GRAYSON #6 Preview/Discussion

[spark627]

[QUOTE=Dzetoun;849259]

Plot Movement: So the brain is based on Martian Manhunter, and we now know more about where Paragon came from and what the Fist of Cain is trying to do.

QUOTE]

Can you explain this? I didn't get that? How do we know the brain is based on MM? I feel very lost on Paragon lol

[DGraysonWorldsGreatestSpy]

I think when they showed Martian Manhunter, it leads you to believe it was his brain. The whole conversation with Mr. Minos was interesting and just makes Spyral much more complex and leads me to believe that Minos may be Kathy Kane under the thumb of the Spider.

[dropkickjake]

Yes. The story has finally started to move! Excited for next month! This issue felt full, which was needed. The series was starting to drag. Hopefully Tiger and St Hadrian's girls will come into play next week. Tiger got plenty of hype as Dick's new archenemy/archrival, but thus far that really has been midnighter.

[spark627]

I think when they showed Martian Manhunter, it leads you to believe it was his brain. The whole conversation with Mr. Minos was interesting and just makes Spyral much more complex and leads me to believe that Minos may be Kathy Kane under the thumb of the Spider.

But wouldn't we know if someone had stolen MMs brain? I guess I'm confused as to where these organs are coming from, are they being removed from metas or are they being created? The stomach seemed to be created if I remember correctly.

The idea that Minos is Kathy Kane, that would be interesting!

[DGraysonWorldsGreatestSpy]

When on the God Garden, the Hologram Lady said it was retrieved from blood and tissues to create Paragon to Destroy the Garden. This book is filled with many subplots that creates a great new world for Dick Grayson, the only gripe anyone really has against this book is that he is not Nightwing, but for the New 52 this is the best direction for him since it was more Batman and Nightwing as opposed the Pre 52 Nightwing being a persona he created to get AWAY from Batman's shadow and stand on his own two feet. I hope post convergence that Dick gets a second monthly team book with him leading.

[Dzetoun]

But wouldn't we know if someone had stolen MMs brain? I guess I'm confused as to where these organs are coming from, are they being removed from metas or are they being created? The stomach seemed to be created if I remember correctly.

The idea that Minos is Kathy Kane, that would be interesting!

The Gardener explained that obliquely when she said that Paragon was created from the discarded skin and hair (i.e. the discarded DNA samples) of the Earth-bound gods, that is the heroes. Evidently someone -- we don't know who except they are an enemy of the God Garden -- gathered these samples and used them to "grow" a monster, the Paragon, that combined some of the powers of the Justice League. So it had a heart that provides strength like Superman (yeah, that should be muscles, but go with it), a brain with telepathy and empathy like Manhunter, a skin that had some of the powers of Green Lantern (yeah, those come from a ring but just go with it), as stomach that processes nutrients and provides speed like Flash, eyes that can see for miles through liquid like Aquaman, and some kind of organ that processes electrical energy like Vic Stone. They also evidently had some sort of samples from Bruce Wayne but, as far as we know at the moment, those weren't used to grow the Paragon.

Now, if you really want a brain twister, how did the heart end up in an unborn child? Especially how did an adult (presumably) heart fit into an infant's chest cavity?

Likely the answer is nanotech, again. I think someone suggested that the DNA may be used to encode nanobots that then build the organs by modifying existing tissues.

[jules]

But wouldn't we know if someone had stolen MMs brain? I guess I'm confused as to where these organs are coming from, are they being removed from metas or are they being created?

It's been said a couple of times now - Paragon was created from "drops of blood and discarded skin cells of the Earth-bound gods". So, someone did a bit of DNA theft from the Justice League and others which they probably didn't even know about, created Paragon from it, and then Midnighter took him on, blew him up, and is now racing a bunch of organisations to collect all the resulting bits so he can go and drop them in that black hole.

The organs do seem to be artificial, as I presume Paragon must have been. He/she/it sounds a bit like Frankenstein's monster. But transplant one of the organs into a person and you've just created a new superbeing, with many of the powers of the originals that the samples came from. And probably a lot of side-effects the original didn't have, like Ninel's tendency to overheat, overeat and blow up, or the super-fast metabolism that led Dr Ashmore to snack on the corpses of the spies sent to kill her after she started running out of sheep.

The idea that Mr Minos might be Kathy Kane tickles me, but I think it's actually more likely that Minos is someone with superpowers. Why else would he be so paranoid about disposing of all his own discarded skin cells? There's clearly a fear that they can be used against him, and it's as likely to be a fear of being used for the next Paragon as a protection of his identity.

[Dzetoun]

The idea that Mr Minos might be Kathy Kane tickles me, but I think it's actually more likely that Minos is someone with superpowers. Why else would he be so paranoid about disposing of all his own discarded skin cells? There's clearly a fear that they can be used against him, and it's as likely to be a fear of being used for the next Paragon as a protection of his identity.

That's a very interesting theory. Minos is certainly extraordinarily concerned with guarding his DNA, and statements in both Grayson #5 and the Secret Origins segment indicate he feels great bitterness toward masked superheroes, as if he feels he was betrayed or abandoned. He also seems to have it in particularly for Batman and family, although his statement about that in Secret Origins may have referred to Spyral as a whole rather than him, personally.

The question is, then, is he a metahuman we have not yet met, or is he someone we know but whom we haven't seen in the New 52? If the latter, who could he be?

[spark627]

Thank you both for explaining it so perfectly! I think I need to re-read the entire series, I missed/forgot a lot of this!

[Deniz Camp]

This issue certainly did not disappoint. I thought it was pretty great on a number of levels; it felt bigger, fuller, more dense than a lot of the previous issues, it was packed to the brim with character work but done in the context of action and through world building.

It's sort of a perfect issue, really. If I have one gripe, it's that the fist of Cain's plan - and the concept of the telepathic brain - is pretty typical, and was just used by the Uncanny Avengers/Rick Remender plot with Charles Xavier's brain. It's a small thing as that is clearly a secondary plot point, but there it is.

Bonus points for "I'd know that ass anywhere", which was fantastic, the use of Blackhawks continuity (an underrated series!), and the continuing fighting-as-music metaphor (punk rock indeed!).

[Fuzzy Cactus]

Well, a few of Chekov's guns just got fired.

[Godlike13]

Yet another stellar issue fill with great character moments and more world building. I really liked the one and done format, but it is nice to see things coming together and moving forward.

[jules]

Bonus points for "I'd know that ass anywhere", which was fantastic, the use of Blackhawks continuity (an underrated series!), and the continuing fighting-as-music metaphor (punk rock indeed!).

If Dick's Nightwing style fighting is Jazz, and his Robin style is punk rock, what's his Batman? Classical?

I really like the idea that Dick evolves his fighting style to suit the costume he's wearing at the time. It's a callback to Batman and Robin, where Alfred is advising him to "play" Batman his own way. And in the more compressed timeline of the New 52 it's quite possible that he adopted the escrima sticks at more or less the same time as the Nightwing costume, rather than several years down the line when he moved to Bludhaven.

[Godlike13]

If Dick's Nightwing style fighting is Jazz, and his Robin style is punk rock, what's his Batman? Classical?

Rock 'n' Roll. Dick being the roll, and Damian being the rock

[Dzetoun]

Newsarama just published an interview with King and Seeley that, in some ways, is even more interesting than the one from USA Today:


http://www.newsarama.com/23216-grays...niversary.html