2015 NFL Off-Season Discussion Thread

[BeastieRunner]

Four games seems fair to me. It says "We know you did it. You know we know you did it. We just can't prove you did it." Had the league had better proof, I'm sure Brady would have gotten a stiffer penalty.

Another question: Gostkowski failed to turn over his phone as well. Why is he not suspended? If the beef is largely over failure to cooperate and they're trying to send that message, suspend the kicker too.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Four games seems fair to me. It says "We know you did it. You know we know you did it. We just can't prove you did it." Had the league had better proof, I'm sure Brady would have gotten a stiffer penalty.

That was what I took out of that deal as well. The implication of chicanery was evident, but the league couldn't nail the Pats to the wall because the evidence wasn't solid. I suspect Brady will appeal because that's part of the process, whether or not his punishment gets reduced is anybody's guess.

[CSTowle]

Figured on 6-8 games, appealed down to 4. Didn't figure on them going after the organization with the picks, guess Goodell's going to be sticking to hanging out in the Ravens booth instead of visiting the Pats for the next 10-20 years Kraft has left. Still wondering why Brady didn't hand over his phone. I wonder if it was concern of damning evidence, or if he has future political aspirations and didn't want more interesting facts leaked (they say they can keep it safe, but in this day and age what are the chances they actually could have?).

[Detox]

The punishment was too severe generally speaking. Compare to what the Falcons got after admitting to pumping in fake crowd noise, or the stick-um towels in San Diego. No integrity of the game issues there? However, with the spygate history I can understand cracking down harder on the Pats and Brady. I don't have any problem with punishments being cumulative, and I believe this is more about spygate than slightly deflated footballs.

[Ghost Rider TheHellfireDemon]

Not shocked the hammer came down On the golden boy Brady. It's a great day to see justice served and I don't doubt people bitter as they imagined roger would not come down on get golden boy.

[Hiromi]

the fact that the Falcons admitted their wrong doing is one of the major reasons why their punishment was lighter, the statement from the league specifically targeted the lack of cooperation by Brady and the Pats prior history as the reason for the severity.

[Detox]

Not shocked the hammer came down On the golden boy Brady. It's a great day to see justice served and I don't doubt people bitter as they imagined roger would not come down on get golden boy.

You forgot to call him golden boy.

[Ghost Rider TheHellfireDemon]

The punishment was too severe generally speaking. Compare to what the Falcons got after admitting to pumping in fake crowd noise, or the stick-um towels in San Diego. No integrity of the game issues there? However, with the spygate history I can understand cracking down harder on the Pats and Brady. I don't have any problem with punishments being cumulative, and I believe this is more about spygate than slightly deflated footballs.

It's more about the nfl sending a big screw you to the patriots. They decided to keep playing with fire and got seriously burned.
Very lucky it wasn't indisputable if it was I imagine Brady could have got half a season.

Brady wanted to hard ball in doing so he pushed a tiger and got dashed. Had Brady cooperated I imagine it would gave him some favorable ground instead his screw you resulted in the nfl bringing down a hailstorm on the patriots and Brady showing it don't matter if your the golden boy he ain't above the rules.

[Ghost Rider TheHellfireDemon]

You forgot to call him golden boy.

Really unless my eyes mislead me I called Brady the Golden boy.
Oh never mind you meant Golden boy as in only that and no Brady after boy.


Bringing up the vilma situation by Michael and Tony is laughable when compared to this as last I checked vilma wasn't on a repeat offender team. Brady refused to cooperate on top of that the evidence while circumstantial will be hard to overcome.
Last I remember it was suggested vilma was a sergeant but that didn't have circumstantial evidence.

[Detox]

It's more about the nfl sending a big screw you to the patriots. They decided to keep playing with fire and got seriously burned.
Very lucky it wasn't indisputable if it was I imagine Brady could have got half a season.

Brady wanted to hard ball in doing so he pushed a tiger and got dashed. Had Brady cooperated I imagine it would gave him some favorable ground instead his screw you resulted in the nfl bringing down a hailstorm on the patriots and Brady showing it don't matter if your the golden boy he ain't above the rules.

I understand the Spygate aspect of it, in fact that's exactly what I said. I have an issue with the subjectivity of who's cooperative enough, and liar liar pants on fire(especially when you have no actual proof)coming into play with regards to punishments in the NFL. Remember people talking about AP's punishment being worse because he wasn't "remorseful" enough? IMO, that shouldn't matter a damn bit to the league. So the Falcons admitted they cheated, so what? They got caught red handed. A rule broken is a rule broken.
It should just be this infraction equals this punishment, nothing more. This dude is all over the map with how he handles issues throughout the league.

[Hiromi]

People who cooperate with an investigation typically get off lighter than people who don't
People who plead Guilty typically get off lighter than people who are found guilty

this is the standard in like every legal system(government or corporate), you want to have incentive for people to not fight you during or draw out an investigation, Hell I see this all the time in the company I work for. Either admit you were wrong and take a lighter punishment from the company, or take your chances with the investigation and a far harsher punishment at the end if they determine you were in the wrong.

[kalorama]

People who cooperate with an investigation typically get off lighter than people who don't
People who plead Guilty typically get off lighter than people who are found guilty

this is the standard in like every legal system(government or corporate), you want to have incentive for people to not fight you during or draw out an investigation, Hell I see this all the time in the company I work for. Either admit you were wrong and take a lighter punishment from the company, or take your chances with the investigation and a far harsher punishment at the end if they determine you were in the wrong.

But that's all dependent on the "prosecutor" actually being able to prove wrongdoing. Did the league really do that in this case? According to the official statement, they concluded that the Patriots "probably" deflated the balls. I hate the Patriots as much as the next guy, but fining somebody a million bucks for something you can only claim they probably did seems like a stretch.

[Hiromi]

Legally speaking they just sent Aaron Hernandez to prison for life with no parole because he "probably" murdered someone, people get convicted on circumstantial evidence all the time. Anyway it'll be up to the arbitrator to decided if it's fair or not. Though that may just be with Brady's suspension, I don't know if the team can actually appeal their punishment since they're in a different place(Brady gets to appeal it because he's a union employee and they've collectively bargained for that right, not sure how Kraft could proceed since he helped elect Goodell)

Edit: Also the standard for internal corporate discipline can be FAR more lax than the criminal legal system.

[Detox]

Roger has already had plenty of people calling for his head based on decisions he's made. He was accused of being too close to Kraft just last week it seems and then he gets challenged by him and annihilates the Patriots. He makes emotional decisions, which can lead to irrational ones. He's just making this all up as he goes along, he SHOULD be striving for uniformity and objectivity when it comes to handling rules infractions. The owners, players association and media are all watching very closely.

[Ghost Rider TheHellfireDemon]

I understand the Spygate aspect of it, in fact that's exactly what I said. I have an issue with the subjectivity of who's cooperative enough, and liar liar pants on fire(especially when you have no actual proof)coming into play with regards to punishments in the NFL. Remember people talking about AP's punishment being worse because he wasn't "remorseful" enough? IMO, that shouldn't matter a damn bit to the league. So the Falcons admitted they cheated, so what? They got caught red handed. A rule broken is a rule broken.
It should just be this infraction equals this punishment, nothing more. This dude is all over the map with how he handles issues throughout the league.

If truly he is innocent seems like logical he would gotten up and said something. He didn't do that, nor did he turn over his phone again if you didn't of anything immoral you don't got something to fear. That could be interpreted as he's trying to hide something or he doesn't want his privacy of his cellphone invaded.

People were watching closely for the fact also roger repeatedly said integrity must be protected. That look like empty words if Roger didn't come down on the patriots.

Kraft really he thinks this is a excessive talk off the damn patriots colored glasses Kraft your star qb got off easy, and that fine is very manageable for a damn nfl team your not a damn small business.
It would be excess if Brady and the entire offensive unit all got fined 1 million dollars.

My gosh I can't help but laugh at ex pats lb now a espn nfl analyst Teddy bruschi being a complete homer to the patriots as he doesn't believe the patriots inflated the balls at all that gave them a competitive advantage believing to be innocent of any wrong doing including Brady disregarding the findings of the wells report.
But I guess like the man that found out his wife cheated on him intentionally it's easy to believe the lie that it didn't happen like it wasn't his wife it was just someone that looked like his wife.