Poll: What Do You Think About "Color Blind" Casting in Comic Book Adaptations?

[7thangel]

For example, FF/Human Torch.
The Family dynamic to the FF is very important, If Johnny's not related to Sue.
Why would Reed, Sue, Ben hang out with this dick.

If Johnny Storm is African American, Sue Storm needs to be also.

do people not see how offensive it is to state that blended families and families that adopt lack 'the family dynamic'? seriously

[CtrlAltDesign]

do people not see how offensive it is to state that blended families and families that adopt lack 'the family dynamic'? seriously

I don't think anyone stated that.
I don't see why you would jump to that conclusion.
My point was if they removed the family dynamic.

[Ghost]

I know how this song and dance will go. Anytime a female actor is cast in a male role or a minority in the role of a white character its seen as"progressive", and anyone that disagrees will (likely) automatically be shamed as being a bigot. Sure, some casting decisions just make sense if they have superior ability or pull. But more often than not it just seems deliberately against the grain to get people stirred up and choosing sides, when the reality isnt so black and white (no pun intended). I cant help but get the feeling some choices are more out of novelty or a shallow attempt at seeming innovative, when after reading about the Sony studios leak Im pretty sure those movie execs really dont give a damn about equality.

Im more than well aware there are many deeply divisive issues with race in the United States (and probably most countries with a wide variety of mixed cultures), but that doesnt make my opinion any less valid. This is more complicated than we try to make it out to be... and no I dont have any answers or a solution. Again, its just my opinion.

[jhfrail]

I'm firmly in the cast to visual camp. No one ever suggests it would be ok to make a black character white, so why is the opposite ok? The argument that a character's race (or other physical feature such as hair color) doesn't matter, and therefore is interchangeable, is in itself racist. See, when someone says that, what they're saying is "these things don't matter if the character is white, but are vitally important if the character is not white." Since when does a person's race or ethnicity not matter specifically when they are of one particular race? That's just wrong. We are all a product of our experiences, and that applies to fictional characters as well. Change that, you change the character. Change the character, that's not what we were promised when you announce a Spider-man/Batman/Wonder Woman/whatever film. When Green Lantern came out, there were lots of people upset that "they made Green Lantern white." No one called those fans racist, at least not with the same frequency that those of us who want all characters to look on screen as they do on the page. These fans were not wrong, just uninformed. They were kids who grew up watching John Stewart on the JL cartoon, and don't read the comics, so they didn't know Hal came before him.

I will grant a few exceptions to my position. Michael Clarke Duncan as Kingpin was a great choice because there isn't anyone who can act (Looking at you, Big Van Vader) that could literally fill that role. Ultimate Nick Fury was modeled after Samuel L. Jackson, so having him play Fury in the films is a no-brainer. To me, the Marvel film universe is somewhat a mixture of the Ultimate universe and the classic Marvel universe. The nationality of the actor is irrelevant. "Can you play the part?" is relevant. I haven't seen it yet, but Selma stars three British actors. I doubt it would have gotten all the good buzz if LBJ called MLK "cheeky." Accents can be affected. Hair color can be dyed or a wig. If that's all you have to do to complete the visual, great. Otherwise, casting should try to fit the visual. If you can make normal height actors into Hobbits and Dwarves for the LotR films, you can make Jackman 5'3".

The solution isn't to make characters fans care about into minorities. It's to make minority characters that fans care about.

[Teek]

Voting hasn't opened yet, so I'll just say it should for the most part be colorblind, unless someone's ethnicity is a significant part of the identity. Then casting should shoot for a close enough match. Rising Sun is the national hero of Japan, he should appear to be Japanese. Shamrock should appear to be Irish. But in most cases it doesn't matter.

Really should just close the thread here because you're not going to get a better comment than this one.


There are 34 comments so far. I'm going to guess... 5 of them are making the absurd argument that if Jimmy Olson can be black, T'Challa can be white. Let's see if I'm right!



Edit: Thank you jhfrail. I was afraid I wasn't going to get any, but you came through at the last second! Still, one absurd post is far fewer than I expected.

No one ever suggests it would be ok to make a black character white, so why is the opposite ok?

Because you can probably count the number of black characters who aren't significantly defined by their race on one hand. You're comparing apples to oranges here.

[Kieran_Frost]

Cast the best actor for the job, regardless. It's a shame to see more people against such sense.

[Agent Z]

I would prefer you use the minority characters who you already have.

If you want Supergirl to have a black lover-you have enough black guys in limbo that you can toss in this series to use.

Lets start getting exposure to those guys instead of being lazy and ticking off a fanbase (Wally West).

Or create a new one and see if he or she takes off like Harley Quinn did.

Best answer to this question.

[Shawn Hopkins]

You know, I've been thinking, Superman could be played by any race without messing up his origin. Because he's adopted. Not that white people have a monopoly on Midwestern values but even if you can't buy a black or Asian Ma and Pa Kent, Superman is adopted so it doesn't matter.

One thing a lot of people have been saying is that it would have been nice for both Storms to be black because it would have led to an onscreen mixed race romance (Reed and Sue). I agree, that would be cool, but isn't showing a mixed race family (the Storms) worthwhile as well?

I know how this song and dance will go. Anytime a female actor is cast in a male role or a minority in the role of a white character its seen as"progressive", and anyone that disagrees will (likely) automatically be shamed as being a bigot. Sure, some casting decisions just make sense if they have superior ability or pull. But more often than not it just seems deliberately against the grain to get people stirred up and choosing sides, when the reality isnt so black and white (no pun intended). I cant help but get the feeling some choices are more out of novelty or a shallow attempt at seeming innovative, when after reading about the Sony studios leak Im pretty sure those movie execs really dont give a damn about equality.

Im more than well aware there are many deeply divisive issues with race in the United States (and probably most countries with a wide variety of mixed cultures), but that doesnt make my opinion any less valid. This is more complicated than we try to make it out to be... and no I dont have any answers or a solution. Again, its just my opinion.

You have to remember that superhero comics are a medium that has been stagnant since the 1960s, when white male equaled "default." So most of the major characters reflect that. If you hew closely to the original source material you're going to end up with curiously old-fashioned whitewashed pieces of media with limited appeal.

I don't think anyone stated that.
I don't see why you would jump to that conclusion.
My point was if they removed the family dynamic.

That's not happening, though, so no worries.

[Derek Metaltron]

I went for looking like the character, even though I do agree that there has been some good casting choices with actors of different ethic backgrounds, Duncan Clarke as Kingpin especially because he played him exactly as Kingpin should be. That said, a lot of these castings have the problem of getting the character right. Granted that there have been a lot of Jimmy Olsens already who were white (and a female in MOS) but the fact Supergirl's Jimmy sounds so unlike the character troubles me further. If Danny Glover or someone like that had been cast I would be far more down with that.

The other recent issue I have is how Susan in the new FF is still white to the extent they have to use the adopted card, thus taking away the biological siblings aspect from her for the sake of what I can assume to be 'well Susan is blonde and you don't get blonde haired black women'. Marvel at least with Netflix stuff seems to be being pretty faithful since they'll be having a range of actors and actresses (though I do wonder if they'll make Danny Rand Asian sometimes).

[Lady Warp Spasm]

By and Large I do not mind. Heimdall, Kingpin they all work for me. The best actor for the job really.

[Kieran_Frost]

I think they have "diverged" away from characters enough times, in enough successful ways, to know it's perfectly possible (and common) to do it right. The worst castings to date have NEVER been actors of a different race, or people of a different gender. Is any "colourblind casting" as bad as Ben Affleck as Daredevil, or Ryan Reynolds as Green Lantern? I think not. "Looking right" has nothing to do with it; it's about talent, it's about story. Race, gender, sexuality... that doesn't make a good hero (or not make a good hero).

[Cometman]

i'm firmly in the cast to visual camp. No one ever suggests it would be ok to make a black character white, so why is the opposite ok? The argument that a character's race (or other physical feature such as hair color) doesn't matter, and therefore is interchangeable, is in itself racist. See, when someone says that, what they're saying is "these things don't matter if the character is white, but are vitally important if the character is not white." since when does a person's race or ethnicity not matter specifically when they are of one particular race? That's just wrong. We are all a product of our experiences, and that applies to fictional characters as well. Change that, you change the character. Change the character, that's not what we were promised when you announce a spider-man/batman/wonder woman/whatever film. When green lantern came out, there were lots of people upset that "they made green lantern white." no one called those fans racist, at least not with the same frequency that those of us who want all characters to look on screen as they do on the page. These fans were not wrong, just uninformed. They were kids who grew up watching john stewart on the jl cartoon, and don't read the comics, so they didn't know hal came before him.

I will grant a few exceptions to my position. Michael clarke duncan as kingpin was a great choice because there isn't anyone who can act (looking at you, big van vader) that could literally fill that role. Ultimate nick fury was modeled after samuel l. Jackson, so having him play fury in the films is a no-brainer. To me, the marvel film universe is somewhat a mixture of the ultimate universe and the classic marvel universe. The nationality of the actor is irrelevant. "can you play the part?" is relevant. I haven't seen it yet, but selma stars three british actors. I doubt it would have gotten all the good buzz if lbj called mlk "cheeky." accents can be affected. Hair color can be dyed or a wig. If that's all you have to do to complete the visual, great. Otherwise, casting should try to fit the visual. If you can make normal height actors into hobbits and dwarves for the lotr films, you can make jackman 5'3".

The solution isn't to make characters fans care about into minorities. It's to make minority characters that fans care about.

Well Said!

[Lady Warp Spasm]

I think they have "diverged" away from characters enough times, in enough successful ways, to know it's perfectly possible (and common) to do it right. The worst castings to date have NEVER been actors of a different race, or people of a different gender. Is any "colourblind casting" as bad as Ben Affleck as Daredevil, or Ryan Reynolds as Green Lantern? I think not. "Looking right" has nothing to do with it; it's about talent, it's about story. Race, gender, sexuality... that doesn't make a good hero (or not make a good hero).

Bold is my point exactly. Make your characters engaging and their world fascinating and I'll be there. If I can believe in them and their world, bingo.

[Custodes]

If people were serious about diversity they would cast minority characters instead of changing the race of white characters. Very few people would be annoyed if Static Shock was a regular with Supergirl.

[Kieran_Frost]

Bold is my point exactly. Make your characters engaging and their world fascinating and I'll be there. If I can believe in them and their world, bingo.

THIS! How many villains have the MCU had who fell flat... ask yourself why. Then you have someone like Tom Hiddleston as Loki, an awesome character paired with a great actor and it was GOLD! The fact Hiddleston was white (or male) had nothing to do with why people loved him (it was talent, passion, and character). Jamie Foxx was tied down by a WEAK character in Electro, had they given him deeper complexity (like Loki) people would be crying out for more. It was not his race that hurt the character, but the poor writing. Which is why I'm soooooooooo hoping they give Klaw a good character, because with Serkis you have the potential to create a truly amazing villain.