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  1. #181
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    They wanted diversity so they replace a beloved character with a caricature black kid who does graffiti and doesn't have a father in his life. Real smooth. Maybe next time just make a completely new character and avoid some obvious stereotypes.

  2. #182
    Always Rakzo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trevel8182 View Post
    There's a sizable difference between being a smart ass and being sarcastic.
    Again, that's how he started and later became less of a smart-ass but kept his sarcastic side.

    They say this is the umpteenth time he's been arrested so street thug. Just because a parental figure says something about you it doesn't mean its true. Who sprays a flash sucks sign in broad daylight next to the police station in Central City, an idiot does that.
    When do they say that he was arrested for the "umpteenth time"? I don't remember that part.

    And yes, since we don't know almost anything about this Wally we can only assume that what Iris says is true.

    And he'll be dead in 5
    Assuming that you mean "5 Years Later", I'm sure that's a future that will be prevented considering the words from the authors.

  3. #183
    It sucks to be right BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakzo View Post
    Most characters have re-started from scratch (Superman, Green Arrow, Batgirl, etc.), that's what happens in reboots. There's no way that Wally would have been re-introduced the same way he left.
    He could still be introduced in the same relative position to the universe: along Nightwing and Arsenal and so on. Making him 12 is a sizable demotion; he's now at the very bottom at DCU in every single aspect. It is pretty terrible.

    Personality, if he's a thug or not, etc, I don't think any pif us saw enough to really pass judgement, so I won't do it.

    Still, he is 12. And that just sucks.

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by BohemiaDrinker View Post
    He could still be introduced in the same relative position to the universe: along Nightwing and Arsenal and so on. Making him 12 is a sizable demotion; he's now at the very bottom at DCU in every single aspect. It is pretty terrible.

    Personality, if he's a thug or not, etc, I don't think any pif us saw enough to really pass judgement, so I won't do it.

    Still, he is 12. And that just sucks.
    I'm not exactly happy with the de-age thing but I'm thinking about the potential for stories about it.

    I really want to see the Barry/Wally dynamic from the old days from a modern perspective.

  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakzo View Post
    I really want to see the Barry/Wally dynamic from the old days from a modern perspective.
    Any interaction between Barry and Wally following Flash:Rebirth shows a modern perspective. I don't see why that had to be scrapped for the Nu52.
    "In any time, there will always be a need for heroes." - the Time Trapper, Legion of Superheroes #61(1994)

    "What can I say? I guess I outgrew maturity.." - Bob Chipman

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by !Pharozonk! View Post
    Any interaction between Barry and Wally following Flash:Rebirth shows a modern perspective. I don't see why that had to be scrapped for the Nu52.
    We also got that in Young Justice

    Last edited by Neowing; 05-20-2014 at 01:57 PM.

  7. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by !Pharozonk! View Post
    Any interaction between Barry and Wally following Flash:Rebirth shows a modern perspective. I don't see why that had to be scrapped for the Nu52.
    Not really, I'm talking about the one that started in 1959.

  8. #188
    It sucks to be right BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakzo View Post
    I'm not exactly happy with the de-age thing but I'm thinking about the potential for stories about it.
    While killing potential for all the other type of stories. See, I like the larger DC universe; not only character X or character Y, but the bonds and relationships between these characters, including the position they occupy inside the hero community. The original Titans and their generation used to fill a very unique position, with Wally West and Dick Grayson being the two flagships for those guys.

    Minor and major changes of direction aside, Dick still has this. Roy still has this. Hell, F*#!%&g Jason Todd still has this. Though reduced, Wally's generation still exists, and still fills a niche very similar to the one they used to.

    Wally, however, gets relegated to be the youngest character, with the latest debut, in the universe. He's not only bellow Dick Grayson and Roy Harper. He is bellow Tim Drake and Jaime Reyes. He actually made hius debut after Damian had already died.

    It doesn't matter how spot on his personality is, if he's a 12 year old kid completely removed from every major alliance, relationship and possibility he used to have. This makes a completely new character just out of context, and a lame character by contrast.


    I really want to see the Barry/Wally dynamic from the old days from a modern perspective.
    So do I, but that's why Flashbacks and books like Secret Origins exist; so you can tell a story set in the past - where tween Wally should be.

    Wally's current age serves no other purpose than making the character "non menacing" to Barry Allen, as if this was needed.

  9. #189
    Nostalgia Fanwanker Pharozonk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakzo View Post
    Not really, I'm talking about the one that started in 1959.
    Then would you go about showing it from a new perspective? I don't think the relationship really needed to be updated in the first place.
    "In any time, there will always be a need for heroes." - the Time Trapper, Legion of Superheroes #61(1994)

    "What can I say? I guess I outgrew maturity.." - Bob Chipman

  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by !Pharozonk! View Post
    Then would you go about showing it from a new perspective? I don't think the relationship really needed to be updated in the first place.
    Why not? The old stories are pretty dated at this point and I think it would be interesting to see a better developed relationship.

  11. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakzo View Post
    Why not? The old stories are pretty dated at this point and I think it would be interesting to see a better developed relationship.
    I'm not talking about in the context of the Silver Age Flash stories. Even in the post-Flash:Rebirth stories, you could clearly see a mutual respect and friendship between Barry and Wally. What better update is there to that? Reverting back to making Wally a little kid is a regression rather than progression.
    "In any time, there will always be a need for heroes." - the Time Trapper, Legion of Superheroes #61(1994)

    "What can I say? I guess I outgrew maturity.." - Bob Chipman

  12. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by LosrCompany View Post
    They wanted diversity so they replace a beloved character with a caricature black kid who does graffiti and doesn't have a father in his life. Real smooth. Maybe next time just make a completely new character and avoid some obvious stereotypes.
    That would entail showing creativity. Something the New 52 completely lacks.

  13. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakzo View Post
    Why not? The old stories are pretty dated at this point and I think it would be interesting to see a better developed relationship.
    The development of their relationship was very well done, your argument makes no sense.

  14. #194
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    I don't suppose there is a brilliant red headed young man called Wally West running around in Earth 2 is there? Right now that seems to be the only hope we could have of ever seeing him again.

  15. #195
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    The Flash in the New 52 has been one of my favorite books. But I just finished reading Venditti & Jensen's first issue as well as their annual. Rubbish. Dropping this book.

    I don't mind a black Flash. I love when they create new characters.

    But Wally West isn't black. This is nothing but a gimmick.

    It isn't just the black Wally West, but the writing isn't my cup of tea, nor is the duos work on the GL books. So I'm saving myself a couple bucks, and I hope that one day the real Wally West shows up in a better written Flash book.

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