"Red Sonja" Movie Springs Back to Life With New Writer

[Punisher007]

Because it's dumb and squicky. Gail doing away with it was one of best decisions that she's ever made as a writer. The whole "my whole family/village was butchered" is a good enough origin on it's own.

[Punisher007]

It's no worse than Conan's iconic 'furry nappy' though really, is it? If anything, it gives Sonja more protection, although that's not saying much.

The thing is the comics have spent several years getting across the idea that Sonja is so dangerous and effective a warrior that it's practically impossible for anyone to tag her in battle, so it doesn't really matter how little protection her outfit offers. If Sonja wears the same thing in the movie, you can guarantee that'll be the first thing that critics zero in on.

I still like the idea of Sonja wearing the metal bikini for a scene or so as a homage of sorts to the comic ... maybe in a harem, maybe in a gladiatorial arena, as was suggested. Maybe the film shows her starting off her career and building her rep in that outfit and then she wears more armour as she gets involved in larger-scale battles.

And I've NEVER bought that excuse. Because that's exactly what it is, an excuse to justify glorified want material. And if people can seriously look at those costumes above and say "well those are just not revealing enough. She needs to be MORE scantily-clad" then they've just proven that it's ALL about "sexiness," not about "well she's confident" or some such nonsense.

[Punisher007]

I think simple economics would prevent it from being an "R." This movie will be far from a slam-dunk and it can't afford to lock out so much of its potential audience. (Ahem... horny teenage boys.)

Well if they can keep the budget under control, while still making the movie look good of course, then it wouldn't have to do gangbuster numbers in order to be successful. And it's not like R-rated movies haven't done quite well at the box-office before, even recently.

[AndrewCrossett]

Because it's dumb and squicky. Gail doing away with it was one of best decisions that she's ever made as a writer. The whole "my whole family/village was butchered" is a good enough origin on it's own.

Other good decisions were the removal of the rape origin story, and letting Sonja get her fighting ability through her own efforts rather than from a goddess.

[Vanguard-01]

Other good decisions were the removal of the rape origin story, and letting Sonja get her fighting ability through her own efforts rather than from a goddess.

I agree that getting rid of the rape origin was a good idea. I'm also glad to see the Oath is now gone. That thing did Sonja no favors at all.

However? I'm not sure that Sonja's skills should be ENTIRELY from her own efforts. Some of the things she does just defies belief. The woman's slaughtered whole armies, killed demons and gods, slain ancient horrors, etc. It just seems that giving her at least SOME supernatural proficiency is a good idea to explain some of the impossible things she does.

[Calighoula]

I wouldn't say that the chainmail bikini is the character. It certainly wouldn't be enough to hang a movie on if it were.

It doesn't have to be in the entire film, but chainmail bikini'd Red Sonja is usually how she's depicted. When they made that awful Vampirella movie, they altered her getup and it looked stupid. Yeah, drawn the way she is, it's a wardrobe malfunction waiting to happen, but that's Vampirella.

I don't think the bodybuilder look would work. Sonja gets her workouts from aerobic exercise, not anaerobic like a bodybuilder does.

Yes.

I don't think Sonja has ever had a lesbian relationship in the comics. Just subtext. I never cared for that "no man may bed me unless he defeats me in battle" oath... Gail Simone did away with it, which I agreed with. I know it's a traditional part of her character, but if they do keep it I hope they subvert it. Having Sonja get around the oath by hooking up with another woman would be one way of doing that, but again... the studio would probably be way too terrified to go that way.

They're not going to do that. They also won't use the oath, but it is one of the things that made Red Sonja unique. If you take away too many of the aspects that makes her unique, she becomes just another female barbarian.

[AndrewCrossett]

However? I'm not sure that Sonja's skills should be ENTIRELY from her own efforts. Some of the things she does just defies belief. The woman's slaughtered whole armies, killed demons and gods, slain ancient horrors, etc. It just seems that giving her at least SOME supernatural proficiency is a good idea to explain some of the impossible things she does.

Well, Xena did all that stuff too and she usually had no supernatural help (well, except for that time when YHWH gave her the power to kill gods...) Of course, Xena was probably more over-the-top and campy than a Red Sonja movie would be.

It doesn't have to be in the entire film, but chainmail bikini'd Red Sonja is usually how she's depicted. When they made that awful Vampirella movie, they altered her getup and it looked stupid. Yeah, drawn the way she is, it's a wardrobe malfunction waiting to happen, but that's Vampirella.

I certainly don't mind looking at Jessica Biel (or whomever) in a chainmail bikini. But they will have to be sure to depict her as superhumanly agile and a spectacular defensive fighter, to explain how she can go into battle dressed like that and not come out looking like the Black Knight in Monty Python and the Holy Grail.

[Calighoula]

I certainly don't mind looking at Jessica Biel (or whomever) in a chainmail bikini. But they will have to be sure to depict her as superhumanly agile and a spectacular defensive fighter, to explain how she can go into battle dressed like that and not come out looking like the Black Knight in Monty Python and the Holy Grail.

She won't weigh as much as a man, so she'll be able to move. They'll probably give her additional protection, like chain mail sleeves. Besides, it's fantasy. You can get away with sh*t.

[Vanguard-01]

Well, Xena did all that stuff too and she usually had no supernatural help (well, except for that time when YHWH gave her the power to kill gods...) Of course, Xena was probably more over-the-top and campy than a Red Sonja movie would be.

Yeah, Xena didn't start killing gods until she had hind's blood, or that power from YHWH. Of course, the gods and demons in Xena were kinda weaksauce compared to the horrors that Sonja fights.

But, yeah. Come to think of it, Conan didn't have any supernatural backing that I recall. He was just a dude with a sword who could kill a god in one book, only to get captured by ordinary mortal soldiers in the next. Or so I've heard. I've never actually had a chance to read the books myself, but that's what I've heard from people who have.

If Conan can do impossible things without supernatural powers, then I suppose Sonja can as well.

[Agent Z]

Well, Xena did all that stuff too and she usually had no supernatural help (well, except for that time when YHWH gave her the power to kill gods...) Of course, Xena was probably more over-the-top and campy than a Red Sonja movie would be.



I certainly don't mind looking at Jessica Biel (or whomever) in a chainmail bikini. But they will have to be sure to depict her as superhumanly agile and a spectacular defensive fighter, to explain how she can go into battle dressed like that and not come out looking like the Black Knight in Monty Python and the Holy Grail.

Wasn't it going to be revealed that Xena was a demigoddess or something?

[AndrewCrossett]

Wasn't it going to be revealed that Xena was a demigoddess or something?

Not that I know of. There were suggestions at one point that she might have been Ares' daughter, which IMO would have been dumb and pretty much redefined squickiness.

She turned down the chance to become a goddess (by eating ambrosia) on one occasion.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

I was just guessing that they'd want Sonja to have some sort of a romantic interest or two in the movie as they did with Conan in Arnold's movie...maybe she'll have a male and female companion where both want to sleep with her and they leave it up to the audience to some degree...

Sonja is more than the chainmail bikini yes but I was just saying that it's her signature look whether you love it or hate it, and using the oath would push the story towards the bi angle, especially if they don't seem to have her interested in men but friendly with women.

In the old Conan cartoon he did have a magic sword but...

[conradknightsocks]

I agree that getting rid of the rape origin was a good idea. I'm also glad to see the Oath is now gone. That thing did Sonja no favors at all.

However? I'm not sure that Sonja's skills should be ENTIRELY from her own efforts. Some of the things she does just defies belief. The woman's slaughtered whole armies, killed demons and gods, slain ancient horrors, etc. It just seems that giving her at least SOME supernatural proficiency is a good idea to explain some of the impossible things she does.

Absolutely agreed. If anything, Sonja generally battles stiffer opposition than Conan, taking on monsters and supernatural creatures more often than he does. Scathath can still be involved in the story and can have granted Sonja special skills and athletic ability but there's no need for the oath to be associated with that or another way could be found for Sonja to be stripped of those attributes.

Gail's Sonja is basically a talented athlete with exceptional natural hunting and tracking skills. Before that, Sonja was damn-near superhuman with unparalleled skill with weapons - she was pretty much Xena and even superior in some ways. I prefer her like that because it means she doesn't spend her time brawling with thugs, the writers have to throw some real threats her way.

What was REALLY interesting about the Sonja stories pre-Simone was her personality and how she interacted with other characters and I had a lot of time for writers who moved her away from being essentially a female Conan.

[Jared]

I agree that getting rid of the rape origin was a good idea. I'm also glad to see the Oath is now gone. That thing did Sonja no favors at all.

However? I'm not sure that Sonja's skills should be ENTIRELY from her own efforts. Some of the things she does just defies belief. The woman's slaughtered whole armies, killed demons and gods, slain ancient horrors, etc. It just seems that giving her at least SOME supernatural proficiency is a good idea to explain some of the impossible things she does.

I'd just have her obtain a magical sword and/or other equipment, like many great heroes do. Maybe those can be gifts from the goddess that she earns, but I never liked the idea that she'd been bestowed with super strength and skill by a god.

[QUOTE=Calighoula;1053942]It doesn't have to be in the entire film, but chainmail bikini'd Red Sonja is usually how she's depicted. When they made that awful Vampirella movie, they altered her getup and it looked stupid. Yeah, drawn the way she is, it's a wardrobe malfunction waiting to happen, but that's Vampirella.

If the whole movie were done in an exaggerated hyper-stylized way, ala 300, then she could conceivably wear the metal bikini or anything else and probably get away with it. At least the promo art from when McGowan and Rodriguiez were attached indicated they might have been going that direction. I think McGowan would have been terrible though. And while I might buy her in any costume, I don't think I could overlook a face that has *obviously* had lot of work done. Did they have many plastic surgeons in the Hyborian Age?

They're not going to do that. They also won't use the oath, but it is one of the things that made Red Sonja unique. If you take away too many of the aspects that makes her unique, she becomes just another female barbarian.

I think the way to handle the oath would be to have it be something Sonja herself makes up as a way to brush guys off from bothering her...or to instigate a fight when she wants one.

As for casting, maybe Adrianne Palicki or Gina Carano? The former is a better actress, the latter would be a better fighter. Either would do better than Bridgitte Nielson in all areas, though.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

If you want iirc the commentary for the Scorpion King movie The Rock mentions that several of the women playing extras had a lot of work done in the silicone department and that he doubted that they had that technology back when the movie was set or whatever...perhaps if the movie is set in a very sandy place the bikini would work for that...guess it depends on how "sexy" they want to make the movie, how much fanservice they want to use and all of that...