DC Extended Universe (POST NO SPOILERS HERE!)

[Soubhagya]

Rebooting the way you're proposing just wouldn't work. Keeping some things and jettisoning others would lead to a whole New 52-type situation and nobody would know what the heck was in continuity in the movie universe and what wasn't. You can't keep Gadot's Wonder Woman, but get rid of Affleck's Batman. You either have to trash all of it or keep all of it.

Also, is Ben Affleck leaving? Because he keeps saying he isn't.

Is Deadpool not set in the same universe as the other X-films? Because I didn't see anything that flat out said it wasn't.

Even Marvel has had plenty of missteps. Both Iron Fist and Inhumans tanked hard. But I don't see them being rebooted. Marvel just course corrects. That's what DC should do.

The only two options are: (1) throw all of it away, try again in a few years or (2) work with what they have, but do better with a coherent plan in place.

No i don't think Affleck is making another film. I think he keeps saying that because otherwise it would be a PR disaster. Ben Affleck is an acclaimed director and actor. After he won the Academy Award DC actually made a coup by getting him for Batman. I am noticing things which says that he is not interested but going away. First, he was supposed to direct as well as act in Batman. Then he said he wants to do the role justice so he is stepping away from the director's chair. A while back there was something like he wants to gracefully segue out of the role. For someone of his talent who has risen out of a slump in career to be part of DCEU makes no sense even if he is a big fan of these characters. Imagine if he had said i am leaving playing Batman in March or even a month or two ago. It would cast a really bad light on WB and DCEU.

People aren't so confused with these continuities. Even a little thinking makes big holes in X-Men franchise. People seem to be doing fine with it. And yes Deadpool and X-Men are in different continuities. Deadpool lives in a universe which has the X-Men. But they are not shown and are actually different. There's a different Colossus there who is different from other X-Men films.

Inhumans and Iron Fist are tv series. They are not so problematic. DC has been having failures since Man of Steel. If MoS, BvS, SS would have been successful no matter what JL would have been in the top 10 highest opening weekends among comic book films at least. At present its at #22. Just behind the original Guardians of the Galaxy. They did not come even for Wonder Woman.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/genres/...er=DESC&p=.htm

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

No i don't think Affleck is making another film. I think he keeps saying that because otherwise it would be a PR disaster. Ben Affleck is an acclaimed director and actor. After he won the Academy Award DC actually made a coup by getting him for Batman. I am noticing things which says that he is not interested but going away. First, he was supposed to direct as well as act in Batman. Then he said he wants to do the role justice so he is stepping away from the director's chair. A while back there was something like he wants to gracefully segue out of the role. For someone of his talent who has risen out of a slump in career to be part of DCEU makes no sense even if he is a big fan of these characters. Imagine if he had said i am leaving playing Batman in March or even a month or two ago. It would cast a really bad light on WB and DCEU.

That's actually a common move for an actor who is stretched too thin: they hand over some of their responsibilities to someone else. And regardless of some things, we don't actually know what's going on. Affleck just stated that he was committed to sticking around as Batman for as long as the studio would have him after that whole "segue out" thing. In the end, only Affleck and the studio actually know what he's thinking, and maybe not even the studio. Plus, I've heard that the rumblings are that Affleck wants to stay but the studio is the one not so sure about keeping him.

People aren't so confused with these continuities. Even a little thinking makes big holes in X-Men franchise. People seem to be doing fine with it. And yes Deadpool and X-Men are in different continuities. Deadpool lives in a universe which has the X-Men. But they are not shown and are actually different. There's a different Colossus there who is different from other X-Men films.

Colossus is big, burly, and metal....its pretty much how Colossus has always been.

Inhumans and Iron Fist are tv series. They are not so problematic. DC has been having failures since Man of Steel. If MoS, BvS, SS would have been successful no matter what JL would have been in the top 10 highest opening weekends among comic book films at least. At present its at #22. Just behind the original Guardians of the Galaxy.

Inhumans actually opened in IMAX theaters...and then proceeded to tank.

But, yeah, I agree that the DC slate has been riddled with problems that need to be fixed. I don't think, though, that selectively rebooting is the answer. They either have to completely trash the DCEU as of now and start from scratch in a few years (which I don't think is likely or would even be a popular choice) or just make better movies from now on and kind of ignore the events of the not-so-good ones.

[Confuzzled]

Yes its doable. Try to do unique stuff. Audiences are not satisfied with something only conventional nowadays. If they make a series of good films its possible to bounce back.

They have to be vigilant with their content screening and talent hiring right from the start now. No more "rehiring Zack Snyder and butchering his work when he ends up giving what he is expected of giving" and "firing prematurely hired multiple directors from The Flash" kind of idiotic moves.

Geoff Johns and co. should assess which director and writer(s) are a perfect fit for each character or team, discuss what said director and writers have in mind before hiring them, see if it can somehow be aligned with their own overall vision, and only then proceed. That initial filtering process for each project has to be solid. I feel that's what is hurting DCEU movies the most. WB execs rush too early and then realize their mistakes when it's too goddamn late.

[Soubhagya]

That's actually a common move for an actor who is stretched too thin: they hand over some of their responsibilities to someone else. And regardless of some things, we don't actually know what's going on. Affleck just stated that he was committed to sticking around as Batman for as long as the studio would have him after that whole "segue out" thing. In the end, only Affleck and the studio actually know what he's thinking, and maybe not even the studio. Plus, I've heard that the rumblings are that Affleck wants to stay but the studio is the one not so sure about keeping him.



Colossus is big, burly, and metal....its pretty much how Colossus has always been.



Inhumans actually opened in IMAX theaters...and then proceeded to tank.

But, yeah, I agree that the DC slate has been riddled with problems that need to be fixed. I don't think, though, that selectively rebooting is the answer. They either have to completely trash the DCEU as of now and start from scratch in a few years (which I don't think is likely or would even be a popular choice) or just make better movies from now on and kind of ignore the events of the not-so-good ones.

Then trash everything. Try to keep WW. The number (BO Opening) keeps on declining. Indicating people's general lack of interest in anything of DC. I can't understand how JL earned less then WW. Shouldn't more people be coming to watch then her solo? The declining trend worries me. From BvS to now each one is lesser then the one before it.

I would be happy to be wrong and Aquaman is the beginning of a series of acclaimed films. But its difficult to believe it. At present the only plan appears to be that there is no plan. Rather take some time maybe a year and get everything in order. X-Men was made on the back of two acclaimed films. Thus, missteps don't affect it a lot. After two back to back duds, the next film First Class was a good one making the way for next set of films. WW was a forward step followed by many steps backwards in JL.

[Vanguard-01]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcUgeotXH-I

Fast forward to around 20 minutes. He is pissed!

Campea has been a DCEU critic for a long time, but there's gotta be credibility to this.

This video is from Dave the Film Junkee. He's a huge DC/Zack Snyder fan (in this very video, he shamelessly refers to himself as a Zack Snyder shill) and like half his videos are about defending the DCEU and shooting down "This movie is a MESS" rumors.

If he's this angry, then there's gotta be some truth to this story.

Fair warning? He uses a fair bit of language, so if you're sensitive, don't click.

[Johnny]

It tanked with critics. It got worse reviews than BvS.

To be fair, critics were salivating to annihilate Iron Fist ever since the casting was first announced. Granted, the first season totally deserved the trouncing, but even it it had been better, they were still going to keep beating the white savior drum to death and beyond. I saw one review that said many of the problems would've been avoided had Danny Rand been an Asian-American dealing with discrimination by Rand Enterprises' board of directors. Yeah, the review actually suggested that. I was done.

[Soubhagya]

To be fair, critics we salivating to annihilate Iron Fist ever since the casting was first announced. Granted, the first season totally deserved the trouncing, but even it it had been better, they were still going to keep beating the white savior drum to death and beyond. I saw one review that said many of the problems would've been avoided had Danny Rand been an Asian-American dealing with discrimination by Rand Industries' board of directors. Yeah, the review actually suggested that. I was done.

Some critics are like that. I don't think most critics actively want to trash a film. Why would they? It gives them no benefit.

[Carabas]

It tanked with critics. It got worse reviews than BvS.

Critics alone don't make you money.

[FlashEarthOne]

Campea has been a DCEU critic for a long time, but there's gotta be credibility to this.

I know there is truth to it because I said a while back that WB wanted to fire Snyder but kept him due to a release date. Of course when I said it the apologists all screamed, "Source?!" even after I said I wasn't going to saying anything more. I make a comfortable living in this industry and my contemporaries are working actors, directors, producers, and writers. It has been known for a while now amongst these circles that WB wanted to fire Snyder but backed off due to a release date. The Tsujihara bonus is new information. Also Campea may be a DCEU critic but he also likes the movies so his opinions don't have the extremist bias that worshippers/haters have. That gives his opinion some center to it.

[Last Son of Krypton]

Man, JL's behind the scenes drama is worthy of a movie itself.

I wonder what he refers to?: https://twitter.com/JLDlite/status/936017605881610240

[Soubhagya]

I know there is truth to it because I said a while back that WB wanted to fire Snyder but kept him due to a release date. Of course when I said it the apologists all screamed, "Source?!" even after I said I wasn't going to saying anything more. I make a comfortable living in this industry and my contemporaries are working actors, directors, producers, and writers. It has been known for a while now amongst these circles that WB wanted to fire Snyder but backed off due to a release date. The Tsujihara bonus is new information. Also Campea may be a DCEU critic but he also likes the movies so his opinions don't have the extremist bias that worshippers/haters have. That gives his opinion some center to it.

This seems too obvious but aren't the fans whom you call 'apologists' familiar with the idea of criticism out of love? One can criticize and yet love something at the same time. I criticize DCEU films. Yet love it at the same time. I loved JL and WW. I like MoS and 'kinda' like BvS. Is it either love or hate?

When i criticize DC films here, i want it to succeed. Make better films. I am in love with DC characters. They are some of the greatest characters in the whole world. It has legions of fans around the world. They deserve a DCEU just as Marvel fans have their MCU. Can't fans accept criticism which is honest? There is dishonest criticism. You mentioned 'haters'. These things have no value. Just like that dishonest praise has no value in the long run.

Anyway its cool that you work in the industry. I did not know there are people from so many walks of life here.

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

Then trash everything. Try to keep WW. The number (BO Opening) keeps on declining. Indicating people's general lack of interest in anything of DC. I can't understand how JL earned less then WW. Shouldn't more people be coming to watch then her solo? The declining trend worries me. From BvS to now each one is lesser then the one before it.

I would be happy to be wrong and Aquaman is the beginning of a series of acclaimed films. But its difficult to believe it. At present the only plan appears to be that there is no plan. Rather take some time maybe a year and get everything in order. X-Men was made on the back of two acclaimed films. Thus, missteps don't affect it a lot. After two back to back duds, the next film First Class was a good one making the way for next set of films. WW was a forward step followed by many steps backwards in JL.

I dont think its declining interest in DC itself as a concept. Its declining interest in going to see bad movies. If people hear that word of mouth surrounding a movie is that its good, then they'll go see it. If they hear that its bad, they won't. Its as simple as that. If the next few entries into the DCEU are actually good movies, then people will go see them. People went to see Wonder Woman after BvS tanked, even though she was in BvS. They just need to rest the Justice League for a few years, and then bring them back with a proper script, lineup of characters, and new director.

Until then, focus on making good Flash, Green Lantern, and Aquaman movies and a great WW sequel. Ditch the Cyborg solo because that, IMO, has disaster written all over it. Make it a Titans film instead. Then, come back and do a proper Justice League movie with MM back in his proper place, acting like the first was just...a "one time thing."

[bobellis75]

No i don't think Affleck is making another film. I think he keeps saying that because otherwise it would be a PR disaster. Ben Affleck is an acclaimed director and actor. After he won the Academy Award DC actually made a coup by getting him for Batman. I am noticing things which says that he is not interested but going away. First, he was supposed to direct as well as act in Batman. Then he said he wants to do the role justice so he is stepping away from the director's chair. A while back there was something like he wants to gracefully segue out of the role. For someone of his talent who has risen out of a slump in career to be part of DCEU makes no sense even if he is a big fan of these characters. Imagine if he had said i am leaving playing Batman in March or even a month or two ago. It would cast a really bad light on WB and DCEU.

People aren't so confused with these continuities. Even a little thinking makes big holes in X-Men franchise. People seem to be doing fine with it. And yes Deadpool and X-Men are in different continuities. Deadpool lives in a universe which has the X-Men. But they are not shown and are actually different. There's a different Colossus there who is different from other X-Men films.

Inhumans and Iron Fist are tv series. They are not so problematic. DC has been having failures since Man of Steel. If MoS, BvS, SS would have been successful no matter what JL would have been in the top 10 highest opening weekends among comic book films at least. At present its at #22. Just behind the original Guardians of the Galaxy. They did not come even for Wonder Woman.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/genres/...er=DESC&p=.htm

I think a big part of Affleck stepping back from directing/writing has to do with his drinking as well. He's had a couple of relapses from the sound of it and they said with the JL press tour he had a sober coach traveling with him. That said...the Batman thing may be all to much for him to deal with. It's a massive time draining role to be part of and with the critical reviews...maybe it's not a great mix for him with his personal demons. Maybe he needs to go back to just direct a couple flicks, get his face out of the limelight.

I'd love to see him continue, but I do think he's going to step aside sooner rather than later.

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

Critics alone don't make you money.

I know that, but it was still not well-received critically. They did have to get a new show runner, I think.

[Confuzzled]

Ehm, Iron Fist was actually a massive hit for Netflix. Much bigger than Daredevil season 2.

Wasn't it the least watched of the four Season 1's? Couldn't this just mean Daredevil Season 2 was an even bigger disappointment?