DC Media: TV Shows, Animated Movies and Video Games

[Vordan]

Weisman has that annoying Byrne tendency of trying to tie everything together in a way that’s dumb (like how Byrne made Sandman and Green Goblin cousins or whatever to explain their hair styles).

[Frontier]

Nabu actually talking with Vandal is alright I guess, wonder if a confrontation between Zatanna and Nabu will happen after this, 'cause the setup they have that allows Zatanna to spend time with Giovanni is hilariously bad, won't let Zatanna wounds heal so soon, and will ensure the League, or at least Zatanna, to not let anyone else wear that helmet lol.

Zatanna seemed kind of resistant when she said they needed more help, so I think that's because she realizes they need Fate even though she'd rather not call on him.

Weisman has that annoying Byrne tendency of trying to tie everything together in a way that’s dumb (like how Byrne made Sandman and Green Goblin cousins or whatever to explain their hair styles).

Sometimes it works like when OsCorp is responsible for giving most of Spider-Man's Rogues Gallery their powers, but sometimes it just seems like _____ is behind everything .

[Lukmendes]

Weisman has that annoying Byrne tendency of trying to tie everything together in a way that’s dumb

Reminds me that unrelated characters with the "Harper" last name became connected in YJ, or how Red Tornado's "John Smith" name likely came from J'onn, and he wanted Conner to be a John too (And the way J'onn sounded excited about Conner being another John was just adorable lol),

(like how Byrne made Sandman and Green Goblin cousins or whatever to explain their hair styles).

Fuck, I had forgotten about this lol.

Didn't even know Byrne was known for making too many connections, thought the Norman/Sandman case was just a weird gimmick he tried.

That also reminds me how Ultimate pushed too far in how one character is the origin of a lot of things, like, the OZ formula that game Spidey his powers being an attempt to recreate the Super Soldier serum? Okay, makes sense, Hulk being that too? Pushing it, but can happen, but the entire fucking mutant race being another-nother attempt at re-creating the Super Soldier serum, with the exceptions of Wolverine and Apocalypse (Though Apocalypse was likely a plot hole lol)? Fuck off...

I guess Vandal is like Ultimate Cap in this sense .

Zatanna seemed kind of resistant when she said they needed more help, so I think that's because she realizes they need Fate even though she'd rather not call on him.

Didn't feel like she was hesitating, but, yeah, with how this world barely established magic users, the only option to end in a cliffhanger is Nabu, unless they throw a curveball and call Mera, but I really don't see that happening, specially after the scene where Vandal talks with Nabu.

Sometimes it works like when OsCorp is responsible for giving most of Spider-Man's Rogues Gallery their powers, but sometimes it just seems like _____ is behind everything .

It needs to be balanced, silver age was too silly with how characters got their powers, having a common source can help to make it less random, but if we get just one group behind everything it pushes too much lol.

Norman in Spectacular, while had Weisman involved, avoided going too far, we have villains are around either because of the experiments he funded (Sandman, Rhino, Molten Man), or people he fucked over (Otto, Vulture), or tech he helped steal (Shocker, and to a certain extent, Ricochet and Ox, though he wasn't involved with Ricochet's and Ox's tech being stole), but we still have unrelated villains, like stuff from space (Venom, Captain Jupiter), or from Earth but have no involvement with him (Chameleon, Electro, Lizard, Kraven, Mysterio, Tinkerer, Black Cat), or are from other groups (Tombstone and Hammerhead, Silvermane and Silver Sable).

Honestly the silliest fucking things from Spectacular were Kraven and Silver Sable, Kraven with animal related power-ups to give him a similar origin to Lizard's is meh, and Silver Sable being connected with Silvermane at all is just silly, and I'm sure the only reason that was done was because of the silver hair.

At the very least, YJ avoided having a "villains have a common source", which's surprising, considering how The Light creates distractions by using other super villains, it's never even been suggested they were behind super villain creations besides random experiments at Cadmus (And we only got Blockbuster and Match from this, and they're both minor villains), though, Weisman overcompensated by having Vandal being connected to too much shit... Maybe we'll learn that once he got drunk, had sex with a gorilla and that's the origin of Gorilla city or somethin' .

[John Venus]

Might as well cross post here with some additional thoughts:


YJ S4 Ep 10 Review

-Welp, so much for Zatanna getting a 5 episode arc as opposed to 4. She was barely in this one.

-"Dude, why are you explaining stuff that I already know about, are you actually explaining it to someone else? And why are you referring to yourself in third person?"

"Shut up son and keep listening."

-So Vandal Savage is the grandfather of Arion and is responsible for Atlantis. Dang, at this rate we are going to find out he convinced Jor-El to send Kal to earth, founded Gotham to murder the Waynes, fathered the Amazons and convinced Hippolyta to have a baby.

-Etrigan's appearance was superflous in this episode. Maybe he will do more in the next ep but I think his appearance in this episode would have been better off at the end. I would have rather had Zee try to fight Klarion and the Child and fail.

-Zee's lines in this ep are basically 'what the fuck are you doing here' and a double entendre about Dick Grayson. She deserves better.

-If a certain chain smoking magician from Liverpool shows up and saves the day, I will stop watching then and there.

-I found the parts with M'gann to be the most parts of the ep. Wonder what's up with that bus though.

[DABellWrites]

I don't think it's really the powers that make Supermn, Flash, et al not well suited for games so much as the lack of a skill tree. You can just have Batman get shipments of new equipment over the course of a game, but you can't have Superman suddenly develop heat vision

You can just twist up the canon for the games. I'm sure most players won't care if it makes sense in-game.

[Thezmage]

Weisman has that annoying Byrne tendency of trying to tie everything together in a way that’s dumb (like how Byrne made Sandman and Green Goblin cousins or whatever to explain their hair styles).

That was always my least favorite thing about YJ: the need to make everything feel “logical” and/or consistent just made things less interesting and the world feel small

[Primal Slayer]

Weisman has that annoying Byrne tendency of trying to tie everything together in a way that’s dumb (like how Byrne made Sandman and Green Goblin cousins or whatever to explain their hair styles).

Agreed. While I like most of the streamlining Weisman does....this was a bit of a miss for me. I'm just glad that the Amazons were created from the Gods so we dont have to worry about Vandal being related to them in any way.

[Lukmendes]

Might as well cross post here with some additional thoughts:


YJ S4 Ep 10 Review

-Welp, so much for Zatanna getting a 5 episode arc as opposed to 4. She was barely in this one.

Yeah these episodes are more about Klarion and Vandal, with Zatanna and the others just being good guys for the sake of having good guys around.

-"Dude, why are you explaining stuff that I already know about, are you actually explaining it to someone else? And why are you referring to yourself in third person?"

"Shut up son and keep listening."

That seems to be a theme with these last episodes, 'cause episode 9 had Phantom Stranger telling Savage's story to, Savage...

At least that one kinda has an excuse with Phantom Stranger basically telling Vandal in a long, convoluted way to go talk with Nabu, but this? No need for Vandal to do that with Nabu, he's not Phantom Stranger lol.

Wonder how the next episode will tell us a nonsensical info dump with slideshow flashbacks .

-So Vandal Savage is the grandfather of Arion and is responsible for Atlantis. Dang, at this rate we are going to find out he convinced Jor-El to send Kal to earth, founded Gotham to murder the Waynes, fathered the Amazons and convinced Hippolyta to have a baby.

Dude... Talking about Greek stuff reminds me that Vandal is called the first hero in Season 3 episode 7's summary, and he's called that in the episode itself by Cassandra Savage ("Father, you will be always Earth's first, last, and greatest hero."), you know who else is called the first hero? Hercules...

Yes, I'm saying that YJ may end up making Vandal into Hercules, meaning he would be the reason why the Amazons isolated themselves lol.

I usually say shit like this as a joke, but after this episode? I wouldn't be surprised if it happens for real with the silly connections Vandal is getting with everything.

-Etrigan's appearance was superflous in this episode. Maybe he will do more in the next ep but I think his appearance in this episode would have been better off at the end. I would have rather had Zee try to fight Klarion and the Child and fail.

Look, do you really want the slideshow flashbacks to be even longer? .

-Zee's lines in this ep are basically 'what the fuck are you doing here' and a double entendre about Dick Grayson. She deserves better.

Maybe being part of the League is finally starting to nerf her, considering how immediate Kaldur'ahm's nerf was, she had a good run lol.

-If a certain chain smoking magician from Liverpool shows up and saves the day, I will stop watching then and there.

With Etrigan being the guy Phantom Stranger decided to call, I doubt that, specially since Fate is gonna show up later, but who knows...

-I found the parts with M'gann to be the most parts of the ep. Wonder what's up with that bus though.

I know that bus is from the previous episode, the one Zatanna and the rest almost crashed into, but how the hell it ended in space (Or at least a representation of it) is anyone's guess.

It could be some magic fuckery that happened because of Klarion's battle with child, or maybe the Martians' telepathy detecting them somehow, but either one raises more questions than answers lol.

That was always my least favorite thing about YJ: the need to make everything feel “logical” and/or consistent just made things less interesting and the world feel small

Yeah, while I understand the appeal of making connections with stuff that weren't connected before for the sake of making it simpler, going too far, like you said, makes the world feel small.

Agreed. While I like most of the streamlining Weisman does....this was a bit of a miss for me. I'm just glad that the Amazons were created from the Gods so we dont have to worry about Vandal being related to them in any way.

Do we even know if that's the case? Amazons are only vaguely talked about, and I only know that Cassie is Zeus' daughter 'cause some profile said it, did another profile confirm this?

Anyways, Vandal can still be related to them even if that's the case, what if it turns out that once upon a time, Vandal's name was Kronos, meaning he's Zeus' daddy? Or maybe he's even Zeus himself .

[Frontier]

Reminds me that unrelated characters with the "Harper" last name became connected in YJ, or how Red Tornado's "John Smith" name likely came from J'onn, and he wanted Conner to be a John too (And the way J'onn sounded excited about Conner being another John was just adorable lol),

The Harper family are all clones! Y'know, I like it, but it's a really weird take on Roy Harper in hindsight.

Didn't feel like she was hesitating, but, yeah, with how this world barely established magic users, the only option to end in a cliffhanger is Nabu, unless they throw a curveball and call Mera, but I really don't see that happening, specially after the scene where Vandal talks with Nabu.

I guess more resigned because of her complicated relationship with Fate.

Maybe Zee should call on Tempest, he's like the Atlantean sorcerer prodigy. Give Garth some love (which is why I know it won't happen).

Honestly the silliest fucking things from Spectacular were Kraven and Silver Sable, Kraven with animal related power-ups to give him a similar origin to Lizard's is meh, and Silver Sable being connected with Silvermane at all is just silly, and I'm sure the only reason that was done was because of the silver hair.

It totally makes sense that a foreign mercenary with platinum blonde hair would actually be a mafia princess to a crime boss just because they have silver in their names and white hair! Even though Silvermane's hair is just because he's old.

At the very least, YJ avoided having a "villains have a common source", which's surprising, considering how The Light creates distractions by using other super villains, it's never even been suggested they were behind super villain creations besides random experiments at Cadmus (And we only got Blockbuster and Match from this, and they're both minor villains), though, Weisman overcompensated by having Vandal being connected to too much shit... Maybe we'll learn that once he got drunk, had sex with a gorilla and that's the origin of Gorilla city or somethin' .

I wonder if you could fit into two hands the number of times a villain plot had nothing to do with the Light.

Yeah these episodes are more about Klarion and Vandal, with Zatanna and the others just being good guys for the sake of having good guys around.

And poor Traci 13 was introduced before Khalid and Mary but is still barely doing anything.

Wonder how the next episode will tell us a nonsensical info dump with slideshow flashbacks .

Oh god, you just made me realize these are more slideshows!

With Etrigan being the guy Phantom Stranger decided to call, I doubt that, specially since Fate is gonna show up later, but who knows...

Yeah, with Etrigan and Fate I don't see what Constantine could add to it other than sarcasm. Maybe if they could rope in the Spectre...

I know that bus is from the previous episode, the one Zatanna and the rest almost crashed into, but how the hell it ended in space (Or at least a representation of it) is anyone's guess.

It could be some magic fuckery that happened because of Klarion's battle with child, or maybe the Martians' telepathy detecting them somehow, but either one raises more questions than answers lol.

And how have those kids not aged since season 1?

[Primal Slayer]

Do we even know if that's the case? Amazons are only vaguely talked about, and I only know that Cassie is Zeus' daughter 'cause some profile said it, did another profile confirm this?

Anyways, Vandal can still be related to them even if that's the case, what if it turns out that once upon a time, Vandal's name was Kronos, meaning he's Zeus' daddy? Or maybe he's even Zeus himself .

Lol of course not. I'd ask Greg but his "spoilers" replies annoy me. Was it revealed that Cassie was Zeus' daughter in YJ? They ignore the Wonder family so much that idk what versions we are working wtih.

[mathew101281]

That was always my least favorite thing about YJ: the need to make everything feel “logical” and/or consistent just made things less interesting and the world feel small

I see what you're saying, but I also kind of disagree. Sometimes connecting things that seem like they would go together actually makes things more interesting. I've always felt that the DCU could do with more intercharacter connectivity. For example, shouldn't the Aquaman and Wonderwoman corners of the DCU crossover more than they do? They are both built around royalty from protoGreek societies, that are hidden away in modern times. Another example, isn't it weird that the cosmic forces behind the Lantern rings, and the cosmic forces behind the Green, and the Red in Swamp Thing are both color-coded? Why is that? I'm not saying everything should be connected but it makes for interesting character interactions if a lot of them are. For example, in Greek Myth, Hippolyta is a daughter of Ares, and in some versions of the DCU The Atlantian royal family is descendants of Poseidon. That would make Diana and Aquaman distant cousins.

Sometimes having limitation gives a thing more story potential, sometimes being to vague can actually hurt a work of fiction.

[Lukmendes]

The Harper family are all clones! Y'know, I like it, but it's a really weird take on Roy Harper in hindsight.

Hey now, Kenny girl is there, and she's not one of Roy's clones, at least, I hope she ain't lol.

Maybe Zee should call on Tempest, he's like the Atlantean sorcerer prodigy. Give Garth some love (which is why I know it won't happen).

That and Atlantis overall is pretty ignored, even though Kaldur'ahm is one of the main characters.

Maybe Kaldur'ahm's episode will give some attention to Garth, or someone from Atlantis, hell, perhaps the reveal from those episodes will create some drama there... Too fucking bad Orm is dead.

It totally makes sense that a foreign mercenary with platinum blonde hair would actually be a mafia princess to a crime boss just because they have silver in their names and white hair! Even though Silvermane's hair is just because he's old.

At the very least she kinda keeps the princess thing by having a rich daddy, but uh... Fuck that.

And hey, they both share the "Silver" name too.

I guess it's a good thing Spectacular didn't create other series spin-offs, otherwise Weisman would make Sandman and Juggernaut be related like Byrne did with Sandman and Norman .

I wonder if you could fit into two hands the number of times a villain plot had nothing to do with the Light.

Well, in season 1 I remember Harm and Red Volcano, in season 2 there's that one time Captain Cold tried to steal from a bank and got stopped by heroines who were handing out, also Despero, season 3 had Malefic, and season 4 so far has The Light taking a backseat, it's possible the time traveler who "killed" Conner is unrelated to them, also Malefic once again, and Child actually is getting in The Light's way, and there's also the flashback where Cassandra accidentaly cripples Barbara, though in that case it's Joker acting against The Light.

Kinda surprising how rarely we see villains reacting against The Light.

And poor Traci 13 was introduced before Khalid and Mary but is still barely doing anything.

Man I forgot she was even introduced before lol.

Oh god, you just made me realize these are more slideshows!

At this point I think they're saving the budget for season 5, those flashbacks take so fucking much time.

As much as I think season 3 was mediocre, at least the Vandal episode told everything in one fucking episode, and yeah, we did have annoying slideshows, but it was in one episode, now we have at least two episodes with his past, with, fucking, slideshows... The way this episode concluded though, it seems the flashbacks between Vandal and Klarion are over, but who knows... Maybe they'll really reveal that Vandal fucked some species and basically started Kryptonians at this rate.

Yeah, with Etrigan and Fate I don't see what Constantine could add to it other than sarcasm.

Ain't that the biggest reason why they bring Constantine around anyways? :P

Maybe if they could rope in the Spectre...

Right, he was part of JSA from what flashbacks showed, I wonder what his powers were, and if it's more or less like comics, if there was an explanation why he even bothered to be part of JSA, considering he's casually above the likes of pre-crisis Supes.

And how have those kids not aged since season 1?

Man, I didn't even realize that bus was from season 1 episode 5... There must be some mystic fuckery for it to keep showing up again and again... Or it might be related to Conner (Since Conner meets Supes in that episode), in season 3 we did have that weird vision Dick had which had Wally in it, and one post credits scene with Wolf sleeping did have Wally in it...

Lol of course not.

Can you really say this with so much certainty? YJ made Vandal into Nabu's father and the grandfather of the guy who created Atlantis, and two fucking sub-species on top of already being the meta gene's origin, it would be completely ridiculous for him to be connected with Amazons too in any way, but, y'know, look at what they just did, nothing is stopping the Vandal wank if they don't want to lol.

I'd ask Greg but his "spoilers" replies annoy me. Was it revealed that Cassie was Zeus' daughter in YJ? They ignore the Wonder family so much that idk what versions we are working wtih.

It's not mentioned in-universe at any point, but it's mentioned in a few profiles:





Second one is from YJ: Legacy game, I think it shows Tula's death? Though I dunno if the game's canon.

While this season is slower and more character-driven, I doubt Cassie or any Amazon will get much focus, this season seems to be focusing on the older characters, with only Garfield being really an exception, and all he does is look sad so far, if he does get to do more, I still doubt Outsiders will have much to do.

Makes me wonder what would happen with Amazons if they had managed to put Donna in this back in season 1... Then again, she could be like Kaldur'ahm, y'know, most boring personality and least developed character from the original Team, she could end up being even worse than him lol.

I see what you're saying, but I also kind of disagree. Sometimes connecting things that seem like they would go together actually makes things more interesting. I've always felt that the DCU could do with more intercharacter connectivity. For example, shouldn't the Aquaman and Wonderwoman corners of the DCU crossover more than they do? They are both built around royalty from protoGreek societies, that are hidden away in modern times. Another example, isn't it weird that the cosmic forces behind the Lantern rings, and the cosmic forces behind the Green, and the Red in Swamp Thing are both color-coded? Why is that? I'm not saying everything should be connected but it makes for interesting character interactions if a lot of them are. For example, in Greek Myth, Hippolyta is a daughter of Ares, and in some versions of the DCU The Atlantian royal family is descendants of Poseidon. That would make Diana and Aquaman distant cousins.

Sometimes having limitation gives a thing more story potential, sometimes being to vague can actually hurt a work of fiction.

Yeah making more connections is fine, but, the problem is that, instead of connecting more random stuff that have ideas in common (Like magic stuff A being connected with magic stuff B), those last YJ episodes are connecting everything to Vandal, between Meta Gene, Nabu, Homo Magi and Atlantis... It's too much, and I get the feeling we're not done lol.

If we pay attention to more "subtle" details, Season 3 episode 7 also reveals that Ishtar is one of his daughters, and it's very possible they'll give him more "God" kids afterwards, and it'll be really fucking stupid if he gets near Greek gods lol.

[Primal Slayer]

It's not mentioned in-universe at any point, but it's mentioned in a few profiles:





Second one is from YJ: Legacy game, I think it shows Tula's death? Though I dunno if the game's canon.

While this season is slower and more character-driven, I doubt Cassie or any Amazon will get much focus, this season seems to be focusing on the older characters, with only Garfield being really an exception, and all he does is look sad so far, if he does get to do more, I still doubt Outsiders will have much to do.

Makes me wonder what would happen with Amazons if they had managed to put Donna in this back in season 1... Then again, she could be like Kaldur'ahm, y'know, most boring personality and least developed character from the original Team, she could end up being even worse than him lol.

These are the things that annoy me about YJ. Everything about who Cassie is was left off screen and its only available via a profile that they created. I have a feeling if either of them were part of the OG group, they would've used Cassies connection to Ares as part of the story and her "secret". Shame that its 4 seasons in and they have yet to give either any significant focus. Beast Boy and Lagoon Boy were both connected to M'Gann and BB was a big part of S2....maybe by Season 7 when Cassie is in her 20s she'll get a story arc.

[Lukmendes]

These are the things that annoy me about YJ. Everything about who Cassie is was left off screen and its only available via a profile that they created.

Yeah, word of god is a really lazy trope, it's nice that they have the info already written, but, saying it's part of that world and not showing it is kinda whatever.

I have a feeling if either of them were part of the OG group, they would've used Cassies connection to Ares as part of the story and her "secret".

I think they talked like Donna would be the Wonder Girl they'd choose for season 1.

Then again, unless they decided to add more stuff to Donna, she wouldn't be part of that "secret" part... Something like the mirror origin would be pretty meh to be ashamed off when M'Gann is around, and I don't think they'd wanna touch Dark Angel lol.

And if Cassie were to be part of it because of a connection with Ares, which villain would even blackmail her? Luthor and Jade had more personal connections with Conner and Artemis respectively, so that made it easier to for them to blackmail, and Queen Bee just happened to learn about M'Gann's secret thanks to Psimon, I don't see who else could blackmail a supposedly season 1 Cassie, she could always not be part of it, like how Dick, Kaldur'ahm and Wally weren't.

Shame that its 4 seasons in and they have yet to give either any significant focus. Beast Boy and Lagoon Boy were both connected to M'Gann and BB was a big part of S2....

Yeah, Garfield did get good stuff since season 2, and is getting far more development than usual, specially for a character who isn't part of the original Team, maybe you can even say he's the most developed character on the cartoon.

Lagoon Boy sadly is the opposite, he barely did anything beyond being a jealous boyfriend and an annoying asshole, you have to read a fucking tie-in comic to learn about his past, which reveals he suffered racism when in Atlantis, and that can really explain how he ended up with M'Gann, since that's a big thing to relate to, though it doesn't mean it'd create a good relationship, and in this case, it didn't, guy was just a rebound lol.

maybe by Season 7 when Cassie is in her 20s she'll get a story arc.

Also possible she'll still be sidelined and we'll still be focusing on the original Team lol.

Could be worse though, like Donna, the one fight Donna was ever in on-screen, she was knocked out for a few minutes, then punched Lady Shiva once after waking up, and that's it lol.

But hey, maybe at some point the original team will be sidelined enough for other characters to be properly developed and Cassie could be one of 'em, which I kinda hope so, the few times she gets to do something that isn't related to that hilariously bad relationship she had with Tim, she was cool.

[Primal Slayer]

I think if it were Donna then they would've used Dark Angel and changed her origin.

With Cassie, I can easily see them having Ares join The Light and blackmail Cassie. But with how everything dealing with Cassie has been openly revealed outside of the show I dont really think Greg/Brandon are interested in her or the Wonders. Her relationship with Tim happened largely off screen and Greg confirmed on twitter that they broke up even though it was never stated (to my memory) on screen and we all know how he feels about revealing things that havent been on screen or in a game/comic.

Since Donna joined the team "offscreen" inbetween S1/2...I still dont understand why they havent done anything with her since she was technically on the "OG" S1 team, just off screen....