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  1. #1651

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beware Of Geek View Post
    In my opinion, only…

    PROS:
    `
    Zelma Stanton.
    The Bar With No Doors and its regulars
    The shapeshifting Cloak of Levitation.
    Bachalo's art.

    CONS:

    The characterization of Strange, Wong, and the Ancient One (in flashback).
    Stephen's Frank Zappa-looking 'stache and his Renfaire wannabe redesign.
    The Empirikul.
    Mister Misery.
    Depowering Stephen (again) and replacing his powers with that blasted axe.
    The "price of magic" that showed up in no other book and basically affected no other character, especially the whole "unable to eat human food" bit.
    The "death of magic", which ALSO showed up in no other book and basically affected no other character.
    The pacing. By the Vishanti, it took forever to get anything done.

    Aaron is a good (not great) writer, and has created some interesting characters and concepts. But I would opine that he prefers to warp existing characters to fit his ideas, rather than adapt to what has come before. If his run had been about a completely new character, it would rate a lot higher in my book, but as it is, it's a decent story about magic, but a piss-poor one about Doctor Strange.
    It sounds like the typical problem I see with many writers, good ideas but bad execution. Another is not taking the time to truly learn the character and their history.

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Warren View Post
    I'm absolutely loving it.

    I was slightly skeptical going in, like a lot of fans, simply because of the de-powered angle.

    But I should've known Waid would do something good with it. He's really got a handle on this book. As much as I enjoyed Cates' run, I'm even more impressed with what Waid's doing.

    Issue #4 legitimately blew my mind by introducing a way of viewing Strange that had never occurred to me in decades of reading him.

    That's a sign of a brilliant writer and I can't wait to see where Waid takes Strange going forward.

    And, of course, the beautiful Saiz art makes the whole package that much better.
    Waid, as far as I'm concerned is usually outstanding. I'm not sure why Marvel writers have a fixation with depowering characters. I want to see writers go back to more imaginative use of it, not subduing it. With that said, I hope Waid takes Strange there.
    "Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk could have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!" - Tales to Astonish #63

    "Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind" - Lord Smash'emall aka Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Gamma Irradiated Being

  2. #1652
    Dark Dimension Clea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beware Of Geek View Post
    Well, if Dormammu's realm lacks linear time, it's impossible for her to grow up as his niece.

    Easiest solution would be to have Umar be the villain, and use her Faltine heritage directly, rather than just part of their backstory. That way, Clea would still be the offspring of the Big Bad™, without having to worry about retconning the first film.

    You could have her be a worshipper/acolyte of Dormy if you wanted to bring the Mindless Ones and/or the Guranthic Guardian along.
    The Dark Dimension doesn't operate by the same laws of space time as the Earth dimension, so there's no reason why the various alien races that live there on multiple planets (including Clea's home planet), couldn't be born and age and die. It's entirely plausible that parts of the Dark Dimension lack linear time, but other parts do have linear time because the Dark Dimension is just that odd. The Faltine beings are pure spirit, but Clea is only half Faltine. Her father was a humanoid alien (a Mhuruuk). I don't think they'd need to alter her origin at all. I hope they don't, because Clea's weird origin story is one of the things I like about her. I do agree with you about bringing Umar into the MCU, though. She's a great villain.
    Live Faust, Die Jung.

  3. #1653
    Old-School Otaku DigiCom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clea View Post
    The Dark Dimension doesn't operate by the same laws of space time as the Earth dimension, so there's no reason why the various alien races that live there on multiple planets (including Clea's home planet), couldn't be born and age and die.
    You're thinking about the comics. In the MCU, there's no evidence that there are other planets in the Dark Dimension, or even other residents. Sure, there _could_ be, but Occam's razor suggests what we saw is what we've got.

  4. #1654
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gamma Irradiated Being View Post
    Waid, as far as I'm concerned is usually outstanding. I'm not sure why Marvel writers have a fixation with depowering characters. I want to see writers go back to more imaginative use of it, not subduing it. With that said, I hope Waid takes Strange there.
    It's not actually just a greater problem with the Superman effect: an overpowered character is depowered, learns how dangerous powers are and curtails them, or fights a threat greater than or equal to the character. People aren't exactly creative with breaking out of this mold.

  5. #1655

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    Quote Originally Posted by U.N. Owen View Post
    It's not actually just a greater problem with the Superman effect: an overpowered character is depowered, learns how dangerous powers are and curtails them, or fights a threat greater than or equal to the character. People aren't exactly creative with breaking out of this mold.
    True. It's become a redundant theme.
    "Only the Hulk could have attempted it! Only the Hulk could have been capable of it! Only the Hulk could have done it!" - Tales to Astonish #63

    "Hulk can do ANYTHING!!! Hulk is mind over matter, mind over energy, mind over mind" - Lord Smash'emall aka Gamma Ra the Assassin aka Gamma Irradiated Being

  6. #1656
    Jewish & Proud Feminist Shadowcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beware Of Geek View Post
    You're thinking about the comics. In the MCU, there's no evidence that there are other planets in the Dark Dimension, or even other residents. Sure, there _could_ be, but Occam's razor suggests what we saw is what we've got.
    There was no exploration of the Dark Dimension tho. Just like with Ant-Man & the Wasp, that gave us further exploration of the microverse, Doctor Strange 2 could deal with “Into the Dark Dimension”, so to speak.

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  8. #1658
    Old-School Otaku DigiCom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beware Of Geek View Post
    I didn't like the way it started (depowered AGAIN?), but the last issue was great. There aren't many comics nowadays that can make me say "Now, why didn't I think of that?"

    (Oddly, the only major magic tool I can think of that Stephen crafted was also a "forge": the Gaian forge from the Quinn run. And even that was made up of other people's artifacts.)

    My only real concern, based on upcoming solicits, is the idea that spoilers:
    this isn't the real Stephen Strange, which is why his memory is wonky.
    end of spoilers

    It would be a shame if spoilers:
    all this character development went to waste.
    end of spoilers
    Called it.

    That being said, there is a distinct possibility, based solely on upcoming covers that spoilers:
    we've been following the real Strange in this run, and the guy with Bats is something else.
    end of spoilers

    At the very least spoilers:
    Waid!Strange will be around after this arc.
    end of spoilers

  9. #1659
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beware Of Geek View Post
    Called it.

    That being said, there is a distinct possibility, based solely on upcoming covers that spoilers:
    we've been following the real Strange in this run, and the guy with Bats is something else.
    end of spoilers

    At the very least spoilers:
    Waid!Strange will be around after this arc.
    end of spoilers
    Really dug the new issue. Some really cool moments with the new weaponry. We'll see how the last page twist plays out but this run hasn't let me down yet.

  10. #1660
    Incredible Member Indian Ink's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beware Of Geek View Post
    In my opinion, only…

    PROS:
    `
    Zelma Stanton.
    The Bar With No Doors and its regulars
    The shapeshifting Cloak of Levitation.
    Bachalo's art.

    CONS:

    The characterization of Strange, Wong, and the Ancient One (in flashback).
    Stephen's Frank Zappa-looking 'stache and his Renfaire wannabe redesign.
    The Empirikul.
    Mister Misery.
    Depowering Stephen (again) and replacing his powers with that blasted axe.
    The "price of magic" that showed up in no other book and basically affected no other character, especially the whole "unable to eat human food" bit.
    The "death of magic", which ALSO showed up in no other book and basically affected no other character.
    The pacing. By the Vishanti, it took forever to get anything done.

    Aaron is a good (not great) writer, and has created some interesting characters and concepts. But I would opine that he prefers to warp existing characters to fit his ideas, rather than adapt to what has come before. If his run had been about a completely new character, it would rate a lot higher in my book, but as it is, it's a decent story about magic, but a piss-poor one about Doctor Strange.
    Pretty much in complete agreement with this.

    In the PRO'S; I think that Zelma Stanton was a very good character, but replaceable by some previous ones. The shapeshifting cloak I'm not remembering very well, but that might have been an addition due to the excellent work of Bachalo. Which I'm understandingly not giving Aaron much credit for.

    IF we can only save one thing from Aaron's run it would be, The Bar Without Doors. A truly great idea, and future writers would do well to keep some form of it.

    In the CONS; I can't see how of Aaron's cost of magic idea, or at least his version of it, was supposed to be of any long term story telling advantage. Beyond his short run. Past a certain point, you'd have to start asking, why isn't Strange dead yet?! And how Aaron even thought it might be a long term solution to the imagined problem of over powered magic. And I don't think he did. I believe Aaron came up with a 'Cost of Magic' story, and then shoehorned it into Doctor Strange because he thought that was the only opportunity he was going to have to tell it.

  11. #1661
    Old-School Otaku DigiCom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Indian Ink View Post
    Pretty much in complete agreement with this.

    In the PRO'S; I think that Zelma Stanton was a very good character, but replaceable by some previous ones. The shapeshifting cloak I'm not remembering very well, but that might have been an addition due to the excellent work of Bachalo. Which I'm understandingly not giving Aaron much credit for.
    Well, I don't know if it was in the scripts or not, but I liked the bits where it changed into a scarf, etc.

    IF we can only save one thing from Aaron's run it would be, The Bar Without Doors. A truly great idea, and future writers would do well to keep some form of it.
    Agreed.
    In the CONS; I can't see how of Aaron's cost of magic idea, or at least his version of it, was supposed to be of any long term story telling advantage. Beyond his short run. Past a certain point, you'd have to start asking, why isn't Strange dead yet?! And how Aaron even thought it might be a long term solution to the imagined problem of over powered magic. And I don't think he did. I believe Aaron came up with a 'Cost of Magic' story, and then shoehorned it into Doctor Strange because he thought that was the only opportunity he was going to have to tell it.
    Also agreed.

  12. #1662
    Spectacular Member origami's Avatar
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    Based on issue 5, I think DS is now in contention as Marvel's sexiest man of 2018...

  13. #1663
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beware Of Geek View Post
    Currently one of the best comic books art wise is Doctor Strange.
    Story wise it had been a great series as well.

  14. #1664
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    Quote Originally Posted by whiteshark View Post
    Currently one of the best comic books art wise is Doctor Strange.
    Story wise it had been a great series as well.
    For the first time in a very long time I have been enjoying the comic, story as well as art. Not quite sure where they are going with revelations in newest issue, but I have a little more faith in the writer and will give him a chance to tell his story. No matter what, it will be pretty.

  15. #1665
    IRON MAN Tony Stark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whiteshark View Post
    Currently one of the best comic books art wise is Doctor Strange.
    Story wise it had been a great series as well.
    It really is. I didn't really read Strange's comics until a few years ago, but I have liked him more and more as I've read him and he has become one of my all time favorite comic characters.
    Last edited by Tony Stark; 09-20-2018 at 10:35 PM.
    "We live in a world of cowards. We live in a world full of small minds who are afraid. We are ruled by those who refuse to risk anything of their own. Who guard their over bloated paucities of power with money. With false reasoning. With measured hesitance. With prideful, recalcitrant inaction. With hateful invective. With weapons. F@#K these selfish fools and their prevailing world order." Tony Stark

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