Civil War New Warriors #1-6 TPB Review

[jackolover]

So, this gives us another dimension to the why of the New Warriors were involved with a TV reality show. At the end if this trade, Night Thrasher reads the contract he had with Archer Television stating in the event the NW program is cancelled, bankruptcy proceedings are started against Taylor Industries (Night Thrashers company). So it seems imperative for Night Thrasher to push the NW into continuing the reality show, or he'll go broke, and that's why the NW were outside the villains house in CW#1. The NW reality show went into hiatus after the first series pilot, and then restarted as a Mid-season filler series later on. Night Thrasher had to make the series work just to let Taylor Industries survive, and as we saw in the CW outcome, Dwayne Taylor didn't survive, but maybe as a result of the contract, Taylor Industries were paid out on Insurance after his death.

How does that effect Civil War? We know Damage Control set up certain super villains with extra MGS and one of them was Nitro. Nitro had been on the run since New Avengers #1, when Electro caused the escape of 42 villains, so Nitro met up with the Damage Control CEO sometime between NA#1 and CW#1, while the 4 villains in the house in Stamford were still moving around.

It just means the Archer NW reality show coincided with the worst possible scenario by encountering the Stamford villains, at a time when political correctness was rampant against the super human community. A light hearted Zeb Wells story, like the New Warriors, was replaced by a dark, destructive Mark Millar story, that ended with 3 dead NW, and a Speedball that turned into Penance after being brutalised in prison.

[Mighty Roman]

Some very interesting connections. Great review Jackolover. Do you have a picture of the cover to this TPB?

[jackolover]

http://d1466nnw0ex81e.cloudfront.net...00/2526710.jpg

[THANOSRULES]

Personally, one of the worst New Warriors series ever done. Virtually no one acted with any kind of regard for the years of prior characterization, the characters were all zany shells of their former selves. Light hearted be damned, the series depictions violated a lot of hard work on characterization by guys like Fabien Nicenza

I think this is honestly my top five "worst books of all time", especially if you are a true blue NW fan who had any sort of affinity for Vol. 1.

Tacking on "Civil War" to this is a bit of a sales stunt...aside from the connections you mentioned JL...what's funny is Night Thrasher did not even appear as the team leader when they were killed off in NW. This series was met with a lot of angst from NW fans at the time...which in turn led to a salvo of Joe Quesada rips on Speedball and Speedball fans. I always thought fan rejection of this mini was what led marvel to killing the team off in Civil War...not so much the connections you mentioned.

I believe it was also Quesada who put the halt to the Night Thrasher TV show that was in production from CW(or was it UPN?). He was not a fan of the NW, and these series were a manifestation.

The whole (reality show) premise violated the character of Night Thrasher and painted him and the NW as a complete joke. Young's art really exaggerated these points...even though I love Young's art in certain situations...this just made the series even more of a goof.

For a more underrated NW experience, I would suggest the Kevin Grievioux series and what was done with them by Dan Slott and Gage in Avengers: The Initiative. (I would also recommend the Kirkman League of Losers arc in Marvel Team up around this time)

[Jumpoff AKA JohnnyBlazed]

Personally, one of the worst New Warriors series ever done. Virtually no one acted with any kind of regard for the years of prior characterization, the characters were all zany shells of their former selves. Light hearted be damned, the series depictions violated a lot of hard work on characterization by guys like Fabien Nicenza

I think this is honestly my top five "worst books of all time", especially if you are a true blue NW fan who had any sort of affinity for Vol. 1.

Tacking on "Civil War" to this is a bit of a sales stunt...aside from the connections you mentioned JL...what's funny is Night Thrasher did not even appear as the team leader when they were killed off in NW. This series was met with a lot of angst from NW fans at the time...which in turn led to a salvo of Joe Quesada rips on Speedball and Speedball fans. I always thought fan rejection of this mini was what led marvel to killing the team off in Civil War...not so much the connections you mentioned.

I believe it was also Quesada who put the halt to the Night Thrasher TV show that was in production from CW(or was it UPN?). He was not a fan of the NW, and these series were a manifestation.

The whole (reality show) premise violated the character of Night Thrasher and painted him and the NW as a complete joke. Young's art really exaggerated these points...even though I love Young's art in certain situations...this just made the series even more of a goof.

For a more underrated NW experience, I would suggest the Kevin Grievioux series and what was done with them by Dan Slott and Gage in Avengers: The Initiative. (I would also recommend the Kirkman League of Losers arc in Marvel Team up around this time)

All of this, I still remember reading the first issue of civil war thinking " why in the world is Night Thrasher taking orders from speedball??!!!" That made no sense what so-ever. The Warriors weren't rookies or some wet behind the ear super-hero team. Honestly they should have went with the Young Avengers instead (which I still think is a extremely stupid name) Ooh but you brought up some pain for reminding me of that Night Thrasher Tv show, I mean it WAS ALREADY PICKED UP!!!! Quesada!!!

[Mighty Roman]

http://d1466nnw0ex81e.cloudfront.net...00/2526710.jpg

Thanks. That art looks dreadful. Skottie Young's art works for Rocket Raccoon and Marvel Babies, but this looks really weird. I mean, look at Nova on the bottom left (is that Nova?). What is up with his face?

@Thanosrules-As you seem to be quite a big NW fan, what did you think of the Marvel NOW series? I'm interested in it, because Kaine joins the team.

[THANOSRULES]

Thanks. That art looks dreadful. Skottie Young's art works for Rocket Raccoon and Marvel Babies, but this looks really weird. I mean, look at Nova on the bottom left (is that Nova?). What is up with his face?

@Thanosrules-As you seem to be quite a big NW fan, what did you think of the Marvel NOW series? I'm interested in it, because Kaine joins the team.

I liked it, actually really enjoyed it...but at the same time I recognized that it was not the right formula for NW to "make it big" once again. (if they ever were) I loved Kain in it, even Sam Alexander was written decent in the series. Yost wrote some great moments into the series and tried to nip some of the lingering Civil War issues..but I just don't think the stage was big enough to attract the readers, being tied to Inhumans didn't help it much either. The cat and dog characters were ok, but got a little silly.

I'm a huge Night Thrasher fan, so I did want him...but I will always support most NW series.

They got to put the NW back on a big stage and undue Civil War...because until they do...there just a joke to most...except the fans who love them , of course.

Overral, if we get another shot at NW this decade, I'd like to see the core Vol. 1 team be brought back for another go...its time.

[jackolover]

I liked it, actually really enjoyed it...but at the same time I recognized that it was not the right formula for NW to "make it big" once again. (if they ever were) I loved Kain in it, even Sam Alexander was written decent in the series. Yost wrote some great moments into the series and tried to nip some of the lingering Civil War issues..but I just don't think the stage was big enough to attract the readers, being tied to Inhumans didn't help it much either. The cat and dog characters were ok, but got a little silly.

I'm a huge Night Thrasher fan, so I did want him...but I will always support most NW series.

They got to put the NW back on a big stage and undue Civil War...because until they do...there just a joke to most...except the fans who love them , of course.

Overral, if we get another shot at NW this decade, I'd like to see the core Vol. 1 team be brought back for another go...its time.

Actually I thought the NW's were a joke until I read this trade, and it opened my eyes. Scotties art throws you off by its cartoony style, but the actual baddies they meet and defeat were pretty awesome, to my mind. When the NW's cited how 3rd rate their previous accomplishments were in CW, I thought they may have fought Asbestos Man and a few jay walkers, but this says they did good work. If those Mad Thinker robots thought the Great Lakes Avengers were next, that was even tougher with Squirrel Girl in that team. I was impressed with this NW package of fights.

What you did bring up that was interesting was the fact Night Thrasher wasn't in charge in CW, but Speedball. What could have happened is when the Mid Season episodes began, Dwayne may have had to come clean on the bankruptcy status he was in, and the team voted Speedball in, seeing as Nova had gone to Annihilation by CW. It was a curious change having NT as a grunt and Speedball calling the shots. Now that I think about how the NW's performed in this trade, I think they could have taken that group of villains in the house, in CW#1. It puts a new slant on Iron Man and Cap bad mouthing the NW's in the rubble of Stamford, in CW#1, because I don't think the NW's deserved that from Mark Millar. I thought it was a good TV program, that used a lot of oversight, especially concerning animal harm, and introduced elements that would later be used to treat super heroes the same way the producers used the NW's.

[vitruvian]

So, this gives us another dimension to the why of the New Warriors were involved with a TV reality show. At the end if this trade, Night Thrasher reads the contract he had with Archer Television stating in the event the NW program is cancelled, bankruptcy proceedings are started against Taylor Industries (Night Thrashers company). So it seems imperative for Night Thrasher to push the NW into continuing the reality show, or he'll go broke, and that's why the NW were outside the villains house in CW#1. The NW reality show went into hiatus after the first series pilot, and then restarted as a Mid-season filler series later on. Night Thrasher had to make the series work just to let Taylor Industries survive, and as we saw in the CW outcome, Dwayne Taylor didn't survive, but maybe as a result of the contract, Taylor Industries were paid out on Insurance after his death.

How does that effect Civil War? We know Damage Control set up certain super villains with extra MGS and one of them was Nitro. Nitro had been on the run since New Avengers #1, when Electro caused the escape of 42 villains, so Nitro met up with the Damage Control CEO sometime between NA#1 and CW#1, while the 4 villains in the house in Stamford were still moving around.

It just means the Archer NW reality show coincided with the worst possible scenario by encountering the Stamford villains, at a time when political correctness was rampant against the super human community. A light hearted Zeb Wells story, like the New Warriors, was replaced by a dark, destructive Mark Millar story, that ended with 3 dead NW, and a Speedball that turned into Penance after being brutalised in prison.

I don't know that it really changes that much. Don't forget, reality show TV cameras rolling or not, the first issue of Civil War itself makes clear that the New Warriors were called in to deal with these villains by the Stamford police department. That is to say, they were there not only with the authorization, but at the behest, of the local authorities.

So, while all the same old debates could be had about whether the New Warriors used sound tactics or not in tackling the villains, or how much of the blame goes to Declun at Damage Control for powering up Nitro (i.e., would Namorita have still been reckless if he'd been at his usual level), and so on, I'm not sure that the reality show still going plays into it much, except for the fact that the disaster got caught on camera. That is, unless you think the producers of the show were meddling in their operations so much that they made Speedball the leader and caused them to use bad, unsafe tactics... but that seems a step beyond what Dwayne would have gone along with even in order to save his company.

[vitruvian]

Actually I thought the NW's were a joke until I read this trade, and it opened my eyes. Scotties art throws you off by its cartoony style, but the actual baddies they meet and defeat were pretty awesome, to my mind. When the NW's cited how 3rd rate their previous accomplishments were in CW, I thought they may have fought Asbestos Man and a few jay walkers, but this says they did good work. If those Mad Thinker robots thought the Great Lakes Avengers were next, that was even tougher with Squirrel Girl in that team. I was impressed with this NW package of fights.

So, I'm guessing that means you've never read any New Warriors from before this volume? I mean, in their very first appearance ever, they took on the Juggernaut with some success, and went on to have folks like the Sphinx as recurring foes. They were in no way amateurs or 3rd rate, at least not the long-term members.

[THANOSRULES]

Vol. 1 had major threats.....Sphinx a few times, Mad Thinkerer, Terrax, Dire Wraiths and Volx..

I loved the Folding Circle and Wellspring stuff...I mean Smiling Tiger? Tai? Bengal? Midnight's Fire? Why isn't marvel, who seems obsessed with Kung Fu, using this stuff?



Psionex was great. Especially Math maniac and Asylum...I really loved a lot of the lower rate villians that popped up as well too...Cardinal/ Harrier, Star Thief, The hellions.. even though these were lesser villains, Fabnic wrote them as competent and viable threats.

Grievioux series had some fantastic villians as well...though it wasn't really New Warriors team per say. His Zodiac was awesome, Machinsmith is no slouch and then you had Evil Dwayne Taylor Iron Man.

The storyline of Taylor becoming an evil Iron Man was one of the most thoughtful NW stories ever told IMO.

[THANOSRULES]

So, I'm guessing that means you've never read any New Warriors from before this volume? I mean, in their very first appearance ever, they took on the Juggernaut with some success, and went on to have folks like the Sphinx as recurring foes. They were in no way amateurs or 3rd rate, at least not the long-term members.

Yeah my core problem was the notion they would fight crime for a reality show just violated the years of continuity showing them as really dedicated and growing heroes. Its a serious loss of credibility and morality that was character assassination of the highest order. I mean they weren't some gimmick among themselves. That and the dialogue patterns and behavior were just way off.

[jackolover]

So, I'm guessing that means you've never read any New Warriors from before this volume? I mean, in their very first appearance ever, they took on the Juggernaut with some success, and went on to have folks like the Sphinx as recurring foes. They were in no way amateurs or 3rd rate, at least not the long-term members.

You're right, I hadn't read any New Warriors books before, so to hear they faced Juggernaut just bolsters my opinion of them further, and makes me question why Iron Man and Cap thought so little of their fighting tactics. That doesn't add up to me.

[jackolover]

Yeah my core problem was the notion they would fight crime for a reality show just violated the years of continuity showing them as really dedicated and growing heroes. Its a serious loss of credibility and morality that was character assassination of the highest order. I mean they weren't some gimmick among themselves. That and the dialogue patterns and behavior were just way off.

I just put it down to Dwayne Taylor making the NW's vulnerable because his leadership forced them into this contract with a TV producer, because of his bankruptcy issues, and him keeping it secret, like he always does. That's what the NW's problem was, to me. They never confronted Dwayne about his secrecy and just let it slide. In Grevioux's run, Dwaynes brother was just as secretive to an annoying extent. In no other group were the members manipulated by keeping things from its members, except the NW's. If the NW's refused to partake in any activity until Dwayne confessed why he is doing things, they wouldn't have gone ahead with the TV deal. They were led along by the nose, and they shouldn't have got themselves in that position. If they refused, maybe Night Thrasher wouldn't be dead now. But maybe someone else would have died facing down Nitro in some suburb.

The curiosity is why Taylor Industries were facing bankruptcy. Is there a story behind that, and this is how someone manipulated Dwayne into that restrictive TV contract?

[THANOSRULES]

I just put it down to Dwayne Taylor making the NW's vulnerable because his leadership forced them into this contract with a TV producer, because of his bankruptcy issues, and him keeping it secret, like he always does. That's what the NW's problem was, to me. They never confronted Dwayne about his secrecy and just let it slide. In Grevioux's run, Dwaynes brother was just as secretive to an annoying extent. In no other group were the members manipulated by keeping things from its members, except the NW's. If the NW's refused to partake in any activity until Dwayne confessed why he is doing things, they wouldn't have gone ahead with the TV deal. They were led along by the nose, and they shouldn't have got themselves in that position. If they refused, maybe Night Thrasher wouldn't be dead now. But maybe someone else would have died facing down Nitro in some suburb.

The curiosity is why Taylor Industries were facing bankruptcy. Is there a story behind that, and this is how someone manipulated Dwayne into that restrictive TV contract?

Jack I don't remember the deal with Taylor industries..by the time Bandit/ Night Thrasher two took over they seemed to be rebounded.

The whole thing with Dwayne is in the books now...there were ways they could have undone it, but nobody seems to care and/or marvel doesn't want to let them care. Personally, thanks to Grievioux and Gage I became a very big fan of Donyell Taylor as well. He really had some nice motivations and I wanted more of his stories.

I agree Dwayne was very morally ambiguous...it was a core fundamental of his character..and we got that right away when he dropped Rich right off the roof to test his powers! But I don;t think he would ever embrace the scrutiny or hokiness of a reality TV show. He was a guy who did stuff in the shadows, who embraced secrets...despite we always had the feeling he was good and deeply cared about his teammates..he usually showed up in the end and came through...and this was fundamental to who he was.