Renew Your Vows Sales Predictions

[Panfoot]

Im confused with RYVs and how it serves Marvels goals for Spidey. On one hand they want us to move on from the marriage so we can care about other relationships for Peter. But then they release a high profile book featuring the marriage which only reignites reader interest in the Watson/Parker marriage. It seems counterproductive and sets them back on having readers move on.


They keep asking fans to not care so they can push other relationships , then ask us to care for RYVs, then say not to care anymore because it was à limited time thing....

It's a really weird and bitter move, like pouring salt in the wound.

[Lasse]

And if they want to have a Peter Parker that has grown, why is not marriage with MJ relatable, but him being a CEO for a global company is? Marvel logic and long term planning never ceases to amaze me. Meanwhile, I'm glad that Slott is still on Amazing Spider-Man, regardless if I read it or not. I don't doubt Slott's passion for Spider-Man and Peter Parker for a second, and if other people enjoy it and buy that comic, it makes me happy even if this vision of Peter Parker doesn't fit with what I personally want to read. I have a feeling that noone at Marvel has the passion for Spidey that Slott does after all.

[Zeitgeist]

So Marvel KNOWS they have a big hit with a married spider-man. But wont produce a book?

Seems like they are deliberately leaving $ on the table then if no book is produced. So either Marvel can make a book they KNOW will be in demand or they are stubborn and will leave the money aside.

But it's not just that spider-man is married by itself that did great numbers for the first issue; it's a perfect storm of many elements which Dan pointed out (and which you just quoted).
The big question is - when the Secret Wars is done, when the hype/novelty/spectacle of a short term return of Peter and MJ being married and the intrigue revisiting a status-quo involved with One More Day dies down, and the book is left in the hands of a decent but not as A-list creative team: is the premise sustainable? Would it do better business month in/out and be more justified thematically than other proposed Spider family books? It's perfectly built for a mini-series, but an actual spin-off book is a whole different deal.

Alot of people would read a Ben book, whether he is Spider-man or Scarlet Spider or Spider-dude.

The reason Ben failed was not because of his character. It was because Marvel INSISTED that the Spidey you read about was not the "real" one. Rather than simply allowing Pete to retire (but check-in from time) and Ben to be Spider-man. Barry and Wally were both Flash. And both are loved. There are thousands of Green lanterns. There are even infinity "spider-characters". The problem was Marvel, not Ben.

The difference is The Flash and Green Lantern have been firmly established in DC as legacy characters, while a common theme with Spider-Man is that even in an crowd of infinite spider-characters, 616 Peter Parker IS the legacy. Because of that Ben Drooly would always be in his shadow, especially as a clone - but to his credit he did do a great Slurpee impersonation.

Im confused with RYVs and how it serves Marvels goals for Spidey. On one hand they want us to move on from the marriage so we can care about other relationships for Peter. But then they release a high profile book featuring the marriage which only reignites reader interest in the Watson/Parker marriage. It seems counterproductive and sets them back on having readers move on.

It's a really weird and bitter move, like pouring salt in the wound.

If people actually did move on, chances are they wouldn't have pursued the story. It's because it is still a hot button topic 8 years later and was guaranteed a lot of curiousity which made it ripe for the picking.
(Gunshot) (gunshot) (gunshot) (cash register)

[CrimsonEchidna]

And if they want to have a Peter Parker that has grown, why is not marriage with MJ relatable, but him being a CEO for a global company is?

The beginning and end of it is they just wanted the Marriage gone. I think someone else mentioned this before, but I don't think any amount of "gotcha" arguments is going to make Marvel change their tune on a Married Peter

[Vortex85]

With SPIDER-GWEN, SPIDER-GIRL, and (yes) even AF #15...
...it wasn't just a case of overwhelming demand,
it was a case of surprising & disproportionate overwhelming demand.
In each case, Marvel was not expecting these books to be major hits-- let alone, blow-the-doors-off major hits.

In the case of RYV...
A Secret Wars tie-in...
A Secret Wars tie-in with Spider-Man...
A Secret Wars tie-in with the long missing marriage reinstated...
A Secret Wars tie-in with art by comic book master, Adam Kubert...
A Secret Wars tie-in written by the regular ASM writer and promising elements that would continue on into the regular book...

Marvel KNEW it was going to be a hit.
Marvel KNEW it was going to do ludicrously well.
So the expectations were set pretty damn high.

That's a pretty big difference.

I knew Tom Brevoort was trolling me when he kept down-playing any demand for a return of the marriage... comparing it to the number of fans who want Spidey with a horsehead.

[Lasse]

The beginning and end of it is they just wanted the Marriage gone. I think someone else mentioned this before, but I don't think any amount of "gotcha" arguments is going to make Marvel change their tune on a Married Peter

I know. I didn't try to make a "gotcha" argument, I'm just saying that sometimes the logic and long term plans of Marvel eludes me. In the rest of that post I also said that I'm glad Dan Slott writes ASM and that I think few are as passionate about the character as him. You can't just use part of a post and use that to twist it to a point that wasn't really there!

[Kevinroc]

With SPIDER-GWEN, SPIDER-GIRL, and (yes) even AF #15...
...it wasn't just a case of overwhelming demand,
it was a case of surprising & disproportionate overwhelming demand.
In each case, Marvel was not expecting these books to be major hits-- let alone, blow-the-doors-off major hits.

In the case of RYV...
A Secret Wars tie-in...
A Secret Wars tie-in with Spider-Man...
A Secret Wars tie-in with the long missing marriage reinstated...
A Secret Wars tie-in with art by comic book master, Adam Kubert...
A Secret Wars tie-in written by the regular ASM writer and promising elements that would continue on into the regular book...

Marvel KNEW it was going to be a hit.
Marvel KNEW it was going to do ludicrously well.
So the expectations were set pretty damn high.

That's a pretty big difference.

This isn't really an answer so much as a "temper your expectations."

(I didn't say it was definitely happening. I only mentioned it as a possibility and told people to treat it as such.)

But, and I think I should mention this "but" right here, you didn't say if it exceeded those high expectations either. Obviously Marvel planned for books like Old Man Logan, A-Force, and Spider-Verse/Web Warriors. And those books did well, and are getting ongoings on the other end of SW.

RYV is bigger than all of them.

[cyberhubbs]

Im confused with RYVs and how it serves Marvels goals for Spidey. On one hand they want us to move on from the marriage so we can care about other relationships for Peter. But then they release a high profile book featuring the marriage which only reignites reader interest in the Watson/Parker marriage. It seems counterproductive and sets them back on having readers move on.


They keep asking fans to not care so they can push other relationships , then ask us to care for RYVs, then say not to care anymore because it was à limited time thing....

Because either out of shipping or plain old curiosity, it still sold a lot of copies for the 1st issue.

[cyberhubbs]

And if they want to have a Peter Parker that has grown, why is not marriage with MJ relatable, but him being a CEO for a global company is? Marvel logic and long term planning never ceases to amaze me. Meanwhile, I'm glad that Slott is still on Amazing Spider-Man, regardless if I read it or not. I don't doubt Slott's passion for Spider-Man and Peter Parker for a second, and if other people enjoy it and buy that comic, it makes me happy even if this vision of Peter Parker doesn't fit with what I personally want to read. I have a feeling that noone at Marvel has the passion for Spidey that Slott does after all.

Because one is long-term and the other doesn't have to be.

Not sure why that's so hard to grasp.

[Scott Taylor]

Limited series versus permanent change in status quo. Thats probably key in Marvel's collective unimind.

[CrimsonEchidna]

I know. I didn't try to make a "gotcha" argument, I'm just saying that sometimes the logic and long term plans of Marvel eludes me. In the rest of that post I also said that I'm glad Dan Slott writes ASM and that I think few are as passionate about the character as him. You can't just use part of a post and use that to twist it to a point that wasn't really there!

I wasn't implying you were being Anti-Slott.

[boots]

Because of that Ben Drooly would always be in his shadow, especially as a clone - but to his credit he did do a great Slurpee impersonation.

actually, he was more like a poor sandcastle.

[jimishim12]

And if they want to have a Peter Parker that has grown, why is not marriage with MJ relatable, but him being a CEO for a global company is? Marvel logic and long term planning never ceases to amaze me. Meanwhile, I'm glad that Slott is still on Amazing Spider-Man, regardless if I read it or not. I don't doubt Slott's passion for Spider-Man and Peter Parker for a second, and if other people enjoy it and buy that comic, it makes me happy even if this vision of Peter Parker doesn't fit with what I personally want to read. I have a feeling that noone at Marvel has the passion for Spidey that Slott does after all.

Cuz it doesn't factor in the angaging and fun aspect of Spidey's stories as a crime fighter or a adventurer, it(marriage/fatherhood) doesn't fit with Spidey's or Marvel's current vision of the character, they want Peter to be a heroic symbol/ideal instead of a people's hero(maybe a little bit of both but still not self contained to a point he's not that important to his heroic peers and the world in general). MJ would be a liability if she went on Peter's adventures with him and contributes nothing of value in the suspense of battles and the blood adrenaline acts of bravery and danger. Aka she be in the way since she has no powers, and no PIS to blindside a supervillian with cowardly weapons like guns and bats.

[mtalisker18]

Does DC publishing Superman: Lois & Clark fly in the face of reasoning used to justify Flashpoint?

TBH I have no effing clue what DC is doing at this point.

[Kevinroc]

TBH I have no effing clue what DC is doing.

They're trying to sell comics. Like I said, it wouldn't be the most surprising thing if we got some kind of RYV spin-off based on just the sales of the first issue. But it is by no means a guarantee.