New Avengers #29 - Spoilers

[NeutralShade62]

Doom led Ben Grimm's Fantastic Four into the universe of the Beyonders back in FF#318-319 to find him so that Doom could get back his memories from being a part of a time loop that the Beyonder created when Doom was brought to Battleworld. So I assume The Beyonder has always been part of one of the Beyonders.

It was only during the second time we heard/read anything with the beyonders that they tried to tie in the original omni-beyonder (or was it the cube retconned version after the retcon? either way they tried to tie in the original or retconned beyonder) with the beyonder's race which took place already after his initial retcon, so originally he was never a race or part of one. The new battleworld just seems to be using the tie in idea and are running with that version instead of the original omni-beyonder one.

It's still to early to really tell but so far that's what it seems like.

[XPac]

It was only during the second time we heard/read anything with the beyonders that they tried to tie in the original omni-beyonder (or was it the cube retconned version after the retcon? either way they tried to tie in the original or retconned beyonder) with the beyonder's race which took place already after his initial retcon. The new battleworld just seems to be using the tie in idea and are running with that version instead of the original omni-beyonder one. It's still to early to really tell but so far that's what it seems like.

Though it conflicts with what Hickman said earlier, perhaps the Destroy is the Omni-Beyonder feuding with the Beyonders race. Retconing the Omni-Beyonder back somehow (and that would be a super confusing mess given the layer upon layer upon layer of retcon we've gotten since then) would go a long ways towards tying the present Secret Wars with the original one.

[markallenchi]

Doom led Ben Grimm's Fantastic Four into the universe of the Beyonders back in FF#318-319 to find him so that Doom could get back his memories from being a part of a time loop that the Beyonder created when Doom was brought to Battleworld. So I assume The Beyonder has always been part of one of the Beyonders.

In that story, I thought we found out that the Beyonder wasn't what he thought he was, he was just part of the cosmic cube and him and MM merged at the end. The Beyonder from the first SW was just energy released from the Beyonder world. At least that's what I gathered.

[NeutralShade62]

Though it conflicts with what Hickman said earlier, perhaps the Destroy is the Omni-Beyonder feuding with the Beyonders race. Retconing the Omni-Beyonder back somehow (and that would be a super confusing mess given the layer upon layer upon layer of retcon we've gotten since then) would go a long ways towards tying the present Secret Wars with the original one.

Well the destroyer is supposed to be a new character so i highly doubt it.

Plus omni-beyonder is literally the toaa (supreme being) of another whole foreign multiverse/megaverse's/omniverse and/or whatever else term you want to use for the verse. Kind of like another supreme being would enter another serie's verse (like if toaa hopped into the dragonball verse, beyonder did that and hopped into the marvelverse...atleast that was the idea originally, even though we practically know next to nothing about the beyond realm which is where beyonder comes from except for a few sentences and word's that were written on panel and interview's).

[XPac]

Well the destroyer is supposed to be a new character so i highly doubt it.

Plus omni-beyonder is literally the toaa of another whole foreign multiverse/megaverse's/omniverse and/or whatever else term you want to use for the verse. Kind of like another supreme being would enter another serie's verse (like if toaa hopped into the dragonball verse, beyonder did that and hopped into the marvelverse...atleast that was the idea originally).

Something cumberstomped the Living Tribunal... the being what was the top of the food chain in the entire multivese short of the Supreme Being. So it would almost take another Supreme being (if it even makes sense to have more than one) to pull that off.

[XPac]

In that story, I thought we found out that the Beyonder wasn't what he thought he was, he was just part of the cosmic cube and him and MM merged at the end. The Beyonder from the first SW was just energy released from the Beyonder world. At least that's what I gathered.

Course, that retcon never really made sense given that the Beyonder was able to cumberstomp every high end being in the universe, including Death. I think it was retconned that the other cosmics just played along or whatever, but retconning the Beyonder to a Cube was always ridiculous. They should have just left him dead.

[SKJoker]

Clint and Steve both needed a single, open-hand slap and a stern look this issue lol.

[SickAlice]

I totally had to hit up the wiki's for this one. A lot of these concepts were before my time.

[DrTraveler]

I'd like Shuma-Gorath and its kin to be the great destroyer.
Would be nice if they'd take some ideas from the Cthulhu Mythos.

Read DnA's cosmic run. Near the end with Realm of Kings and Thanos Imperative it was all about the Cthulhu.

[DrTraveler]

pretty much.

ultimate universe and 616 is gonna collide on the last page with "to be contined in Secret Wars" on the next.

I'm not. I'm expecting this will resolve to some extent. I'm expecting we will see the incursion happen and the formation of Battleworld in the final pages. I'm calling this now: Either the last words of Hickman's Avengers or Secret War will be "Everything Lives". Hickman likes arc words and phrases like that too much not to do that.

[Mahes]

I'm not. I'm expecting this will resolve to some extent. I'm expecting we will see the incursion happen and the formation of Battleworld in the final pages. I'm calling this now: Either the last words of Hickman's Avengers or Secret War will be "Everything Lives". Hickman likes arc words and phrases like that too much not to do that.

Yep that's how I see it ending, at least Avengers/New Avengers. We'll have the final incursion happening, Steve and Tony having it out, and then Battleworld formed as a stopgap with a "To be continued in Secret Wars" type message at the end.

[Godlike13]

Ooh, Pym. Its been too long.

[AcesX1X]

Clint and Steve both needed a single, open-hand slap and a stern look this issue lol.

and what exactly did clint do to deserve this slap?

[Mooper Films]

and what exactly did clint do to deserve this slap?

Future Hawkeye said to take Tony out and that would stop things and Steve was so focused on bringing the Illuminati instead of going: "Something is doing this, let's work together and solve this. Of course the Illuminati see that maybe they should have also tried that too but now they've exhausted their egos with all these plans and Reed finally got it to where everyone can listen and talk but now it maybe too late. OF course we've seen, that Tony is going to do something very, very stupid so old Hawkeye might not have been out of his bounds after all.

[SKJoker]

and what exactly did clint do to deserve this slap?

Asking what they've been doing. Same as Steve, when they know they've been hunting them.