Doctor Doom Appreciation

[Iron Maiden]

Thanks Grim Fandango. Since Jim Cheung has it dated for 2018 I wonder if this is just a commission. I don't think he is listed for any future issues of MITO

[kilderkin]

For me doom is the eminent villain of the marvel Universe

Not even thanos comes close to me

He's been the most powerful being in the universe at least twice

Has mastered both magic and science

Mastered time travel and quantum particles

Utterly ruthless and iron willed

Fantastic in every way for me

[Iron Maiden]

I hope that when Doom makes his debut in the MCU it will make people forget Thanos

[TooFlyToFail]

I hope that when Doom makes his debut in the MCU it will make people forget Thanos

Shouldn't be a problem given how poorly written the plot of IW, and Thanos, are.

[SuperiorIronman]

With the way Doctor Doom is I'm expecting him to manhandle the Fantastic Four and Avengers. Something worth noting is that no major Avengers villain (a villain of the respective feature) has ever been human. Loki, Ultron, and Thanos and friends are all aliens or robots. So someone with so much power, so much hate in him, thinks he can do it so much better than everyone and prove himself right is the absolute greatest threat both teams could ever face. One man to break them all.

What would absolutely sell Doctor Doom to me in the MCU is if Victor is completely right. Now we have merciless villains on top of charismatic villains, I want one that is all that and philosophically (though not morally) right. Victor needs to not only come in and take names and kick ass, but needs to be completely justified in doing so. It's awful he's doing it, but part of the cool thing about Doctor Doom at least to me is that he knows better and yet goes about it in the worst ways possible. I keep coming back to The Infinity Gauntlet where he tries getting the Gauntlet and failing. Sure you think it's a good thing he didn't get it, but would a perfect world be that bad? Dependent on who you ask, a planet under Doom might.

There is just so much juicy chunks of story they could use for Victor I can't wait for his debut.

[Coulson]

I remember lurking in this thread years ago and was surprised to see it still going, the Doom fandom is quite small, though I'm not sure why, I genuinely think he's THE greatest fictional character ever.

As for Doom's introduction into the MCU, it will never happen like this, but I would love if in the next Infinity War he just shows up out of nowhere, effortlessly kills Thanos and takes the gauntlet for himself. I would die happy in that moment.

[Iron Maiden]

I don't know, I think the fandom is a bit stronger since Hickman was writing the Fantastic Four / Secret Wars. But I would think a lot of us would enjoy your proposed scene for Avengers 4/ Infinity War continuation. It's a shame we won't see this scene re-created. It was wickedly delicious.

[Iron Maiden]

With the way Doctor Doom is I'm expecting him to manhandle the Fantastic Four and Avengers. Something worth noting is that no major Avengers villain (a villain of the respective feature) has ever been human. Loki, Ultron, and Thanos and friends are all aliens or robots. So someone with so much power, so much hate in him, thinks he can do it so much better than everyone and prove himself right is the absolute greatest threat both teams could ever face. One man to break them all.

What would absolutely sell Doctor Doom to me in the MCU is if Victor is completely right. Now we have merciless villains on top of charismatic villains, I want one that is all that and philosophically (though not morally) right. Victor needs to not only come in and take names and kick ass, but needs to be completely justified in doing so. It's awful he's doing it, but part of the cool thing about Doctor Doom at least to me is that he knows better and yet goes about it in the worst ways possible. I keep coming back to The Infinity Gauntlet where he tries getting the Gauntlet and failing. Sure you think it's a good thing he didn't get it, but would a perfect world be that bad? Dependent on who you ask, a planet under Doom might.

There is just so much juicy chunks of story they could use for Victor I can't wait for his debut.

I hope that is the track that Marvel is planning also. You could say that to some extent they softened Thanos a bit with his relationship with Gamora in Infinity War. There's a lot they could do with Victor if they're not afraid to make a commentary of sorts on the RW situation with people like the Roma. IMO Victor always had the reason to be more political than Reed in the comics and over the years Marvel has downplayed that aspect of Doom's origin. I'd be willing to bet that most new readers, having only been exposed to comics for maybe the last 10 years or so have no idea he is a Roma. Most writers keep the regal traits that he's employed as ruler of a nation. My thought on that is that he employs the manners of the aristocracy as a means of distancing himself from his past and his people's low station in life. It is one of his contradictions....he should loathe the royal classes but at the same time he has chosen to acquire many of the the trappings of the upper classes. I think that is one of the reasons why was enjoying Infamous Iron Man....some of that pretense is gone. I think in the past he felt he needed to act like royalty to prove himself to be just as worthy as those who oppressed his family, his people. I hope that has changed.

[Coulson]

That scene from Secret Wars is exactly what I had in mind. From Future Foundation to Infamous Iron Man, I've been really happy with Doom's journey in the past few years.

You make a good point about his aristocratic nature, I think Doom is a proud Romani, but he's also a highly intelligent, cultured man who is ever in the pursuit of power, so the appearance of superiority is important to him. He's a bit like Killmonger, they both come from nothing and assume the throne they believe rightfully theirs. They don't seem to shy away from the trappings that come along with that. But as you say, he seems to have chilled out a bit now.

[JasonEsta]

Cool Doom graphitti! I think I posted one here that was seen during the 2016 elections in Portland, Maine. I wonder if he got any write in votes??

Wonderful. What a time to be alive..if only Tupac was still here.

[Iron Maiden]

That scene from Secret Wars is exactly what I had in mind. From Future Foundation to Infamous Iron Man, I've been really happy with Doom's journey in the past few years.

You make a good point about his aristocratic nature, I think Doom is a proud Romani, but he's also a highly intelligent, cultured man who is ever in the pursuit of power, so the appearance of superiority is important to him. He's a bit like Killmonger, they both come from nothing and assume the throne they believe rightfully theirs. They don't seem to shy away from the trappings that come along with that. But as you say, he seems to have chilled out a bit now.

I guess next week we'll know what status Bendis intends to leave us with but I do hope that at some point Doom does return to Latveria but maybe with a different tack in his governance. I'd like to see him go back to the very early views we saw....the people had his respect and loyalty and he was very careful how he presented himself to them. It's been undermined over the years in various ways, like when the 2 heirs to the throne Zorba and Rodolpho were given a more sympathetic take on the royal family. Rodolpho was initially on track to be just as bad as his father in his Astonishing Tales debut.

Lately it appears that just about everyone in the Latverian government is corrupt so it should be fairly easy for him to slide right back into being in charge should he chose to return. But now he can show his face to the people so he won't look so fearsome and show his humanity. I don't expect him to strive to win any Nobel peace prizes though.

[DoomScribe]

I agree, the one imbalance in the latest iterations of Doom in comics is his disconnect from Latveria and Latverians. When he returned from the last Secret Wars it was no coincidence that he landed in Latveria, yet since then it's only been shown in ruins. Doom was always a conqueror but he was also a builder, and he had built a better Latveria. A technologically advanced nation, hidden and cloaked behind an old world facade. Marvel took that idea and supersized it for Wakanda, so if they do it again newer readers will think (wrongly) that Doom copies the Wakandans, when in fact it was the other way around. But I digress, John Byrne had it right when he interpreted Doom as deeply attached to his homeland and protective of it. That he's been separated from that part of his heritage has left the character rootless. One wonders what he might be fighting for?

I'm hopeful for a proper Doom in the cinematic universe. I've just seen Deadpool 2, and they've broken the mold on what we think comic book movies were about yet again. So even though I don't expect to see a proper Doom ... I'm still hopeful.

[Coulson]

I did find it quite jarring that Victor would abandon Latveria the way he has, then again, his motivations are rather mysterious post-Secret Wars.

[Iron Maiden]

I did find it quite jarring that Victor would abandon Latveria the way he has, then again, his motivations are rather mysterious post-Secret Wars.

He did give an explanation to Amara back in Infamous Iron Man #3 IIRC. He had even given a few hints about it in his talk with his Susan back in Secret Wars when he told her he was the imperfect thing in his perfect world. One could argue that Battleworld was perfect for him though. Essentially he had everything he wanted....a family, absolute power yet it wasn't enough. And I don't pin that one on Richards. I think it's been one long transformation that I hope subsequent don't wipe out and have him regress. I don't expect him to be saintly....I want to see the same arrogance, the bombastic fortitude. He should never be cowed by someone like the Hood . It's the reason why a low born Roma became a god.

I agree, the one imbalance in the latest iterations of Doom in comics is his disconnect from Latveria and Latverians. When he returned from the last Secret Wars it was no coincidence that he landed in Latveria, yet since then it's only been shown in ruins. Doom was always a conqueror but he was also a builder, and he had built a better Latveria. A technologically advanced nation, hidden and cloaked behind an old world facade. Marvel took that idea and supersized it for Wakanda, so if they do it again newer readers will think (wrongly) that Doom copies the Wakandans, when in fact it was the other way around. But I digress, John Byrne had it right when he interpreted Doom as deeply attached to his homeland and protective of it. That he's been separated from that part of his heritage has left the character rootless. One wonders what he might be fighting for?

I'm hopeful for a proper Doom in the cinematic universe. I've just seen Deadpool 2, and they've broken the mold on what we think comic book movies were about yet again. So even though I don't expect to see a proper Doom ... I'm still hopeful.

Hi again, Doomscribe. I totally agree with you and it's been bothering me for a while now. He gave all the power to that General Karadick but didn't follow up to see if he had appointed the PM that Doom vetted for him. But of course, Bendis wanted RiRi to "save" Latveria (eye rolling). I have nothing against the character, it's just that Bendis tends to do this with his favorites. I remember how Reed swept in and took over Latveria years ago too and supposedly fixed things. Didn't seem to take though.

I've always called Latveria Doom's mistress that he always returns to no matter what. Kind of like Kirk with the Enterprise I remember that story years ago that Stan Lee wrote when Doom took over the body of Daredevil and Daredevil was in Doom's body. To thwart Doom's plan, Daredevil ordered an attack on a neighboring country that was allied with Communist China. Doom abandoned his plans and switched them back so that Latveria wouldn't be attacked and overrun by a superior force. He had not been in power that long so probably figured he'd be overmatched in a fight. And I've lost count of the times he's had to build and repair Doomstadt due to the actions of invading heroes.

[Abe]

Well.... (no spoilers from the story as usual.)

spoilers:

I didn't like what I've just read. I just Hope that Slott will be better, because I fear that I will shortly be as done with Marvel as Bendis is...

end of spoilers

I guess we'll talk about it tomorrow.