon of good either. He is a good person, but he's also an eons old god who isn't human and doesn't adhere to human morals. So is Loki. Neither of them have ever acted like they are beholden to human ways of thinking. They might attempt to at times(Thor more than Loki), but ultimately they don't.

Yes Thor fought a woman. It's not the first time he has. Are you telling me Lady Thor cant take him? She didn't pick up that hammer to be peacekeeper. She picked up that hammer to fight for the good of Midgard. Key word fight. Including unworthy Thor.

If the rumors are true and Lady Thor turns out to be Jane Foster like I think she is, then Thor is gonna regret a lot more than just hitting Loki.

[Raye]

My favorite part is that it looks like the horns are different. I know it's probably because of the different artist (and they've obviously done a great job communicating here), but it amuses me to no end to imagine Loki getting another headdress and then breaking one of the horns

Hehehe, yeah. Even just him keeping the broken one is a bit telling though, I think. I mean, he is a sorcerer, he can probably manage regrowing or at least hiding that missing tooth let alone fixing a broken horn or magicking up a whole new headdress. Yet he keeps them. I'm getting the feeling he's letting it serve as a reminder.

Yeah, I got that, I meant that the headdress looks different (the horns in the picture look like they're made out of bone, whereas his current horns, the ones that are going to get broken, are gold). So I was imagining Loki going out and buying a new one to replace the gold one, and then breaking those horns.

At any rate, it's easily explained by illusion magic, it's probably easier for Loki to change the horns' look based on his current costume than to buy new ones. Now I'm just left wondering about whether or not there's a Ye Olde Asgardian shoppe that supplies all of their apparel. Or even competing chains. Loki and Verity should go on a shopping spree there, pretty please. I'm pretty sure there's at least one place that only sells cloaks, and Thor shopped there and assumed it was all the upper body clothing he'd need, and that's why he hasn't been wearing a shirt.

I need to see this happen. Also, there must be someone in Asgard specializing in utterly ridiculous hats.

On a relevant point, someone else mentioned that the chipped horns + missing tooth were some of the branching points of this timeline from the other timeline. I've wondered about that myself after I saw the pictures, but I don't feel like it's a large enough change to affect the final outcome, in and of itself (many small changes might add up to large change, however). Mostly because it seems to easy.

As for Al reminding us that everyone King!Loki said when he had a truth sword through his chest was true (well, emphasizing that fact)--I'm kinda torn in my opinion about what that means. On the one hand, didn't he say we were supposed to wrap up the King!Loki stuff in issue 12? On the other hand, it reminded me a lot about "predestination", which ties into Freya wanting a certain future (as well as Al mentioning she'd show up in issue 15), and the fact that the next arc is supposedly "mythic" in nature. Furthermore, Cul is back (he says hi). So maybe they're facing another Ragnarok. Again. Or something having to do with the repercussions of ending that cycle. But I don't know how they could get King!Loki so easily if that were the case.

I am not sure if King Loki is completely done in 12, I think that's just where we learn what he's all about. King Loki is EXTREMELY powerful, far more powerful than regular Loki, even when he was at his peak. It's going to take something pretty big to take him down. I think Loki is going to rescue Lorelei and Sigurd, and then they will have to work together to take down King Loki. Of course, this poses some problems since all 3 of these people are extremely self-serving, so working together for a 'power of friendship' ending is going to be quite the task. And yes, kinda sappy, but friendship HAS been a recurring theme.

Loki isn't just some guy who has heckled Thor and made his life miserable. Most of the character's life has been spent trying to kill Thor. For some bizarre reason, Thor
has always held out hope that his brother could change, when in reality he should have pounded Loki long ago. Let me repeat that: Loki has spent most of his adult life
attempting to murder Thor (and Odin) so he can be king. This isn't a case of Thor bullying anybody. If Loki doesn't want violence against him, maybe he should stop trying
to kill the one person who tries to take care of him. Don't be fooled by the fact he is now presented as somebody young. He is still the God Of Evil, which people seem to
forget all about. If Thor is abusing Loki here, then Loki does the same to Thor by trying to kill him. To top it off, Thor is pissed at the world right now. Anybody with a lick
of sense should know to stay away from him. He's not right in the head and is liable to go off. Thor in normal times, even on bad days, doesn't abuse his power.

To be fair, he genuinely IS trying to change, he DOES feel tremendous guilt about his past misdeeds, and he seems to really like being friends with Thor for the time being. This isn't a case of him being an unrepentant villain and people trying to defend those acts, like what happens with his movie version so often. In a way, this really isn't the same Loki that did all those things. That being said, he is a continuation of that Loki in many ways, he has all his memories and much of his personality, (but with a dash of Kid Loki for flavour) and I think he deserves what he gets here. Trying to be better doesn't automatically wash away all the bad things he's done in the past, or mean he doesn't have to pay for them. To me, a big part of 'abuse' is when the violence etc. is not justified, and i think this is, (even if we are only counting things this version has done, he killed a child, even if that child was himself, it was still pretty bad) and when the person on the receiving end can not fight back. He can. Thor is physically stronger, yeah, but Loki is no pushover, and does have magic and such at his disposal. And then you have to consider that Asgardians do not operate by the same rules and standards of behaviour that we do.