Superman General Discussion Thread

[dangleo61288]

This is a thread to discuss anything involving Superman, his supporting cast, etc. Be free to talk about anything that is either to weak to be another thread or something that doesn't fit in any other thread.
I will start. If Superman lets say increases in power dramatically, and WW is no longer in his class, and a new female character who is comes in a hits off with SM, would there be any objection to Superman breaking up with WW and date this new character.

[Sacred Knight]

To be fair this doesn't seem like a "general" discussion. Its clearly romantic relationship based. Which is fine, but the title probably should illustrate it.

In any case no, I wouldn't like that because if its based off power, then that's not Superman. Superhuman powers or lackthereof isn't the deciding factor on whom Superman chooses to be with.

[The World]

You know I found an interesting article the other day that I didn't really think was deserving of it's own thread but actually I actually made me think pretty hard on. It gives a really beautiful and powerful description of Lois and why her character is both important and necessary in the Superman mythos. Then it goes on to discuss Superman himself and it perfectly describes exactly why he's fallen out of favor with the public and I feel more importantly with children.

http://ladyloveandjustice.tumblr.com...d-lois-lane-as

Lois is the absolute greatest. She’s the incarnation of journalistic integrity and dedication. As someone who has worked in journalism, she’s my idol. Moreover, you gotta recall she originally was a lady working as a journalist in the 1940s, railing against sexism (she hated being relegated to advice columns because of her gender) and taking down goons on her own. She’s every inch the hero Superman is and his living example of the greatness of humanity- she rushes right in there to get her story and help people no matter the danger despite being mortal. And she’s just unabashedly married to her career and ambitious as hell, and it’s (in good stories) played as a great thing about her.

See this right here shows you exactly why Lois needs to be a more apparent in the Superman stories. Especially when you realize this is how Lois hit the ground running as a woman trying to fight in a male dominated field way back in the day; she is a regular person trying to fight against every imaginable odd but never backs down while trying to obtain truth, justice, americanblahblahblah. She finds herself in danger left, right, and center but triumphs, she doesn't have Superman's gifts but that doesn't shake her resolve. In some ways she's even braver than he is.

I also love Clark, a lot, when he’s written right. He’s the kind of man who admires and adores someone like Lois for the exact reasons I’ve stated,which is honestly enough for me to love him? I’ve made it clear dudes who respect and love ladies I love as much as I do get my support as default because WE ARE CLEARLY ON THE SAME PAGE. He’s just so unashamedly good and loves everything so much. He’s the dude who sees that human spirit is so much greater than power. He’s the guy who just loves working for a newspaper and being on the farm when he has the power to bring the entire world to its knees. I love that kind of person and it’s sad that people think that kind of person is automatically boring.

See this is where the whole S.S. Superman hits an iceburg and has been slowly sinking for the last 30 or so years. I'd also say this is an example of how lighthearted and fun have nothing to do with one another. I wish I could pass this off as being just a personal inference of the character but many writers have characterized him this way unfortunately.

I don't see what a child is suppose to grab onto here, where's the splendor and wonder of being a superhero? Where is the passion of being one of the most powerful beings on the planet and having the power to honestly help people who need you? He's a science-fantasy character, a genre of unending possibility, yet writers want him to obsess over the mundane so as to subvert our expectations? But at the same time he's suppose to be just like a human being and yet he completely lacks the sense of wonder or curiosity that humans have possessed since we could lift are heads and look at the stars, nor does he want to involve himself with the endless problems that plague our world. How can he possibly be one of us?

And when we do try to involve him in our problems, if he does something other than write or farm then the immediate thought is that he'll 'bring the world to it's knees'. Not that he'll stop little kids from dying from cancer, not that he'll stop senseless killings around the globe, not that he'll find a way to bring an end to world hunger, but instinctively the reaction is one of fear and resentment and that’s exactly how we write him. So he does just enough that the world keeps spinning and saves just enough cats from trees so as to mollify our desire for compassion, but he does just the bare minimum to be considered a hero. Anything that goes beyond that is considered involving himself in human affairs, which is nonsensical of course because anything he does on Earth would be involving himself in human affairs.

Before we keep endlessly touting how much Superman loves everything and his inherent goodness keep in mind that Superman would more than likely let any massacre in human history happen as long as it didn’t disturb his day to day life. Look at the lengths he went to save Lois in Final Crisis and know he can’t be bothered to stop school shootings and bombings.

[Blacksun]

To be fair this doesn't seem like a "general" discussion. Its clearly romantic relationship based. Which is fine, but the title probably should illustrate it.

In any case no, I wouldn't like that because if its based off power, then that's not Superman. Superhuman powers or lackthereof isn't the deciding factor on whom Superman chooses to be with.

so his relationship with WW falls under the same flag

[Sacred Knight]

No, it doesn't. I know you won't be convinced otherwise even though you've been consistently proven wrong on your assertion ever since JL #12 was released, but he's not with her because she has power. He's never been romantically involved with anyone just because they're powerful, or just because they're not. And he never will.

[Blacksun]

No, it doesn't. I know you won't be convinced otherwise even though you've been consistently proven wrong on your assertion ever since JL #12 was released, but he's not with her because she has power. He's never been romantically involved with anyone just because they're powerful, or just because they're not. And he never will.

say that ww and superman have nothing to do with power is unrealistic on new 52

[hellacre]

What is being said here has been repeatedly spoken about in upmpteen sm/ww threads. And yeah sounds like a love interest thread as opposed to "general discussion." I think the title needs changing tbh. Else it becomes another let's bash superman/wonder woman by certain posters.

[Sacred Knight]

say that ww and superman have nothing to do with power is unrealistic on new 52

I never said nothing to do. I've only ever said not everything to do with, which is what you've incorrectly asserted time and again. It was a point of initial attraction, but its not the whole. Every piece of source material agrees with me on that, because that's exactly what I used in coming to this conclusion. Your assertion on the other hand is entirely fabricated, based upon selective reading.

[Superlad93]

I don't see what a child is suppose to grab onto here, where's the splendor and wonder of being a superhero? Where is the passion of being one of the most powerful beings on the planet and having the power to honestly help people who need you? He's a science-fantasy character, a genre of unending possibility, yet writers want him to obsess over the mundane so as to subvert our expectations? But at the same time he's suppose to be just like a human being and yet he completely lacks the sense of wonder or curiosity that humans have possessed since we could lift are heads and look at the stars, nor does he want to involve himself with the endless problems that plague our world. How can he possibly be one of us?

And when we do try to involve him in our problems, if he does something other than write or farm then the immediate thought is that he'll 'bring the world to it's knees'. Not that he'll stop little kids from dying from cancer, not that he'll stop senseless killings around the globe, not that he'll find a way to bring an end to world hunger, but instinctively the reaction is one of fear and resentment and that’s exactly how we write him. So he does just enough that the world keeps spinning and saves just enough cats from trees so as to mollify our desire for compassion, but he does just the bare minimum to be considered a hero. Anything that goes beyond that is considered involving himself in human affairs, which is nonsensical of course because anything he does on Earth would be involving himself in human affairs. .

I respect this opinion on not just Superman but the superhero, but only to a degree. I mean who can blame teen/adults for wondering these things about the character. We watch the news all the time and see all of the killing and darkness, and in a iphone "instant access" sort of world we have grown a natural disposition for a fix or "app for that" if you will. Here comes along Superman, logically the ultimate "app for that". We want him to stop the terrorist, shootings, cancer, and hunger spots. Superman is the ultimate Mr fix it after all. He beat back the boogieman when we were 6 now why can't he beat back these new evils that have taken his place, right? That's the line of thinking. It would be irresponsible for him not to. In fact All Superheroes should stop their roof top dances with their evil counterparts and get their acts together to fight the real issues.

But there's just one thing though: these guys are made of paper. The way you're speaking about Superman and his apparent apathy would have one believe he were physically real, but he's not. I get it though, you'd like for Superman to advance and tackle these issues more directly in a world like ours but in comics, yes? This isn't new or groundbreaking and it has it's pitfalls. We've seen the rise and fall of the Green Lantern and Green Arrow team up that overtly took it to the issues of the day. At the start of the run the book was given a standing ovation for bring attention to teen drug addiction by turning Speedy into a dug addict (ironic given his name, right?). But eventually it puttered out because of it's mono toned preachy feel, repeating itself, and it ultimately being a downer.

My personal reason for why Superman shouldn't be depicted as solving our issues by hand in his books is because he can't actual do it. It all amounts to "wouldn't it be nice if Superman were here right now? But just keep in mind he's actually not". I'd much rather his stories fight the issues in an allegorical or symbolic way as it takes the feelings and ideas of the issues and translates them into Superman's language for a new story. How well this works is based on ability of the writer. But for me Superman doesn't fight the concrete real world problems because with his great superhuman sight he's seen the real underlying problems: fear, bigotry, xenophobia, apathy, aggression, sadness and all of their intangible friends. These are the true enemies - the foes man. Superman drags them by the scruffs of their necks into his world and puts faces and bodies to them. Then our man of steel punches the crap out of them. He out smarts them. He shows them that people can be greater than them. Then he sends them off to jail and tells them he'd waiting for them if they're feeling some typa way about it an wanna go a few more rounds. Articulating this into a comic to reaches and entertains people is what Superman is about, I feel. One just has to do a good job at it and he's fame will rise again.

It's the second guessing and non faith in the character that kills him. Nothing else In my opinion is a bigger foe to his fame really. Superman's costume in Man of Steel looked as dark as it was probably because he was absolutly drenched in the sweat of and wringing second guessers of the concept lol. I'm only kidding don't read to much into that.

I actually think it's a little funny that you say writers obsess over the mundane with Superman, and your solution is to have him tackle real world problems which are quite expected and mundane by this point to us as evidence by our ability to watch the news while enjoying a nice meal with the fam. But I don't dismiss the idea of Superman solving real issues directly. I think there are and can be interesting and great stories and ideas with that take. I just feel it's rather unsustainable and can wear quite thin after enough preaching and time passes. At some point you'll realize that you're watching the news in the form of a comic I feel.

In this genre of unending possibility wouldn't it be more fitting to look more outside of ourselves in presentation and thinking? Wouldn't it make more sense to really flex that infinite special effects budget of ink and paper and do something truly out of this world? It would all obviously have to be about us in the emotional sense because we're reading and writing them, but how you go about articulating and depicting those larger than life intangible emotions is up in the air and imagination.

[DochaDocha]

Nice oldies song.

[DochaDocha]

Now here's a video that's not so nice. I almost want DC and Warner Bros. to shut this video down for unlicensed use of all the Superman stuff. If you do click on the video, I urge you to mute it. I also wonder if this is a form of child abuse.

[UltimateTy]

Now here's a video that's not so nice. I almost want DC and Warner Bros. to shut this video down for unlicensed use of all the Superman stuff. If you do click on the video, I urge you to mute it. I also wonder if this is a form of child abuse.

That's a corny video haha

Superman can't save everyone

[Sacred Knight]

I really hate it when crappy songs utilize Superman in their lyrics. I can only think of two that don't, actually, the Jim Croce one being one of 'em.

[DochaDocha]

And if you folks are anything like I am, once you hear this song, it'll get stuck in your head for quite a while. Another oldie:

[Lax]

This is a thread to discuss anything involving Superman, his supporting cast, etc. Be free to talk about anything that is either to weak to be another thread or something that doesn't fit in any other thread.
I will start. If Superman lets say increases in power dramatically, and WW is no longer in his class, and a new female character who is comes in a hits off with SM, would there be any objection to Superman breaking up with WW and date this new character.

Is the new chick hotter as well?