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  1. #16
    Amazing Member CartooN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdgs View Post
    One of the best series of all time. I almost decided to never read it but now I'm glad I didn't.

    It's hard to choose between them ,especially because I have three characters that tie equally as the best of the best but if I have to pick an order, it would be Nico at first, Victor as a close second and Chase at third place.

    I consider "Dead means dead" and "Live fast" as only one story so that would be the best.

    People may not like my story but the only reason I ended up getting the first two volumes was because of Avengers Arena. I had already heard many things about the series before, but it wasn't until they appeared in Avengers Academy that I first read them. Those issues were a disaster. They were written as really annoying kids and I ended up somewhat disliking them. Sometime after, I decided to read Arena and met them again in issue 4. The introduction of their story by Chase as well as the way him and Nico were written picked my interest on them again (ironically the Academy kids were the ones badly written on that issue). It wasn't until issue 10 of Arena (the best issue of the series in my opinion) that I decided to search for the old stories and I'm really glad I did. Some of the best stories ever written. I gave those Academy issues away and now pretend they never happened.
    I dont think the Arena/Academy/Undercover writers ever truly understood the runaways. While I still enjoyed those three series, like you said, they just came over as annoying brats. The Runaways are far stronger than those writers ever portrayed them.

  2. #17
    Ultimate Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Personamanx View Post
    Okay, same old song and dance when it comes to discussion on a long cancelled, short-lived title with a bunch of fans. Who would we all like to see take over the book in a hypothetical re-launch of the series? And how would you pitch it?

    And it can't be Brian K. Vaughan on writing duties, it's just not going to happen under any realistic set of circumstances.
    Absorb them into the Marvel U already.
    The whole orphaned independence thing can only last so long. I'm ready to see them interact with the rest of the heroes more.

    Also...

    Who is your favorite Runaway?
    Nico Minoru, easy. That Staff of One sh!t is Hella-sweet.
    But I absolutely adore Mancha's fanboyism.

    Favorite storyline?
    Intro to Victor, for sure.

    How were you introduced to them
    A friend nagged me over and over and I kept protesting but then he lent them to me so I caved and man do I love him for being such a pest.

    Quote Originally Posted by CartooN View Post
    I dont think the Arena/Academy/Undercover writers ever truly understood the runaways. While I still enjoyed those three series, like you said, they just came over as annoying brats. The Runaways are far stronger than those writers ever portrayed them.
    I think he wrote them well.
    Chase was the defensive loud mouth, while Nico was more playing it closer to the chest -- being smart about getting allies and what not. I was pleased. Even with Nico's tilt toward the dark -- I found it totally believable and it just made me empathize with her more.
    Last edited by Fokken; 05-20-2014 at 12:00 PM.

  3. #18
    Hold your machete tight! Personamanx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    Absorb them into the Marvel U already.
    The whole orphaned independence thing can only last so long. I'm ready to see them interact with the rest of the heroes more.
    While I do think that's a very valid and probable thing for Marvel to do (They're more or less going for it already) I really don't see what's some limited about the book for it not be relaunched to success. It's just a group of characters that find themselves bound together, no different than the Fantastic Four or the X-Men. They just need a healthy direction.

  4. #19
    Fantastic Member jdgs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CartooN View Post
    I dont think the Arena/Academy/Undercover writers ever truly understood the runaways. While I still enjoyed those three series, like you said, they just came over as annoying brats. The Runaways are far stronger than those writers ever portrayed them.
    I think Dennis Hopeless (the writer of Arena/Undercover) gets the Runaways more than Gage (the writer of Academy) ever did. Chase's character is the one Hopeless struggles with the most I think, but ultimately succeeds in writing. He always was that guy who deals with his pain alone and in selfish ways but ultimately cares about his family. Nico, on the other hand, is acting really selfish but that's because of the "Blood magic" as Arcade put it in Arena. She is still trying to be a hero, but she is also really angry at all this situation and I think that's when the "Blood magic" takes control. It's a perfect evolution for her character.

    Also does anyone else think that Hopeless is trying to ignore everything that happened after BKV run. Klara is nowhere to be found and the staff of one Nico used before her upgrade, was the old one. Also when Chase recalls all the people who died around him, Old Lace's death is absent (I know it is alive now but, it was still a death that would have reinforced his point) and the fistigons only shoot fire again.

  5. #20
    Hold your machete tight! Personamanx's Avatar
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    Can't say as I've not read all of his Arena/Undercover but a lot of that can be tossed away with some mental gymnastics. Explanation of a character's absence may be deemed unnecessary if the potential role is not of much consequence. The design of Nico's staff changing back may just be a stylistic choice and deemed ultimately inconsequential. Like you said Old Lace came back, makes sense to not mention it as much as it would to mention it. And the Fistigons can just be explained as, he's consciously only using their fire capabilities.

    Ultimately having the last volume end on an unresolved cliffhanger (Chase's "I got better" during their "Daken" appearances isn't really resolution of everything that was going on in that arc) and having them appear elsewhere has made things difficult. Things are going to be really funny continuity wise for a long time. That's why I'm largely just trying to focus on how they're appearing somewhere and being written half-way into character.

    Also, Is Victor Mancha still dead?

  6. #21
    Astonishing Member Mahes's Avatar
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    Victor is still alive. He was in the recently cancelled Avengers AI series.
    Last edited by Mahes; 05-20-2014 at 12:55 PM. Reason: typo

  7. #22
    Hold your machete tight! Personamanx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mahes View Post
    Victor is still alive. He was in the recently cancelled Avengers AI series.
    Yeah, but he died in that didn't he? I could have sworn that someone told me that.

  8. #23
    Astonishing Member Mahes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Personamanx View Post
    Yeah, but he died in that didn't he? I could have sworn that someone told me that.
    He did? I stopped reading after the 1st arc. Not really a fan of Humphries and the book was stalling.

  9. #24
    Ultimate Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Personamanx View Post
    Yeah, but he died in that didn't he? I could have sworn that someone told me that.
    Yes. He died.
    He's back.
    Pfft, Robots.

  10. #25
    Y'know. Pav's Avatar
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    I became interested in Runaways when the second volume came out; I wasn't reading comics at the time, but then I saw Ricochet from Slingers on the cover of a then-upcoming issue and that was that.

    Some of you have Runaways like I still have Slingers, I imagine.

    BKV was great, of course, so to make a long story short, I've read their adventures up to their appearances in, like, Daken or Dark Wolverine or whatever it called itself at the time. Nor have I read much of the Academy/Undercover stuff.

    As a dude-type person, it's easy to identify with Chase and especially Victor, who was new to the comic right when I was. But as far as favorites go - I mean... it has to be Molly, right? The original creative team really hit the characterization of all the Runaways out of the park, but Molly is like the cherry on the cake I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Personamanx View Post
    Okay, same old song and dance when it comes to discussion on a long cancelled, short-lived title with a bunch of fans. Who would we all like to see take over the book in a hypothetical re-launch of the series? And how would you pitch it?
    Whoever takes it over has to have a story-telling approach similar to BKV. For me, K. Gillen is a no-brainer (if he was interested). The guy is as good as Dan Slott in his understanding, respect for, and ultimate usage of continuity to add beef to his storylines, but he is also simultaneously always focused on the characters rather than merely the plot.

    Also, I'd give Si Spurrier a chance, mostly because his Legion storyline in X:Leg was storytelling at its finest, and because he seems to be as creative and imaginative as anyone in the business right now. And a story about teenagers should be all about vision and therefore a visionary storytelling technique.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    Absorb them into the Marvel U already. The whole orphaned independence thing can only last so long.
    I definitely agree with you on that first point, but I don't think it and the second are mutually exclusive. The Runaways are a team of powerful kids orphaned by a gang of super villains; that's their origin, and it's a pretty stellar one because I think it gives us a reason to follow their adventures. I read because I want to know what they do with their freedom. But I think a writer would make the book more successful if s/he created more relationships among the Runaways and other established and even not-so-established *cough* Livewires *cough* characters.

    I still say Power Man & Iron Fist sets the example of what to do with two lesser-selling books.

    Dr. Strange and the Runaways has a ring to it, don't you think?

    Quote Originally Posted by Personamanx View Post
    Things are going to be really funny continuity wise for a long time. That's why I'm largely just trying to focus on how they're appearing somewhere and being written half-way into character. Also, Is Victor Mancha still dead?
    I think the right writer will know what to make of the weird continuity that arose due to the fourth volume. (I have pretty easy explanations in my head for story canon, for example.) Ultimately it might not matter if enough time passes; Marvel will potentially keep putting out collections of the first volume(s) and just sorta pretend some other stuff never happened.

    And then when the Runaways are a huge hit, some writer will mine all the neglected stuff for new stories.

    Oh, and as far as Victor goes - I've heard that while his body got destroyed in Avengers: AI, his consciousness still exists. Not sure if that's where his story is at the moment or not though, and it's all hearsay anyway, for what that's worth.

    -Pav, who (by the by) bought the Madrox LS along with Runaways Vol 2 and got fully sucked back into comic reading...
    Last edited by Pav; 05-20-2014 at 01:57 PM.
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  11. #26
    Amazing Member CartooN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    I think he wrote them well.
    Chase was the defensive loud mouth, while Nico was more playing it closer to the chest -- being smart about getting allies and what not. I was pleased. Even with Nico's tilt toward the dark -- I found it totally believable and it just made me empathize with her more.
    It was believable when Nico, pushed to her limits and returning from the brink of death, would suddenly rage at those who hurt her and her friends. It was towards the end, when Nico and Chase suddenly give up on everything and decide to get with the killing, that I disagreed with. The runaways have been through far worse, seen friends and family die. I don't think they would suddenly decide Bloodstone was too bigger a threat and needed to die.

    In fact, I remember a very similar occurrence in the Runaways original series. A monster is terrorising a city, trashing buildings and killing people. The runaways go in, but will not kill the monster, even though lives are at stake they still try to do good. It turned out the monster was a human and they did the right thing.

    So why they would at the drop of a hat decide monster Cullen was too much and needed to be killed is beyond me. I can't believe that they were simply "at the end of their tether".

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Personamanx View Post
    Can't say as I've not read all of his Arena/Undercover but a lot of that can be tossed away with some mental gymnastics. Explanation of a character's absence may be deemed unnecessary if the potential role is not of much consequence. The design of Nico's staff changing back may just be a stylistic choice and deemed ultimately inconsequential. Like you said Old Lace came back, makes sense to not mention it as much as it would to mention it. And the Fistigons can just be explained as, he's consciously only using their fire capabilities.

    Ultimately having the last volume end on an unresolved cliffhanger (Chase's "I got better" during their "Daken" appearances isn't really resolution of everything that was going on in that arc) and having them appear elsewhere has made things difficult. Things are going to be really funny continuity wise for a long time. That's why I'm largely just trying to focus on how they're appearing somewhere and being written half-way into character.

    Also, Is Victor Mancha still dead?
    Right or I could explain it as poor research.

    Be interesting to see what Hopeless does with Wilder.

  13. #28
    Fantastic Member jdgs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Personamanx View Post
    Can't say as I've not read all of his Arena/Undercover but a lot of that can be tossed away with some mental gymnastics. Explanation of a character's absence may be deemed unnecessary if the potential role is not of much consequence. The design of Nico's staff changing back may just be a stylistic choice and deemed ultimately inconsequential. Like you said Old Lace came back, makes sense to not mention it as much as it would to mention it. And the Fistigons can just be explained as, he's consciously only using their fire capabilities.
    Maybe I'm over thinking things but some other coincidences drove me to that conclusion, like Nico not trusting Chase's judgment at the beginning of Arena and Old Lace's absence. I haven't read volume 3 but at the end of BKV's run Nico wasn't happy with Chase, going as far as to speak about him as a potential danger rather than a team member even echoing what she said about Victor at the beginning of volume 2, fast forward to Arena and Nico is treating Chase with a cold attitude to the point of expelling him at the first sign of reckless attitude. Also in the last BKV issue it was implied that Old Lace gained complete independence from Chase when he disobeyed him, I think that would be a reasonable explanation as to why he isn't following him anymore (or at least it would have been if Gage hadn't written that 13 issue of Arena). Anyways, I guess it could be just one of my weird theories.

    Quote Originally Posted by CartooN View Post
    It was believable when Nico, pushed to her limits and returning from the brink of death, would suddenly rage at those who hurt her and her friends. It was towards the end, when Nico and Chase suddenly give up on everything and decide to get with the killing, that I disagreed with. The runaways have been through far worse, seen friends and family die. I don't think they would suddenly decide Bloodstone was too bigger a threat and needed to die.

    In fact, I remember a very similar occurrence in the Runaways original series. A monster is terrorising a city, trashing buildings and killing people. The runaways go in, but will not kill the monster, even though lives are at stake they still try to do good. It turned out the monster was a human and they did the right thing.

    So why they would at the drop of a hat decide monster Cullen was too much and needed to be killed is beyond me. I can't believe that they were simply "at the end of their tether".
    They didn't decide to get with the killing, they just wanted to get rid of Bloodstone. I read that as Nico having one of those uncontrollable rage episodes that she is having lately and Chase was all "She won't really kill him, but the guy is a danger so let her vent her frustrations for a while". It was reckless from his part but in no way he was supporting Nico killing Bloodstone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    Absorb them into the Marvel U already.
    The whole orphaned independence thing can only last so long. I'm ready to see them interact with the rest of the heroes more.
    I think there's still one big story that can be told about the Runaways and that's the one involving Alex's revenge. I always saw him as the one true nemesis of the Runaways. If the Runaways get a new series, I think it should be about Alex plotting his vengeance against the Runaways with the help of Zemo or some other villain. Give him control of the Young Masters and then form something like "The Pride of Evil" with the objective to recover Los Angeles and end the Runaways once and for all. Don't know if there's a writer at Marvel, skilled enough to write that story though.

    After that send Karolina to Avengers Academy, Nico to the Young Avengers, Victor stays with Pym, Chase gets a normal job in the entertainment world now that he's famous and Molly and Klara can safely retire at home. All still living together of course, to someday deal with the inevitable Alex new attack.

  14. #29
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    Meh Alex was interested in two things getting respect from dear old dad and getting the girl. I think we can safely say respect from dad is off the table. If he was interested in killing them he could have killed them when he knocked them all out and stole their stuff.

  15. #30
    Astonishing Member Arfguy's Avatar
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    I love the Runaways. Those first two volumes by Vaughan and Alphona are some of the most entertaining comics I've read in the last little while. Vaughan had been so hyped up prior to writing this book that I didn't think it could be true that he was that. I read some of his Marvel stuff and didn't like it.

    When Runaways was collected into the first hardcover, I thought I'd get it because the artist was so unique and crazy with his designs. I read the whole story in one sitting and couldn't wait until the second volume. Second volume just went above what the first volume established.

    It's hard to find a creative team that could use the Runaways character and make them shine as brightly as Vaughan and Alphona. I am loving what Alphona is doing with Ms. Marvel, so I'm hoping with him in the spotlight, some of it might rub off on the Runaways property and they may get someone who does something really original and unique.
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