DC Extended Universe (POST NO SPOILERS HERE!)

[Johnny]

WB has shown very little respect to us, to Snyder, to Ayer, and to the whole concept of filmmaking. Now all we can do is hope that this new era starting up this winter is the beginning of a fresh start. If it isn't, then that's going to be bad.

Really bad.

[Elmo]

You aren't allowed to say that anymore after Black Panther and Justice League
DC is where directors go to get bullied
Marvel is where they go to make their own movies

Try and stop me

All Marvel movies are the same

Justice League was a tragic case of damage control and turned out awful

would still prefer it over the Disney corporate formula

[Elmo]

Your views are incorrect.
Anyway marvel mcu has been putting out 2 movies year for awhile.
3 Movies a year started last year.
The other marvel movies like deadpool,logan etc.. are not mcu marvel films but they are still marvel movies.

More Than Just The Same: MCU Head Kevin Feige Says All Marvel Movies Are 'Relatively Different'

https://moviepilot.com/p/kevin-feige...ticism/4414149


Why Marvel’s Success Story is More Than Just a ‘Formula’

To read more go here
http://screenrant.com/marvel-movie-formula-brand/
Note-most of the mcu movies if i could recall do not have world ending events by the ways.

Here is view from another poster.
by WebLurker


and
The marvel formula is why critics hate dc?



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keUFPNdbRHQ

Oh please. Nothing in this post had anything to do with what I was saying.

Even if all the MCU films weren't all alike, the culty fanbase that surrounds them is enough to turn me off for good

[skyvolt2000]

Ironic that, WW being the one exception, WB has shown the DC universe neither of the two since they started this little experiment to go after Marvel. If anything, they've shown quite the opposite so far.

I mean, they certainly don't need to try to make nerds like me happy, but rather try to make the movie-going masses around the world happy. They seem to really be struggling with that.

I think they struggle because they think they can toss whatever they want out with Batman & Superman on the cover and expect folks to bow down and worship them.

And the public is not having any of that.

Like you said Marvel is more worried about making a film for EVERYONE versus pandering to a set group like the comic side won't stop doing.

I have met too many folks who know NOTHING about comics say how much they loved Black Panther and others the same for WW and more who liked Falcon, Winter Solider, Black Widow, GOTG.

When you don't worry about fanboys and keep all the bad cooks out of the kitchen-you get well received films.

Disney doesn't care about grumpy fanboys who would rather set fire to books that they don't have to read or make up stories about attacks at film-they care about that hearing those folks who never supported comics and still came to the show.

[mace11]

Oh please. Nothing in this post had anything to do with what I was saying.

Even if all the MCU films weren't all alike, the culty fanbase that surrounds them is enough to turn me off for good

Even if all the MCU films weren't all alike, the culty fanbase that surrounds them is enough to turn me off for good

So there are those who would say the same for dceu films.
Like i said all mcu movies they different from each other.

If you like the movies like the movies because you like the movies.
Don't worry about a certain fanbase.
This goes for all movies,books,etc..
You may need to get off forums or take a break.
I just had say that.
Don't let others ruin things for you.

So we can get a barrage of the same basic formulaic bullshit 4 times a year?

All Marvel movies are the same

would still prefer it over the Disney corporate formula

Oh please. Nothing in this post had anything to do with what I was saying.

You use the word the same and formulaic.
Did you write those words?
Did forget what you wrote?
Don't play games.
The info i posted was talking about what you were saying and what you said or your views about the mcu is incorrect.
Simple as that.

The marvel form is why critics hate dc?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keUFPNdbRHQula

[TheSeaDragon]

Elmo, you re not alone. Count me also as someone who is tired of the culty MCU fan base




I consider the MCU totaly overhyped. Most of the entries are average and without re watch value

[Elmo]

So there those who would say the same for dceu films.





You use the world the same and formulaic.Did not write those words?
Did not forget what you wrote.
Don't play games.
The info i posted was talking about what you were saying and what you said or views about the mcu correct.
Simple as a that.

It is correct...I don't need to read a bunch of articles or statements from a movie producer to know it, I can just watch the movies, which I do. They are all roughly the same. Disney is a disgusting evil empire with an agenda to buy out most major media providers which will destroy filmmaking as an art form and the entertainment industry altogether. They are sickening and the movies are the same, whether you enjoy them or not.

The Marvel movies all follow the SAME formula and it doesn't matter if certain aspects are different. You can watch a Marvel film without knowing what it is originally and immediately know it's a Marvel film.

They are expertly crafted to fit the same blockbuster mold. Appealing to the crowd that started watching in the beginning while also putting enough dumbed down story elements masked as "deep" to appeal to foreign markets.

Nothing, absolutely nothing about the Marvel films represents good filmmaking. Shitting out movie after movie with crap CGI and the same basic story elements is solely for the intent of selling toys and making millions, when filmmaking is supposed to be about telling great stories and leaping forward with every new project.

The DCEU has been a massive failure but the intentions were always noble. Since the beginning they worked with top filmmakers, writers, and actors to try and create something special. Just the simple premise of the franchise's development is beautiful in itself. Also since the beginning it has been attacked by numerous critics and blog sites; constant rumors and hit pieces when the whole point of DC and Marvel comics was that if one does well, it's good for the entire industry. Blogs and internet trolls want to divide them and it's fucked up.

People assume because directors left certain DC projects that WB are bullies forcing directors to conform to a vision when that is LITERALLY what Marvel does. "Creative differences" implies that two or more people on the same project did not agree on where to go. It very rarely has anything to do with the studio and in most cases WB have been mediators. The ONLY reason people assume WB is this evil overseeing company forcing directors to do shit is because a blog mentioned it and people rode that wave.

In any case my statement was not meant to imply that the DC movies are better or worse. In actuality the only DCEU film I really enjoy is Man of Steel. I just respect the vision of the DCEU and I want it to succeed. WB has the best track record in the history of film. They aren't an evil company like Disney and they respect filmmaking.

I would gladly take shit DC movie after shit DC movie if it meant the property wasn't in the hands of a company like Disney. It's a fucking cult. The whole MCU bandwagon just looks and feels like a cult and that's no disrespect to anyone who enjoys those movies that's just what it looks like. Disney has always been extremely problematic and in recent years it's obvious they don't give a shit about making good movies because they know the public will eat it up

Elmo, you re not alone. Count me also as someone who is tired of the culty MCU fan base




I consider the MCU totaly overhyped. Most of the entries are average and without re watch value

Hey thanks man; I know my opinion isn't a popular one but I'm glad someone else sees it how I do

[mace11]

This is from john campea.
Black Panther Success Highlights DCEU's Need To Start Over


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l12F5tp5ozw

[DGraysonWorldsGreatestSpy]

Wonder Woman 2 & Aquaman are the hope now. They could BOTH lay the groundwork for an expanded DCU with Donna Troy, Garth, Tula, and even JSA. Aquaman alone can do wonders with Atlantis, Teen Titans could be in motion and other groups but I doubt that since they don’t have a Clear vision just like the comics continuity

[TheSeaDragon]

It is correct...I don't need to read a bunch of articles or statements from a movie producer to know it, I can just watch the movies, which I do. They are all roughly the same. Disney is a disgusting evil empire with an agenda to buy out most major media providers which will destroy filmmaking as an art form and the entertainment industry altogether. They are sickening and the movies are the same, whether you enjoy them or not.

The Marvel movies all follow the SAME formula and it doesn't matter if certain aspects are different. You can watch a Marvel film without knowing what it is originally and immediately know it's a Marvel film.

They are expertly crafted to fit the same blockbuster mold. Appealing to the crowd that started watching in the beginning while also putting enough dumbed down story elements masked as "deep" to appeal to foreign markets.

Nothing, absolutely nothing about the Marvel films represents good filmmaking. Shitting out movie after movie with crap CGI and the same basic story elements is solely for the intent of selling toys and making millions, when filmmaking is supposed to be about telling great stories and leaping forward with every new project.

The DCEU has been a massive failure but the intentions were always noble. Since the beginning they worked with top filmmakers, writers, and actors to try and create something special. Just the simple premise of the franchise's development is beautiful in itself. Also since the beginning it has been attacked by numerous critics and blog sites; constant rumors and hit pieces when the whole point of DC and Marvel comics was that if one does well, it's good for the entire industry. Blogs and internet trolls want to divide them and it's fucked up.

People assume because directors left certain DC projects that WB are bullies forcing directors to conform to a vision when that is LITERALLY what Marvel does. "Creative differences" implies that two or more people on the same project did not agree on where to go. It very rarely has anything to do with the studio and in most cases WB have been mediators. The ONLY reason people assume WB is this evil overseeing company forcing directors to do shit is because a blog mentioned it and people rode that wave.

In any case my statement was not meant to imply that the DC movies are better or worse. In actuality the only DCEU film I really enjoy is Man of Steel. I just respect the vision of the DCEU and I want it to succeed. WB has the best track record in the history of film. They aren't an evil company like Disney and they respect filmmaking.

I would gladly take shit DC movie after shit DC movie if it meant the property wasn't in the hands of a company like Disney. It's a fucking cult. The whole MCU bandwagon just looks and feels like a cult and that's no disrespect to anyone who enjoys those movies that's just what it looks like. Disney has always been extremely problematic and in recent years it's obvious they don't give a shit about making good movies because they know the public will eat it up



Hey thanks man; I know my opinion isn't a popular one but I'm glad someone else sees it how I do

stay strong, man. Not likin the MCU is fine, they are just movies, subject to opinions, like anything. But as you said, is like a culty fandom now

[mace11]

yeah, this discussion is over.

Not yet.
I realize on forums like these a long time ago you not really changing folks minds,but once in awhile you have put out the facts and your views are wrong.


By the way i like all the dceu films i have seen,so i am not dceu hater but it's clear marvel mcu overall is doing a much better job.
The films on average from the mcu are stronger,character development is stronger,and the cgi on average better.
The only dceu film i have not seen yet is SS,well i have not see all of it yet.
Still plan to later.


Here some others views/talk about the mcu/Disney vs dc/wb vs marvel fox
The real reasons the DC Extended Universe is struggling

by Scott Harris
While Marvel Comics and Disney are riding high on the hog with one
massive box office hit after another, DC Comics and Warner Bros. are
struggling to simply get their own extended cinematic universe off the
ground. Given that DC's characters—including Superman, Batman, and
Wonder Woman—are arguably the most recognizable superheroes in the
world, you'd think this wouldn't be so hard. So why can't they seem to
figure it out? Here's a look at some of the real reasons for the
DCEU's struggles.

They have a corporate mentality
In 2004, fed up after years of other studios butchering their
characters, Marvel came up a with a bold plan to make their own
movies. Their core idea: the people who make the comics and understand
the characters should be in charge of the films. That has never been
the case with DC, which has been owned by Warner Bros. since 1967. As
just one cog in a vast media machine, the decisions aren't made by DC,
they're made for DC in order to satisfy a corporate agenda. It's
filmmaking by committee, not by creators.

by Ashray
Points 1 to 4 have always been so obvious to me and the reason why i
believe WB will never catch up Marvel.
up Marvel.
DC had been under WB since 1967 and that studio has had a 3 decades
head start with the first Superman movie before Marvel Studios
starting releasing its very first one with IM.

Both DC and Marvel, opted for different options when it comes to the
future of their properties on the big screens and that's the core
reason of the difference we see today.

DC Entertainment sold all its DC portfolio to a motion picture studio
4 decades ago and relinquished its creative MOVIE rights to them by
doing so since they were not in the business of making movie at the
time and had no studio of their own.

I think Marvel learned from DC and much later sacrificed instead its
flagships and some other properties to keep the movie and TV creative
rights within their hands for the lesser properties that were still
under their belt.

Keeping that controlling right for even one single property was the
main priority as well as keeping a door opened in case the movie
rights license reverse to them.

They didn't sell those rights to other studio, they license them with
conditions that could enable them to eventually get them back.

They therefore launched their own production company and independent
studio to take eventually take care of their own properties.

They were not happy with some of the effort made by those other
studios and since they still retained those movie rights as some
properties reversed to them, they decided to innovate and create the
MCU, implementing that concept to maximize the Marvel properties under
their roof.

Marvel has kept their creative freedom close to the creator.

They have been an independent studio run by CB nerds with a very flat
pyramidal organization and a cohesive single vision that ease
communication and facilitate quick implementation.

I remember one of the MCU actor saying that everyone has Feige
personal phone and could phone and talk to him directly which is not
something you could do with FOX or WB's top executive. That actor also
said that decisions are made around a very few numbers of people and
that basically FEIGE is the one that decides ultimately without any
other interference from anyone, Disney big top included.

It's no surprise that Marvel ended up under Disney right after TA as
this conglomerate buys existing functional studios letting the
creative team in place while they take care of the distribution and
merchandising.
People often forget that movies like Pulp Fiction, Good Will Hunting,
Kill Bill and many others were all produced by MIRAMAX, a studio owned
at the time by Disney Corporation, functioning under the same freedom
as Marvel or Lucas Films, etc.
That's how Disney do business with Hollywood.
It buys working entities (Marvel Studios, the Weinstein, MiraMax,
Lucas Films, ect...) and let all the creative rights within the
existing team.
Disney basically acts like a banker opening its wallet to finance
projects of existing studios under its conglomerate and collects
revenues as it opens its distribution and marketing channels to them
and take care of all the merchandising aspect.

Also, to me the main reason why the DCEU is struggling is that when
you try to emulate a concept that were implemented highly successfully
by someone else, chances are greater that you fail if you don't take
the time to understand FULLY how they did it so successfully and take
even more time to figure out how to improve the concept and make it
better.

WB hasn't done that and just tried to do a simple copy paste of Marvel
concept, putting their own twist and neglecting some important steps
because they don't understand the concept and only think that having
icons plastered in place of the MCU second rated character is enough
to maximize that concept.

It is clear to me that FEIGE and others at Marvel have thought,
planned years before IM hit the big screen.

They built different plans, different scenarios in case one step fails
so that they could get back on track quicker knowing what they were
doing and where they were aiming all along the way.

WB clearly didn't and still don't.
It just focused on those big characters and neglect everything else,
story included, throwing things at wall to see what stick, thinking
that having A list characters and maximizing on that CBM era will do
the trick.
They just went on this DCEU lazily and full of arrogance and false ideas.

WB hasn't done that and just tried to do a simple copy paste of
Marvel concept, putting their own twist and neglecting some important
steps because they don't undertsand the concept and only think that
having icons plastered in place of the MCU second rated characetr is
enough to maximise that concept.

Of course i think marvel characters and mcu characters are first rate
and more interesting then the dc ones on average and marvel has the
better characters on average and now the most well known these days.

camethedawn6
Nope. I don't like it. I'll wait till dc studios takes full control and hopefully they will redo the whole thing from the ground up. That is the only thing that makes sense right now.

camethedawn6
+Aaron Rainbolt The creation of dc studios was announced last year. You can look it up..
Once they take full control, Snyder will be out the door but Johns and Affleck will remain. I can hardly wait.

camethedawn6
+NightHawk92 No, DC movies need dc studios to make great films and not whatever the heck that is warner is sending up into the theaters. Not my fault you bunch have such low standards when it comes to dc properties.

Random
camethedawn you do know marvel studios is still run by disney

camethedawn6
+Random Yeah, but the parent company doesn't decide which films Marvel Studios makes nor how they are to make them, Feige is the architect of the mcu and it follows his vision and plan, not the head of Disney.

pk139106
camethedawn They've already filmed JL1. Can't go back now. Expect a bad story and a mediocre film.

camethedawn6
+pk13910 That is why I refuse to see anything Zach Snyder related to the dc universe, or anything that isn't from Batfleck until dc studios takes over. Fool me once...

camethedawn6
+Alex Bernal Hey everybody, guess what ! Sources say that the upcoming Snyder directed Justice League film is a hot mess and a bad film. I know, what are the chances right?

camethedawn6
+Alex Bernal Go ask Batman On Film. I'm sure he'll be happy to share the details.
fyi: It's a RUMOR at this point genius. Not a blog post or article yet. Sources close to the production have confided in him apparently.

[Elmo]

By the way i like all the dceu films i have seen,so i am not dceu hater but it's clear marvel mcu overall is doing a much better job.
The films on average from the mcu are stronger,character development is stronger,and the cgi on average better.
The only dceu film i have not seen yet is SS,well i have not see all of it yet.
Still plan to later.


Here some others views/talk about the mcu/Disney vs dc/wb vs marvel fox
The real reasons the DC Extended Universe is struggling

Nothing about your statement or this post disputes anything I said in mine.

Disney is still an evil empire with a nefarious agenda, still crafts films to fit a specific mold.

I never said they weren't successful or doing a better job. In terms of character development and CGI, that's your opinion and wasn't part of the original discussion in the first place.

You like the MCU, I hate it, there's literally nothing we can do about this but accept it and move on

[TheSeaDragon]

i wonder about the MCU take on the mutants. The X men are not something to play safe with andt htey have a very special fan base . Part of me would enjoy it turning divisive with fans. Of course, it will have stellar RT critic scores, i dont even know how the marvel X men movies will be but i already know they will have stellar RT scores , but just like the last Jedi, maybe the fans will have other opinion

[mace11]

WB truly is its own worst enemy

by dteam6

With all the Affleck/The Batman news, there seem to be strong
indications that Affleck is PO'd because the studio is likely meddling
with the production. At this point, that's not even a surprise,
considering all the meddling they've done before. It's amazing--many
viewed "The Batman" as the would-be savior of the DCCU and a chance
for Affleck to work mostly untethered from WB but nope--it sounds like
they are meddling quite heavily. Is WB becoming as bad as Sony at this
point? It's as if they've learned NOTHING from all this. NOTHING. Do
they even bother taking surveys? Reviewing comments? Examining
ANYTHING outside their offices?
I truly wish the DC franchise would be farmed out to a different, more
competent, company as WB seems to be losing their nerve with this...

by
tjlamb0518
What's really funny is that for all the "WB will never follow the
Marvel path" nonsense we see on here....even in THIS regard, they seem
hell-bent to follow the Marvel formula (remember how Ed Norton and
Favreau and others bristled under studio mandates impacting their
"visions"?).

by dteam6
Which makes you have to wonder--WHY does it work for Disney Marvel and
seems to be failing with WB/DC? If you ask me--the working
relationship between directors and Disney Marvel seems to be BETTER in
many cases. Yes, there is still friction with directors of the MCU
(original Ant Man director being one such example) but we never hear
much about the drama.

The most drama we heard was from Joss Whedon and his "experience"
under Disney Marvel. Then again--Disney Marvel seems to be give the
director of Guardians of the Galaxy some extra rope and is allowing
him to keep his films sort of "distanced" from the rest of the MCU. It
seems that they are more willing to work with their directors. This
isn't bias here but a fact--you simply DO NOT hear of this much drama
behind the scenes with Disney Marvel as opposed to the DCCU. WHAT
makes their working relationship with directions in MCU work more
often than not? Working relationship is key and something is working
for Disney Marvel and not working as well for WB/DC.

So, Disney Marvel seems to have a "sometimes turbulent" working
relationship with its director while WB/DC is, of late, having a
"constantly turbulent" relationship. At least, that's how it seems.

[mace11]

Nothing about your statement or this post disputes anything I said in mine.

Disney is still an evil empire with a nefarious agenda, still crafts films to fit a specific mold.

I never said they weren't successful or doing a better job. In terms of character development and CGI, that's your opinion and wasn't part of the original discussion in the first place.

You like the MCU, I hate it, there's literally nothing we can do about this but accept it and move on

You mention cgi in one of your posts.
Like i said posted the facts,you did not.
By the way you said you did not like the mcu.
Let's just talk about marvel.
Do you like any marvel superheroes or villains elmo?