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  1. #7036
    Extraordinary Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Bruce was the League member who had the most interaction with the original members of the team since their formation.
    That would actually be Red Tornado, who actually lived with them and bonded with them, Batman generally was just the "Hey guys, do this mission, Batman out", and maybe scold and congratulate them once a mission is done.

    M'Gann and Kaldur may not be his proteges the way Dick is but that doesn't mean he has no influence on them.
    They don't live in his city and hardly directly work under him, even if a significant influence is there, it would not be anywhere near what other characters could have, and we still have Dick who explicitly made a point of "I don't wanna be like Batman".

    Plus, M'gann is the least pragmatic among them and is still doing the Anti-Light nonsense, and Kaldur'ahm outranked him by being the League's damn leader, if he can't think by himself and just follows Batman's way, then he's a bigger joke of a leader than season 3 itself makes him sound like, and that season already makes him look like a bumbling moron.

    Hell, considering the infiltration plan they used in season 2 was straight out of Batman's playbook, it's clearly obvious that his role as their trainer and mission master has given him a strong hold on them.
    Really? Because Batman's characterization in seasons 1 and 2 didn't hint at any sort of emotional manipulation, and if anything, he was far more considerate of people's emotions than anyone else there, even Superman, I don't see seasons 1 and 2 Batman pulling the kind of bullshit Dick and Kaldur'ahm did.

    The way YJ wrote itself can actually make it sound like Dick and Kaldur'ahm came up with that first, then Batman emulated them, even if Barbara tries to pin on him and basically say "Oh that's classic you!".

    Either way we have Barbara talking in a way that can make it look like she's trying to dodge responsibility, even if she claims otherwise, bad writing because of Batman's sudden change of characterization to be more in line with comics only makes it worse, since it ignores YJ's own damn context.

    Defying his orders a handful of times doesn't mean they can't be manipulated by them.
    It still means they're willing to challenge him if they feel he's in the wrong, which they've done casually in season 1 even when they thought they'd be screwed by it.

    Even if Batman has some authority over them, it's hilariously toned down compared to what other media could do given his pre season 3 characterization, plus he even made it clear they discussed those plans instead of him being the one ordering everyone, and Barbara dismisses that point by saying "But we're so used to your ways!", grow up, most of 'em are adults and they generally showed no doubt over what they're doing, Batman is arguably more at fault for trying to manipulate stuff, but everyone else who followed his nonsense without disagreeing are still very much at fault in huge ways, specially after Diana complains points out the bullshit they're trying to do.

    The most excusable one there to be lil' puppet is Tim, 'cause he's not even an adult yet so it's questionable why he's even there (Maybe to make Batman look worse, which, yeah, in that regard, good job), everyone else knows better (Or at least they should), "We're all your protegés used to your ways!" is just a dumb excuse that doesn't really work if you think about the previous seasons, and their characterizations, even if Dick forgot his "I don't wanna be like Batman anymore", there's still at least Kaldur'ahm and M'gann who aren't even his protegés anyways, and again, Kaldur'ahm actually outranks Batman.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    Actually, the folks who are out of touch are the ones who can only profit off of 2 characters out of the 10,000 characters they own while tripping up with every other character they own.
    2 characters? Who's the second one, another Batman? .

    A well done Darkseid could easily overshadow Thanos. But it's going to be hard to catch up now that Thanos has been in two of the biggest movies of all time.
    I mean, sure, a well done Darkseid could do that, but he still ended up being more similar to MCU Thanos anyways lol.

    But I don't think they were intentionally trying to mimic Thanos. I just don't think Zack Snyder has the talent necessary to bring Darkseid to life and convey to the general audience what Darkseid is all about.
    I wonder about that, Hollywood can ripoff itself to try to mimic popularity, maybe Snyder is incompetent when it comes to Darkseid, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was told, or even wanted to, rip off MCU Thanos.

    But yeah, maybe Snyder just screwed up, but hell of a coincidence for him to just happen to be similar Thanos when Darkseid is his own thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCape View Post
    We all know that BND was a collective mid-life crisis from Marvel back then

  2. #7037
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled View Post
    Grace Randolph said some WB execs don't want to use Vixen (at least on the movie side) coz they find her to be too much like Black Panther

    I guess on a superficial level but LMAO. I guess Hollywood has room for only one animal-themed superhero from Africa.
    That's just dumb.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    For Sharon Carter, probably, since Sharon isn't that known in general (And admittedly I don't even know who she is in either comics or MCU lol),
    Peggy's daughter, originally, though with the sliding timescale that no longer works, I think she's something like great niece by now. Peggy was actually resurrected in the last Captain America run and will continue to be part of Steve's supporting cast - alongside Sharon - in the new one. She's a spy codenamed Dryad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Probably also be surprised that Pepper Potts isn't even his most involved relationship.
    Hell, Pepper married Happy in the comics! The MCU instead had her with Tony, and had Happy date Aunt May Parker (who is much younger than her comic book counterpart).
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  3. #7038
    Astonishing Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    This latest YJ episode...It was a great and definitely had me on the edge of my seat.

    But im kind over Martians...they are just SO DAMN POWERFUL that it makes it hard to keep things exciting when they show up.

  4. #7039
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    This latest YJ episode...It was a great and definitely had me on the edge of my seat.

    But im kind over Martians...they are just SO DAMN POWERFUL that it makes it hard to keep things exciting when they show up.
    I'm just waiting for someone to finally take out Malefak but it feels like the show has to keep the villains OP to keep the conflicts going or to back up other villains.

  5. #7040

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Recently I've gotten the sense that people envision Babs as this person who lectures people and always tries to have the high ground.
    Might've started here:


    EDIT:
    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    That would actually be Red Tornado, who actually lived with them and bonded with them, Batman generally was just the "Hey guys, do this mission, Batman out", and maybe scold and congratulate them once a mission is done.



    They don't live in his city and hardly directly work under him, even if a significant influence is there, it would not be anywhere near what other characters could have, and we still have Dick who explicitly made a point of "I don't wanna be like Batman".

    Plus, M'gann is the least pragmatic among them and is still doing the Anti-Light nonsense, and Kaldur'ahm outranked him by being the League's damn leader, if he can't think by himself and just follows Batman's way, then he's a bigger joke of a leader than season 3 itself makes him sound like, and that season already makes him look like a bumbling moron.



    Really? Because Batman's characterization in seasons 1 and 2 didn't hint at any sort of emotional manipulation, and if anything, he was far more considerate of people's emotions than anyone else there, even Superman, I don't see seasons 1 and 2 Batman pulling the kind of bullshit Dick and Kaldur'ahm did.

    The way YJ wrote itself can actually make it sound like Dick and Kaldur'ahm came up with that first, then Batman emulated them, even if Barbara tries to pin on him and basically say "Oh that's classic you!".

    Either way we have Barbara talking in a way that can make it look like she's trying to dodge responsibility, even if she claims otherwise, bad writing because of Batman's sudden change of characterization to be more in line with comics only makes it worse, since it ignores YJ's own damn context.



    It still means they're willing to challenge him if they feel he's in the wrong, which they've done casually in season 1 even when they thought they'd be screwed by it.

    Even if Batman has some authority over them, it's hilariously toned down compared to what other media could do given his pre season 3 characterization, plus he even made it clear they discussed those plans instead of him being the one ordering everyone, and Barbara dismisses that point by saying "But we're so used to your ways!", grow up, most of 'em are adults and they generally showed no doubt over what they're doing, Batman is arguably more at fault for trying to manipulate stuff, but everyone else who followed his nonsense without disagreeing are still very much at fault in huge ways, specially after Diana complains points out the bullshit they're trying to do.

    The most excusable one there to be lil' puppet is Tim, 'cause he's not even an adult yet so it's questionable why he's even there (Maybe to make Batman look worse, which, yeah, in that regard, good job), everyone else knows better (Or at least they should), "We're all your protegés used to your ways!" is just a dumb excuse that doesn't really work if you think about the previous seasons, and their characterizations, even if Dick forgot his "I don't wanna be like Batman anymore", there's still at least Kaldur'ahm and M'gann who aren't even his protegés anyways, and again, Kaldur'ahm actually outranks Batman.
    I think it's jsut a sign that the YJ writers have a "tell, don't show" problem
    Last edited by Thezmage; 05-26-2022 at 09:34 AM.

  6. #7041
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    This latest YJ episode...It was a great and definitely had me on the edge of my seat.

    But im kind over Martians...they are just SO DAMN POWERFUL that it makes it hard to keep things exciting when they show up.
    what do want team rocket instead?

  7. #7042
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    what do want team rocket instead?
    Well, I'd like to see major villains get their comeuppance at some point...

  8. #7043
    Astonishing Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    what do want team rocket instead?
    Im not sure what you mean?

    M'ganns brother was able to come in, fool Phantom Girl by shape-shifting, kill the kid by going into his mind. It was an easy (temporary) win.

    But Martians in general in YJ have been very powerful with little limitations.

  9. #7044
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    Im not sure what you mean?

    M'ganns brother was able to come in, fool Phantom Girl by shape-shifting, kill the kid by going into his mind. It was an easy (temporary) win.

    But Martians in general in YJ have been very powerful with little limitations.
    Except Martian Manhunter .

  10. #7045
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    Im not sure what you mean?

    M'ganns brother was able to come in, fool Phantom Girl by shape-shifting, kill the kid by going into his mind. It was an easy (temporary) win.

    But Martians in general in YJ have been very powerful with little limitations.
    Sounds like he is an effective, competent bad guy. I am ready for M’gnn to take him out. I haven forgotten him killing those kids last season. Martian have always been tough, we just don’t see heroes like Jnn and Mgnn use thier powers in full force too much, heck the show still nerfed them, Martians have had laser beams super strength in the comics too. we know why Mgnn doesn’t just full blast KO every bad guy she see’s. It’s fun when bad guys have an edge, and we saw them planning ahead, working as a team.

  11. #7046
    Astonishing Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    Sounds like he is an effective, competent bad guy. I am ready for M’gnn to take him out. I haven forgotten him killing those kids last season. Martian have always been tough, we just don’t see heroes like Jnn and Mgnn use thier powers in full force too much, heck the show still nerfed them, Martians have had laser beams super strength in the comics too. we know why Mgnn doesn’t just full blast KO every bad guy she see’s. It’s fun when bad guys have an edge, and we saw them planning ahead, working as a team.
    Bad guys have had an edge since the beginning. There's just no limitation, no way to fight back against nerfed Martians.

  12. #7047

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    Sounds like he is an effective, competent bad guy. I am ready for M’gnn to take him out. I haven forgotten him killing those kids last season. Martian have always been tough, we just don’t see heroes like Jnn and Mgnn use thier powers in full force too much, heck the show still nerfed them, Martians have had laser beams super strength in the comics too. we know why Mgnn doesn’t just full blast KO every bad guy she see’s. It’s fun when bad guys have an edge, and we saw them planning ahead, working as a team.
    After three seasons of everything turning out "just as planned" for the villains, or the hero's most major accomplishments being portrayed as minor setbacks for The Light, I think a fair number of fans don't believe that the latest overpowered villain is there for the heroes to defeat anymore.

  13. #7048
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thezmage View Post
    After three seasons of everything turning out "just as planned" for the villains, or the hero's most major accomplishments being portrayed as minor setbacks for The Light, I think a fair number of fans don't believe that the latest overpowered villain is there for the heroes to defeat anymore.
    Vandal savage has been on This earth for centuries
    He’s playing the long game. As long as the heroes continue to save lives I think all their wins have value. Clearly a war is brewing but that takes setup and time. Do you want them to wrap up everything right now, just kill off Vandal in a frontal assault? That kinda tactic is the plot of Justice League Dark Apokolipse. As for Malafaak, his deafeat would be apart of Mgnn storyline coming to an end. It just might be this season considering how much focus He and Mars has had this season.

  14. #7049

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    Vandal savage has been on This earth for centuries
    He’s playing the long game. As long as the heroes continue to save lives I think all their wins have value. Clearly a war is brewing but that takes setup and time. Do you want them to wrap up everything right now, just kill off Vandal in a frontal assault? That kinda tactic is the plot of Justice League Dark Apokolipse. As for Malafaak, his deafeat would be apart of Mgnn storyline coming to an end. It just might be this season considering how much focus He and Mars has had this season.
    It's been almost 4 seasons, clearly there's an option other than "villain always wins and everything the heroes do is meaningless" and "villain is defeated in one attack." I'm just hoping for villains closer to the middle than either extreme

  15. #7050
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thezmage View Post
    It's been almost 4 seasons, clearly there's an option other than "villain always wins and everything the heroes do is meaningless" and "villain is defeated in one attack." I'm just hoping for villains closer to the middle than either extreme
    4 season and in universe 10 year fighting a villain who’s been planning for over a 1000 years. Again if you think the lives they save are meaningless becuase they didn’t topple vandal I don’t think the superhero genre is for you

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