RACHEL GREY/SUMMERS, the Phoenix/Mother Askani Appreciation

[ClanAskani]

She raised Cable from infancy to preadolescence. Its not the same thing. She's had 12 years worth of personal bonding time with Nathan which she never had with Rachel. The most time she's ever spent alone with Rachel was the couple of hours we got in Red. Its not that hard to see why she would be closer to Nathan over her.

Rachel was comatose the whole time Jean and Scott were raising Nathan in the Askani Future. So it was 11+ years of guilt for Jean and Scott. Both of them expressed remorse for how they treated Rachel. She was the one who inflicted that on them but they would never had gotten those years with Nathan without her.

It would expect Rachel & Jean's relationship to be awkward now since they haven't really spent that much time together. But after spending all that time feeling guilty for the way she treated Rachel, it make more sense for Jean not get bitchy with Rachel.

[Havok83]

Rachel was comatose the whole time Jean and Scott were raising Nathan in the Askani Future. So it was 11+ years of guilt for Jean and Scott. Both of them expressed remorse for how they treated Rachel. She was the one who inflicted that on them but they would never had gotten those years with Nathan without her.

It would expect Rachel & Jean's relationship to be awkward now since they haven't really spent that much time together. But after spending all that time feeling guilty for the way she treated Rachel, it make more sense for Jean not get bitchy with Rachel.

Exactly which is why Red Annual made sense and their scene in Gold seemed out of character

[comradepitrovsky]

At the absolute least, Jean should have more sympathy for the PTSD-afflicted genocide survivor.

[Marvelboy1974]

I can't believe that with one exchange on one panel the relationship between Jean and Rachel has become a mess. I don't understand why writers just don't give us what we want. I dream of at least a one-shot of the Adventures of Jean and Rachel where they actually talk and cement their relationship on their terms. Jean IS her mother just as she is Cable's, even if she didn't actually give birth to her in the 616. They had such a beautiful moment in Xmen Red Annual only for GUGG to crap all over it. Ugh, it just makes me so mad...

[theoneandonly]

exactly why I speculated that guggs wrote that issue with inputs from kelly as otherwise he just hasn't paid attention to anything apart from kitty.

[Cerridwen]

Maybe Jean felt closer to the Mother Askani/Rachel than this Prestige/Rache lol. Its so annoying how that writer simply ignored everything they've been through.

[Askani's Flame]

I was thinking about it this morning and it almost feels like Guggenheim had decided to write this series on a "What If" premise of "what if after 30 years the X-Men were still characterized like they were in Uncanny X-Men 208?" Example: Rachel was super whiny and her powers are unreliable (but she showed more skill back then...hmmm...), Storm is powerless but had a Asgardian hammer that gave her powers (whereas now Gugg's Storm is useless but has a hammer that augments her powers that don't need augmenting), Colossus has no personality (same), Kurt is lovestruck with a redhead (was Amnada Sefton, now Rachel), and Logan/Wolverine/OML liked to stab things (check). Only his waifu Kitty was written like she had characterization. No character is coming out of this book unscathed, but here's hoping that Taylor and Rosenberg can help save Storm, Nightcrawler, and Colossus from Gold's poor writing run.

[Havok83]

I was thinking about it this morning and it almost feels like Guggenheim had decided to write this series on a "What If" premise of "what if after 30 years the X-Men were still characterized like they were in Uncanny X-Men 208?" Example: Rachel was super whiny and her powers are unreliable (but she showed more skill back then...hmmm...), Storm is powerless but had a Asgardian hammer that gave her powers (whereas now Gugg's Storm is useless but has a hammer that augments her powers that don't need augmenting), Colossus has no personality (same), Kurt is lovestruck with a redhead (was Amnada Sefton, now Rachel), and Logan/Wolverine/OML liked to stab things (check). Only his waifu Kitty was written like she had characterization. No character is coming out of this book unscathed, but here's hoping that Taylor and Rosenberg can help save Storm, Nightcrawler, and Colossus from Gold's poor writing run.

Im upset he didnt just use the Dark Rachel Saga to reveal that it was a Mesmero induced psychosis. I would have been okay with the entire run being revealed to be a nightmare that Rachel was having

[LordAllMIghty]

Im upset he didnt just use the Dark Rachel Saga to reveal that it was a Mesmero induced psychosis. I would have been okay with the entire run being revealed to be a nightmare that Rachel was having

LOL, co-sign.

[Devaishwarya]

I know she raised Nathan but she should have some sympathy for Rachel and at the very least try to understand where the girl is coming from.

From my recollection...I honestly thought Rachel and Jean had gotten past the whole "are you or aren't you my mother?" ish. But knowing the writer, I'm not at all surprised.

Having understanding and sympathy for someone does not mean you enable their angst-ridden delusions. Jean hasn't spent any real mother/daughter bonding moments with Rachel for any great length of time (at least by what's been shown in-panel/in-story)...as she did with Nathan. Enough to acknowledge their genetic bond, perhaps, but not enough to call her daughter.

From all reports (I don't read that Gilded Turd), could she have handled it better? Yes. But it's HWMNBN...so...I don't know why anyone expects it/her to written well and...Jean doesn't owe Rachel anything, not really.

[askani_son]

Bye bye Rachel? I think she will not be in uncanny... she will be in limbo again.

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[PsychoEFrost]

I was thinking about it this morning and it almost feels like Guggenheim had decided to write this series on a "What If" premise of "what if after 30 years the X-Men were still characterized like they were in Uncanny X-Men 208?" Example: Rachel was super whiny and her powers are unreliable (but she showed more skill back then...hmmm...), Storm is powerless but had a Asgardian hammer that gave her powers (whereas now Gugg's Storm is useless but has a hammer that augments her powers that don't need augmenting), Colossus has no personality (same), Kurt is lovestruck with a redhead (was Amnada Sefton, now Rachel), and Logan/Wolverine/OML liked to stab things (check). Only his waifu Kitty was written like she had characterization. No character is coming out of this book unscathed, but here's hoping that Taylor and Rosenberg can help save Storm, Nightcrawler, and Colossus from Gold's poor writing run.

This is so true that it hurts. Woof.

[Askani's Flame]

Bye bye Rachel? I think she will not be in uncanny... she will be in limbo again.

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Oof.

I would honestly not mind if she took a little limbo break after Extermination if was accompanied by something like her going off with Blaquesmith and getting retrained in the Askani arts. Comes back to the X-fold as "Askani" and is no longer this incompetent psi we have been getting this whole run. i just don't want Gold to be her final characterization if she's the one on the chopping block for that upcoming event.

[ClanAskani]

Guggenheim did apologize:

https://twitter.com/mguggenheim/stat...04864550866944

[Wiccan]

Guggenheim did apologize:

https://twitter.com/mguggenheim/stat...04864550866944

Well, this is more like "Sorry that you didn't like it" than an apology for it. Tbh I think he just didn't thought much about it(same could be assumed about a lot on this run as it's full of nonsense), it's just randomly there instead of being a plot point like most of their previous interactions. Better to just ignore it down the line.