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  1. #2536
    Astonishing Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omega Alpha View Post
    Guess we know which group you are in...
    I'm in the group that recognizes the agency of the people involved. You belong in the group that chooses to infantilize them.
    "The Marvel EIC Chair has a certain curse that goes along with it: it tends to drive people insane, and ultimately, out of the business altogether. It is the notorious last stop for many staffers, as once you've sat in The Big Chair, your pariah status is usually locked in." Christopher Priest

  2. #2537
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony W View Post
    I'm in the group that recognizes the agency of the people involved. You belong in the group that chooses to infantilize them.
    And yet, you're ignoring the agency of Ellis.

  3. #2538
    Better than YOU! Alan2099's Avatar
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    If you actually look at people's accusations towards Ellis, the majority of them are people who got dumped and are sad about it. They got involved with a man sexually and then later felt ashamed by it. It is not the sole responsibility of Warren Ellis to make you feel good about consentual interactions after the fact.

    Some people seem to think that being famous automatically makes you confident, emotionally stable, happy, etc. If that was true, famous people wouldn't seek the adoration of fans, peers, etc. He engaged in sexual acts with other consenting adults that were then upset that they didn't get more than he was willing to offer. Where is the actual crime?

    What Warren did was a morally ambiguous, at worse, a bit scuzzy, but by no means abusive.

  4. #2539
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan2099 View Post
    If you actually look at people's accusations towards Ellis, the majority of them are people who got dumped and are sad about it. They got involved with a man sexually and then later felt ashamed by it. It is not the sole responsibility of Warren Ellis to make you feel good about consentual interactions after the fact.

    Some people seem to think that being famous automatically makes you confident, emotionally stable, happy, etc. If that was true, famous people wouldn't seek the adoration of fans, peers, etc. He engaged in sexual acts with other consenting adults that were then upset that they didn't get more than he was willing to offer. Where is the actual crime?

    What Warren did was a morally ambiguous, at worse, a bit scuzzy, but by no means abusive.
    What I wonder about is whether a few of these couplings were like a "casting couch" where something was promised or implied to the ladies and Ellis failed to deliver post-coitus.

  5. #2540
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan2099 View Post
    If you actually look at people's accusations towards Ellis, the majority of them are people who got dumped and are sad about it. They got involved with a man sexually and then later felt ashamed by it. It is not the sole responsibility of Warren Ellis to make you feel good about consentual interactions after the fact.

    Some people seem to think that being famous automatically makes you confident, emotionally stable, happy, etc. If that was true, famous people wouldn't seek the adoration of fans, peers, etc. He engaged in sexual acts with other consenting adults that were then upset that they didn't get more than he was willing to offer. Where is the actual crime?

    What Warren did was a morally ambiguous, at worse, a bit scuzzy, but by no means abusive.
    Again, Ellis is himself doesn't see it that way, so I don't know why anyone's bothering giving him excuses. He sure doesn't see his behavior as defensible.

  6. #2541

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    I hardly care about the "real life" of any comic book artist (or writer, actor, musician, or whatever), only about their work. So I have no idea what are all talking about. What did Warren Ellis do, exactly? What has happened?

  7. #2542
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omega Alpha View Post
    Guess we know which group you are in...
    Painted a pretty clear picture, didn't he?
    Keep in mind that you have about as much chance of changing my mind as I do of changing yours.

  8. #2543
    Astonishing Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phonogram12 View Post
    Painted a pretty clear picture, didn't he?
    Yeah, I believe in agency. If you believe that is controversial than these should really send you for a loop!

    The only reason we care about Quicksilver is because he is Magneto's son. He is Scarlet Witch's brother. He is Crystal's husband. He is Luna's father. As a speedster, we just don't care.

    Marvel just can't or won't create a viable speedster, flying doesn't count! The reason why is the reason why Marvel can spit out Superman analogous. Pay attention Blue Marvel fans. I'm also about to explain why Blue Marvel will never catch on as well!

    Superman is so at odds with Marvel Comics that they can't help but create him in different forms over and over again. All these forms have one thing in common.

    To reinforce the idea that Marvel is better than DC.

    Sentry is nuts.
    Hyperion tried to take over the world, in the only story he was in that actually mattered.The Gruenwald series is the only one that matters. Remember when I said in an earlier post that some characters only have one or a limited number of stories to tell?

    Blue Marvel doesn't really exist to dunk on DC like the other two so....he just takes up space.

    It's not just Superman. It's the entire Justice League, except Batman and the Flash.

    The Flash is just a nice guy with a science background that runs very fast and Marvel has no idea how to handle that.

    Marvel stays awake at night trying to figure out why they don't have a Batman. They are focusing too much on the surface aspects. Shadows and pain draw people to Batman but what keeps them coming back is his competence. Marvel hates competent heroes. Talk to any Black Panther fan.
    "The Marvel EIC Chair has a certain curse that goes along with it: it tends to drive people insane, and ultimately, out of the business altogether. It is the notorious last stop for many staffers, as once you've sat in The Big Chair, your pariah status is usually locked in." Christopher Priest

  9. #2544
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    They really need to slow down on the comic events. I like the occasional event every now again but not every single year.

  10. #2545
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    Big events are "booster shots" but the benefit is limited and temporary when Marvel or DC Comics' body systems (the mutants, the Avengers, the Bat family, the JLA, the Spider verse, etc.) are in weak shape by themselves.

  11. #2546
    Mighty Member Doom'nGloom's Avatar
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    What I'm about to write isn't an opinion specific to marvel comics, it's my general sentiment about all of fiction. I like reading about well written villains and anti-heroes much more than straight up heroes. It's not easy to be a hero but it's easy to have a good reason to do the right thing. I think it's much harder to be a bastard and somehow somewhat justify your actions in the minds of the readers. When it's pulled off well, a villains or anti-heros mindset is much more fascinating to me. Of course here I don't mean one note baddies like Carnage or Red Skull. There aren't many villains as well developed as its heroes in marvel but the ones that are (Doom, Magneto etc.) are more interesting to read for me than your average Spideys and Caps which are dime a dozen in the medium nowadays.

  12. #2547

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doom'nGloom View Post
    What I'm about to write isn't an opinion specific to marvel comics, it's my general sentiment about all of fiction. I like reading about well written villains and anti-heroes much more than straight up heroes. It's not easy to be a hero but it's easy to have a good reason to do the right thing. I think it's much harder to be a bastard and somehow somewhat justify your actions in the minds of the readers. When it's pulled off well, a villains or anti-heros mindset is much more fascinating to me. Of course here I don't mean one note baddies like Carnage or Red Skull. There aren't many villains as well developed as its heroes in marvel but the ones that are (Doom, Magneto etc.) are more interesting to read for me than your average Spideys and Caps which are dime a dozen in the medium nowadays.
    I get that. It's why I liked reading the loki series and Deathstroke/Black Adam by Christopher Priest.

  13. #2548
    Mighty Member Doom'nGloom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the illustrious mr. kenway View Post
    I get that. It's why I liked reading the loki series and Deathstroke/Black Adam by Christopher Priest.
    In general I think dc does a better job with its villains compared to marvel as there are more well developed high profile villains over there. Black Adam, Deathstroke, Sinestro, Lex Luthor, Ra's Al Ghul, Guardians when they act like authoritarian jerks and some more. Funnily enough I think their biggest villain, the Joker, is extremely one note, the same way I feel about Norman Osborn who is arguably the biggest Spidey villain.

  14. #2549
    Extraordinary Member Galerion's Avatar
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    I generally agree with the sentiment though I will say it doesn't matter if they are heroes, anti-heroes or villains. They just need some flaws or some edge to them. Heroes who are always morally right, never do or say anything wrong and preach about things like not killing just absolutely bore me.

    I simply prefer people with flaws over the shining paragons of virtue types.
    "This is me being reasonable"

  15. #2550

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doom'nGloom View Post
    In general I think dc does a better job with its villains compared to marvel as there are more well developed high profile villains over there. Black Adam, Deathstroke, Sinestro, Lex Luthor, Ra's Al Ghul, Guardians when they act like authoritarian jerks and some more. Funnily enough I think their biggest villain, the Joker, is extremely one note, the same way I feel about Norman Osborn who is arguably the biggest Spidey villain.
    The only time the Joker interested me as a lead was the Telltale games.

    I don't mind Coates and Ridley's take on Black Panther. It feels like here's Tchalla after all of his recent misadventures. His sins come home to roost kinda thing.
    Last edited by the illustrious mr. kenway; 12-05-2022 at 06:11 AM.

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