John Byrne's Wonder Woman

[md62]

What I liked about Bryne's run: Diana vs Darkseid. Hippolyta as the GA WW (I know a lot of readers hated this). I also thought Phil Jimenez expanded this concept even better in his run. The JSA arc (I liked it enough that I wished Bryne would write a JSA series).

What I didn't like: Diana became a guest star in her own book. The convoluted backstory of Donna. Cassie as the new Wonder Girl.

[Carabas]

After Crisis, the JSA's Wonder Woman void was filled by Fury(Helena), Miss America, Hawkgirl, and Liberty Belle. The writers kept changing their minds about who filled Diana's role on the team. Once Hippolyta went back in time as Wonder Woman, everything was stable with the JSA for about a decade until DC unretconned that change.

I don't see any void that badly needed filling. Superman got Iron Munro, Batman got... I don't know. Did he even get a replacement? I see absolutely no reason for there to have been an in-continuity Wonder Woman in the JSA in the 40's.

Aso for the damage to Donna Troy, that also started right after Crisis with Wolfman's Titans of Myth injection.

I see that more as fixing the damage Crisis did as best as they could, and what Byrne did doubling down on blind pre-Crisis nostalgia, rendering Donna into a time-displaced version of Diana.

[SeanT]

What I liked about Bryne's run: Diana vs Darkseid.

What "versus"? Darkseid came to Paradise Island thinking he'd find the anti-life equation, he slaughtered thousands of Amazons, and the most Diana did was leap at him-- and miss, because he disappeared. Imagine if Darkseid came to Metropolis and killed thousands of citizens and Superman never touched him, and never sought revenge? It wouldn't happen.

Nevermind that Hippolyta later attacked a hologram of Darkseid and knocked herself out. Even Donna noted it was kind of embarrassing.

[md62]

I don't see any void that badly needed filling. Superman got Iron Munro, Batman got... I don't know. Did he even get a replacement?

Flying Fox.

fox.jpg

What "versus"? Darkseid came to Paradise Island thinking he'd find the anti-life equation, he slaughtered thousands of Amazons, and the most Diana did was leap at him-- and miss, because he disappeared.

I guess my memory is a bit hazy about this arc...

[Agent Z]

What "versus"? Darkseid came to Paradise Island thinking he'd find the anti-life equation, he slaughtered thousands of Amazons, and the most Diana did was leap at him-- and miss, because he disappeared. Imagine if Darkseid came to Metropolis and killed thousands of citizens and Superman never touched him, and never sought revenge? It wouldn't happen.

Nevermind that Hippolyta later attacked a hologram of Darkseid and knocked herself out. Even Donna noted it was kind of embarrassing.

Phil Jiminez made up for this later by having Diana infuse a bit of her soul in Darkseid causing him to feel compassion and thus traumatizing him. In fact, this was apparently the reason he was such a joke until Final Crisis.

[Razor Tiara]

Phil Jiminez made up for this later by having Diana infuse a bit of her soul in Darkseid causing him to feel compassion and thus traumatizing him. In fact, this was apparently the reason he was such a joke until Final Crisis.

In my estimation it was too little, too late. The outcome wasn't satisfying at all. In the first place Byrne's story only served to slaughter half of the Amazons unnecessarily. Then after Phil's "fix" Granny Goodness impersonated Athena and caused Amazons Attack, a fact Diana has yet to find out about or address. Later on Apokalips desecrated Olympus with no repercussions, so the Wonder Woman mythos still haven't gotten proper revenge on the Fourth World, despite the sword to Darkseid's eye. And lets not forget the suspicious three day "healing coma" that happened recently on New Genesis.

[dcdrew]

When I 1st read Perez's NEW Wonder Woman in 1986 I thought the 1st few issues were flashback like Man of Steel and Batman Year 1 and happened YEARS ago! Then in January 1987 I read Legends mini-series #6 and Wonder Woman was appearing in the PRESENT for the 1st time to other DC heroes! *Didn't they wonder why WW looked like Donna Troy Wonder GIRL? This totally screwed up Donna and while I did not mind her new connection to Titans of Myth I did NOT like cutting her ties to Wonder WOMAN!

I did NOT like Byrne's WW the art at 1st looked like an Image comic. WW #101 was WORST WW COVER I had ever seen! Diana's new cop friend looked like Byrne's character in Babe mini-series! Darkseid killed HALF Amazons! Diana loses her hand and turns to stone then crumbles to bits! Neron KILLS Diana and an AUTOPSY is performed on her! (How SICK is that!) Diana becomes a goddess. Hippolyte is retconned as Golden Age WW making Diana 2nd WW! Donna is Diana's mirror twin and is put through 1000 tragic lives! What did Byrne have against Diana and Donna? Perez and Wolfman should have come up with a better Wonder GIRL origin Donna as Diana's lost sister who is raised in America!

I hope if and when Donna is introduced in New 52 she can finally be fixed unlike Wally West!

[Blacksun]

Yep! Byrnes WW got tortured a LOT- let's not forget the issue with Neron and Etrigan where she was crucified and worked over with a branding iron (a scene Byrne felt even deserved to be included in a flashback retelling in the very next issue.)

Throw in another torture scene where Artemis is strapped down and being asphyxiated by an evil pillow (no, I'm not kidding) and you pretty much have what could be described as the most exploitative run on the book post Crisis, surpassing even Deodato's blatant Cheesecake Factory, and that's saying something.

evil pillow? wth

more cheesecake than deodato wth #2

I might really slip this run for sure

When I 1st read Perez's NEW Wonder Woman in 1986 I thought the 1st few issues were flashback like Man of Steel and Batman Year 1 and happened YEARS ago! Then in January 1987 I read Legends mini-series #6 and Wonder Woman was appearing in the PRESENT for the 1st time to other DC heroes! *Didn't they wonder why WW looked like Donna Troy Wonder GIRL? This totally screwed up Donna and while I did not mind her new connection to Titans of Myth I did NOT like cutting her ties to Wonder WOMAN!

I did NOT like Byrne's WW the art at 1st looked like an Image comic. WW #101 was WORST WW COVER I had ever seen! Diana's new cop friend looked like Byrne's character in Babe mini-series! Darkseid killed HALF Amazons! Diana loses her hand and turns to stone then crumbles to bits! Neron KILLS Diana and an AUTOPSY is performed on her! (How SICK is that!) Diana becomes a goddess. Hippolyte is retconned as Golden Age WW making Diana 2nd WW! Donna is Diana's mirror twin and is put through 1000 tragic lives! What did Byrne have against Diana and Donna? Perez and Wolfman should have come up with a better Wonder GIRL origin Donna as Diana's lost sister who is raised in America!

I hope if and when Donna is introduced in New 52 she can finally be fixed unlike Wally West!

this is depressing. and I thought new 52 was dark

[Thor2014]

When I 1st read Perez's NEW Wonder Woman in 1986 I thought the 1st few issues were flashback like Man of Steel and Batman Year 1 and happened YEARS ago! Then in January 1987 I read Legends mini-series #6 and Wonder Woman was appearing in the PRESENT for the 1st time to other DC heroes! *Didn't they wonder why WW looked like Donna Troy Wonder GIRL? This totally screwed up Donna and while I did not mind her new connection to Titans of Myth I did NOT like cutting her ties to Wonder WOMAN!

I did NOT like Byrne's WW the art at 1st looked like an Image comic. WW #101 was WORST WW COVER I had ever seen! Diana's new cop friend looked like Byrne's character in Babe mini-series! Darkseid killed HALF Amazons! Diana loses her hand and turns to stone then crumbles to bits! Neron KILLS Diana and an AUTOPSY is performed on her! (How SICK is that!) Diana becomes a goddess. Hippolyte is retconned as Golden Age WW making Diana 2nd WW! Donna is Diana's mirror twin and is put through 1000 tragic lives! What did Byrne have against Diana and Donna? Perez and Wolfman should have come up with a better Wonder GIRL origin Donna as Diana's lost sister who is raised in America!

I hope if and when Donna is introduced in New 52 she can finally be fixed unlike Wally West!

Didn't Perez say once that at one point his first arc was supposed to be set in the past but then editorial decided to set it in the present day. I recall the same thing happening with the Hawkworld mini which opened up a whole mess of continuity worms for Hawkman. I thought it was silly that Wonder Girl existed before Wonder Woman, it was probably assumed that Wonder Woman was inspired by Wonder Girl and took the name to honor her not vice versa as it should've been.

[brettc1]

Didn't Perez say once that at one point his first arc was supposed to be set in the past but then editorial decided to set it in the present day. I recall the same thing happening with the Hawkworld mini which opened up a whole mess of continuity worms for Hawkman. I thought it was silly that Wonder Girl existed before Wonder Woman, it was probably assumed that Wonder Woman was inspired by Wonder Girl and took the name to honor her not vice versa as it should've been.

This actually makes a lot of sense, considering it's much like what they did with Byrne's Man Of Steel, which told the first few up years of Superman's career in six issues.

[coveredinbees]

He gave me Hippolyta as Wonder Woman, therefore his run was flawless, save for the art and that thing with the Anartcicans.
Polly Athena was the funniest alias since Diana Prince.

[SJNeal]

Byrne's WW was ****, through and through.

At the time, I was super excited because I still equated him with great runs on Superman and a dozen Marvel properties. By the last page of #101 I was ready for him to be gone, but somehow found the strength to wade through 3 yrs of his dreck...

[Thor2014]

Byrne just didn't seemed that interested in Diana. He propped Hippolyta up at the expense of Diana, that was unexcusabe IMO.

[PauloIapetus]

Thanks for sharing this. I could see this being the case as George always seemed very fond of both Diana and Donna.

George Pérez comments in that interview published in Fantagraphics's Titans Companion sort of suggests something like this when he states that "the modern introduction of Wonder Woman in Patriarch's World was already mapped out in front of me"

Also we know for a fact that something like this, actualy, happened with Timoth Truman's Hawkworld miniseries....

"It’s really hard to do three, 48-page books back to back, especially when you’re writing and drawing them," Truman says. "At the end of Hawkworld, I was totally exhausted, but I was very satisfied with the story and thought that I had said what I wanted to say. But they still wanted my name attached to it, and was asked to become part of the regular series, but I really wasn’t interested in it. Mike asked about if I’d come on if John [Ostrander] co-wrote it, and I figured it be a great book for John to do, so I said yes."

Truman, Ostrander and Gold met in DC’s offices to hash out the plans for the regular series, and that’s when the problem started. "Mike’s stipulation at the meeting was that Hawkman had to come to earth in a ‘YearOne’ type of format," Truman says. "Mike wanted it set in modern day, which would have made the Year One story set in the present DC Universe. I was realty opposed to that from the beginning, because of the continuity aspects involved, and it really didn’t jibe with what I was trying to establish, that all this backstory could work with things that had gone before."

In other words – in Truman’s mind, the events in Hawkworldwere happening on Thanagar around the same time the Martian Manhunter came to earth, starting the modern age of heroes in the DCU. Just as Byrne’s revamped Superman, Perez’ Wonder Woman and to a lesser extent Frank Miller’s Batman stories were all revitalized origins of the characters, so too was Hawkworld. The Katar Hol who’d been around the DCU during the modern age was the same Katar Hol who was exiled to the Downside and fought corruption on Thanagar. The only niggling point in Truman’s version is why Katar went from wearing a paramilitary outfit in his past to themore feathered look he had in the then present ‘80s.

"My whole take on Hawkworld, and this is where the whole thing went wrong – my Hawkman, the wholeThanagar story happened before he joined the JLA," Truman explains. "When I finished my story, I thought it worked pretty well with what Gar had established in his origin story years before. It’s got all the characters in it that work in the series– it had things in there that could fit within the DC universe. It was just a meatier background for him, not an entirely new one that would require all this mess."

"I figured that Mike knew what he was doing and the series was in good hands with John," Truman says. "Basically, John came up with all the plots, and we’d talk for about ten minutes every month to talk it through, and he’d write it up. I’m not blaming John at all. I think it was a very bad editorial move in the beginning. Mike thought it would work, but it was a mistake. Mike’scertainly had done enough stuff in his career that had worked, but in this case, I don’t think it did. The continuity problems since really confused folks."

[richalex]

Byrne should never ink himself. Thats why his art looks horrible. He needs Terry Austin or Perez to ink his work, then it will look like it did during his X-Men Run.