Gotham TV Show

[Jack Flag]

I'm wondering something about this episode- surely the corruption level in the Gotham P.D. had its clearest illustration so far when Zsasz strolled into police headquarters, announced that he was there to kidnap a detective and ordered 50 cops to all leave the room... and in front of their boss they all obeyed him! Can it really just go back to business as usual after that? I guess in Gotham, maybe it can.

Also, no one else has said it yet so I guess I'll just throw it out there: It's got to be the ultimate depiction so far of Bullock and who he is that on what he thought was going to be the last night of his life he chose as his last hurrah to get drunk and have sex with an overweight hooker. Now that's just hilarious.

Why do you assume she is a hooker? Also, I have seen a documentary called 'Cocaine Cowboys' about the Miami drug gang and the scene around them and it was pretty much almost as bad as Gotham's police is shown here - I think Gotham's police corruption is more like what existed in Chicago in the 20s and 30s than the modern Serpico era kind of corruption. Maybe in Mexico the cops would be like the cops in Gotham where they are afraid of the drug cartels and actually work for them as well.

[AndrewCrossett]

Did they reveal that Alfred is ex-special forces? I know he's ex-something, to be able to capture an armed, trained MCU detective with his bare hands.

I liked the way Zsasz was portrayed here. But I still think it's pretty bush league of him to claim that kill.

The wonky shifting time period of this show is puzzling at times, but I have to say I'm glad the Internet doesn't seem to be a factor. It's refreshing, especially in the procedural aspects of the show and in Bruce's research, to see people doing old-fashioned investigating instead of just logging on and getting answers in minutes. Or "checking the security cam footage."

The one thing that doesn't ring true for me is that Gotham seems to exist all by itself in the world. A city that openly corrupt would certainly attract the attention of outside forces... state or even federal agencies who aren't nearly as scared of Falcone and Maroni as the local uniforms are. But, as long as they don't bring the outside world into the story we can just pretend it doesn't exist for the sake of the story.

I'd hoped Penguin would use a sharpened umbrella spike to kill Frankie rather than a boring knife. Oh well... I guess they can't take every opportunity for awesomeness.

But I really hope we've seen the last of that damn "There's a war coming" scene at the beginning of every episode.

[AngelsXDemons]

@Kensei, Yeah, Zsasz showing up was totally unexpected and what an epic entrance he made; sort of like when Darth Maul showed up in "The Phantom Menace" and totally dominated.

@Jack Flag, I'm sorry man but you seem like you're just here to complain and be ticked off by what what doesn't sit right with your taste and opinions although we are all entitled to our opinions I just don't like downers. It is because of people like you that shows that I and other people like me enjoy always get cancelled. Nonetheless, I do agree that Young Bruce should have been in his mid-teens instead of his pre-teens but only time will tell how the show takes him from boy to Young Bat vigilante. I mean, I had the same complaint when I first saw boy child Anakin in 'TPM' but then episode II happened and it was all taken care of. Perhaps, the show is going to speed dial things in the next season. This last episode had some pretty faced paced moves almost reminiscent of how stuff goes down at lighting speed in a anime like Naruto.

[DurararaFTW]

Did they reveal that Alfred is ex-special forces? I know he's ex-something, to be able to capture an armed, trained MCU detective with his bare hands.

ex-SAS, confirmed in an interview.

But I really hope we've seen the last of that damn "There's a war coming" scene at the beginning of every episode.

Couldn't agree more, but I doubt it.

[Crimson Knight]

At this point I'd imagine Victor Fries is still a scientist but I wonder if his wife Nora is still around or if she'd have become ill by now?

I'd introduce him where Nora's just getting ill, find out from him, and we see her, or we don't, at some point, but Victor'd be the main of the first episode for him.

Also, who in the world saw the twist endings with Oswald in the GCPD, or working with Falcone all along, if he lived, and all that? Very shocking, and brilliant, I thought.

[Crimson Knight]

I know that a lot of people associate Batman with costumed kooks, but the Batman I liked was the detective who solved ordinary crimes, fighting crooks in plain clothes.

I really don't like that this series has focused so much on the Penguin--I was hoping for a procedural detective show. But I'm resigned to the fact that Cobblepot is a central character for the moment. What keeps me watching are the number of good actors that outweigh the bad ones.

The moral relativism in GOTHAM leaves me cold. If there is no real good, then I don't see what dressing up like a bat is going to solve. You would have to tear down the whole government, start from scratch and build a new society based on clear and resolute ideals.

Billionaire boy wonder Bruce Wayne is more likely to solve the problems of Gotham than the Batman. All Batman can do is detain crooks--and if he doesn't kill them, they'll just end up back on the street, because the whole system is corrupt. However, Bruce Wayne can use his billions to organize a massive political and legislative alliance to dismantle Gotham and rebuld it anew.

Well, that is the eternal dilemma or question, is it not? Is Batman the solution, or the problem? Would Gotham City be better off without him, or with him? With him, to solve the crime, initially, then stop, and as Bruce, try his best to establish true law, and real order.

Always wonder. And, anyone else reminded of Batmans' mask, or a duplicate Batman from The Dark Knight, with the Spirit of the Goat? Anyone see that twist with the therapist being behind the two killers? I feel my Dad like the Person of Interest, CBS, way of apprehending a criminal, target, or terrorist - got her in the shoulder, I believe, though he thought the knee, or leg.

And, very theatrical way to land in that chair, especially the way the camera did things therein. Liked the closeups on Bullock, as he delivered how he'd put it all together, or worked it all out. Very nice, detective type way of it, I think, and very Adam West Batman scenario, with the patient forced to kill by trigger, her watching idly, with amusement, then running off, while Bullock was pushed to the side, at the stairwell.

LOVE that.

[Crimson Knight]

I feel the same about Arrow. I just..sometime in the middle of the 2nd season I just stopped watching it. It just didn't hold my interest.

I do like Gotham. It's not the best super hero show ever, but I find it vastly to superior to all the other procedural cop shows out there.

What aspects of Gotham do you like, Surtur? And, like another new-ish DC show, would you keep on with Gotham, at least to Christmas break, if not further?

[AndrewCrossett]

Always wonder. And, anyone else reminded of Batmans' mask, or a duplicate Batman from The Dark Knight, with the Spirit of the Goat?

Yes, and I'm certain that's no accident. Dr. Marks created the Spirit of the Goat to strike fear into the hearts of the people she considered villains... Gotham's rich and powerful. They would live in fear of a seemingly supernatural "avatar of justice" who could strike at them from the shadows, even in their own homes. Batman will later use the exact same MO against the city's criminals.

[Crimson Knight]

a lot of people see him as trying to manipulate gordon but does he really view gordon as his friend somehow?

Could be like L and Light in Death Note, where the detective manipulates the other to find the killer, but they find they are their one, true, only friend.

Could almost be like that for Oswald, with Gordon, here.

Also, I know people've seen, some or many, Ben McKenzie, our James Gordon, with a mustache, but how would he look with large-ish glasses?

Or, Robin Lord Taylor, Oswald Cobblepot, with a monocle, or cane? Not sure about a monocle myself, but think a cane'd work with all that hobbling, and would work.

[Crimson Knight]

Yes, and I'm certain that's no accident. Dr. Marks created the Spirit of the Goat to strike fear into the hearts of the people she considered villains... Gotham's rich and powerful. They would live in fear of a seemingly supernatural "avatar of justice" who could strike at them from the shadows, even in their own homes. Batman will later use the exact same MO against the city's criminals.

Thanks. That makes a lot of sense, but think, minus the killing, the Balloon Mans' scope seemed to make more sense. Rich, or poor, big, or small, long as they were corrupt.

Don't really think high income equals evil, or helps here. What about the mid, or low, or zero income - homeless etc - people? Does she have them killed too, League of Assassins it up? Or, leave them, due to prejudices against the rich, and how she feels society would grow without them?

Just odd.

[PretenderNX01]

Also, I know people've seen, some or many, Ben McKenzie, our James Gordon, with a mustache, but how would he look with large-ish glasses?

ABH-1979 posted this in the Batman forum

It was Ben's costume to Hedi Klum's annual Halloween party.

I think Gotham's police corruption is more like what existed in Chicago in the 20s and 30s than the modern Serpico era kind of corruption. Maybe in Mexico the cops would be like the cops in Gotham where they are afraid of the drug cartels and actually work for them as well.

That would fit with the mix of eras that Gotham has. Their gangsters are Capone-esque yet also modern as the cartels.

Don't really think high income equals evil, or helps here. What about the mid, or low, or zero income - homeless etc - people? Does she have them killed too, League of Assassins it up? Or, leave them, due to prejudices against the rich, and how she feels society would grow without them?

She says you can't make someone do something they don't want to and people hate the rich. So she can do that.

[Crimson Knight]

I like the twist of who penguin is really working for.

I'm normally not a believer in slash shipping goggles, but it is starting to seem like Oswald had a crush on Gordon.

Slash shipping Oswald, Gordon, or bespectacled characters?

[Crimson Knight]

They really stepped it up with this episode.
Everything clicked, great amount of twists, things weren't too over the top.
Penguin was great as always.
Zsasz' ringtone was perfect (and an indication by the phone this likely takes place in early 2000s at the earliest, when this is set is really ambiguous, any clues are appreciated)

And what do Gordon and Bullock do? Bust in with shotguns, LA confidential style. Just, nice.

Yeah, funny ringtones are great. Like Itsy Bitsy Spider for Peter in The Amazing Spider-Man 2, or now Funky Town for Zsaz. Wonder why that one for him? A lot more appropriate, like Bleed It Out, Bleeding Out, Open Wounds - no jokes, there, just fit, with him.

Could be because of Gotham, and laughing at the craziness, the 'fun', of it.

[Crimson Knight]

ABH-1979 posted this in the Batman forum

It was Ben's costume to Hedi Klum's annual Halloween party.



That would fit with the mix of eras that Gotham has. Their gangsters are Capone-esque yet also modern as the cartels.


She says you can't make someone do something they don't want to and people hate the rich. So she can do that.

I don't think so myself. Can point out a number that don't hate them, and I certainly don't. Doubt if you look through all of Gotham they do either, so she CANNOT. Locked away now anyway, but once people open their minds, stand up and realize this nonsense isn't on, hating one group like a bunch of prejudicial bigots doesn't make sense, or work.

[Crimson Knight]

ex-SAS, confirmed in an interview.



Couldn't agree more, but I doubt it.

I'd feel about the same, when it comes to Arrow. Been doing the 'My name is Oliver Queen' recap bit since around Episode 2 of Season 1, though with Episode 2 of Season 2 and Episode 1 of Season 3, always that bit altered. Might be the same here.

Or, a new recap, like Supernatural. From 'The family business: hunting things, saving people' to 'Let's go kill some evil sons of b****** and raise a little Hell', so same could happen here.

Like, instead of the current one, a new one, sampling something from Penguins' Umbrella, or The Mask, don't know yet.