Post Crisis Wonder Woman vs Android 18

[Hazard]

Anime Piccolo takes 4 seconds from firing to moon explosion, from what I recall. Manga is obviously pretty immediate in being the next panel. It happens with a giant ape stomping around at superspeeds (just slower than others), so it has to be happening really quick, whatever the case. I typically say 25% light, to be safe.

There are pretty big jumps after that in which people are basically statues to the other people Burta/Goku/Finger Beam/SSJ Goku, so even being hugely pessimistic, they're not taking many hits from a lightspeeder without taking an action of their own around then.

Honestly, I'd put the speed of Piccolo's moonbuster in the manga as SMvFL.

There are just not enough corroborating feats at that point in time.

It's okay for the anime though since it does get more high end feats to play with.

[The Dork Knight]

That being said , Piccolo definitely blew up the moon in a short time so even going by conservative estimates , Frieza is probably FTL . In the anime

[abmccray]

Could you provide a video link to these statements? I only ask because I watched the anime long ago and don't remember specific statements like that

It also seems inconsistent with the time taken by goku to cross snake way and Gotenks circling the earth , and even how long the characters generally seem to take to move around the planet, though obviously they were not trying as hard as in a fight

also it is easier to track objects in space than on say a planet .....space being as vast as it is

It takes a very large amount of ki to fly at heavy speeds. When they're going to a fight, they're generally trying to conserve ki. If they don't have ki, they won't be able to amp their physical attacks, block, or shoot off very powerful beams without sitting and gathering it again.

Goku could only run like twice as fast as a regular person when he started Roshi's training in DB. Goku set a marathon pace for Snake Way that was a lot faster than jet speed. He was a lot faster than that in the Freeza saga. Gotenks circled the earth multiple times in a panel, or a bunch of times in a few seconds in the anime (they forgot to not animate the planet spinning, though) without losing significant ki. There's even significant progression in travel speed.

Not just in Dragon Ball, but in a lot of shounen manga, reaction speed is significantly faster than travel speed. This is due to them being hugely based on martial arts mythology that does this. Western comics tend to have set superspeed, where someone is just that speed all of the time, or much faster long range travel as opposed to reaction speed. There are some exceptions, though, like Spider-man/Cain Batgirl/Karate Kid, etc. though.

[buutenks]

It doesn't really go through. But yeah. It is impressive.



The snake way is hilariously inconsistent with plenty of stuff. Starting with the fact that it takes Goku 6 months to get through.

Travel speed in DBZ is just way slower than reaction speed.

On Gotenks travel's speed, that's more of a matter of interpretation.

Ah you are correct,ye i mistook goku being pushed back fast with the kameha piercing the start.Well either way,very good feat,especially for freeza.

Ye,their travel speed is very slow.the z fighters take forever to get anywhere by self flight,doesnt matter if their ssj3 level or raditz level.Its like their flying speed didnt change at all,very inconsistent,guessing you can call it PIS.

Honestly, I'd put the speed of Piccolo's moonbuster in the manga as SMvFL.

There are just not enough corroborating feats at that point in time.

It's okay for the anime though since it does get more high end feats to play with.

Well,there is the roshi feat,but in the manga beyond that there is never any similar feat ever displayed.Best one i can think of is cell's kameha moving faster than goku's IT.I checked some manga chapters and it seems there is a delay between goku porting and reappearing,its not instant,some time passes,very short time but still passes.

[abmccray]

Honestly, I'd put the speed of Piccolo's moonbuster in the manga as SMvFL.

There are just not enough corroborating feats at that point in time.

It's okay for the anime though since it does get more high end feats to play with.

I'd say it's basically the start of where Toriyama amped or at least changed the level of power from Dragon Ball to Z. In Dragon Ball, they started off doing goofy stuff like going to the moon and dropping people off and breaking the fourth wall because he was making a comedy martial arts manga. By the Z era, he decided he wanted to make an Eastern version of a superhero comic, so now, instead of those feats being comedic, they were "serious" examples of how much power they had.

Basically, "that thing that Roshi did that was comedic, well, now they can do that for real!" and retrofitting how they were able to do those things before, even while being weaker (that was kind of the use of scouters - to give a numerical explanation at why they were able to do such ridiculous feats). The supportive feats consistently start happening afterwards, which makes it fair to me.

[buutenks]

I'd say it's basically the start of where Toriyama amped or at least changed the level of power from Dragon Ball to Z. In Dragon Ball, they started off doing goofy stuff like going to the moon and dropping people off and breaking the fourth wall because he was making a comedy martial arts manga. By the Z era, he decided he wanted to make an Eastern version of a superhero comic, so now, instead of those feats being comedic, they were "serious" examples of how much power they had.

Basically, "that thing that Roshi did that was comedic, well, now they can do that for real!" and retrofitting how they were able to do those things before, even while being weaker (that was kind of the use of scouters - to give a numerical explanation at why they were able to do such ridiculous feats). The supportive feats consistently start happening afterwards, which makes it fair to me.

Well,people will have a hard time believing it unless it has been done more times.

I think the best speed feat for manga is goku dodging freeza's beam attack which caused a rift instantly in the planet.So you just go up from there.And then there is goku's reaction to cell's kameha which traveled inbtween the time it took goku to diappear and reappear behind cell.

So ye for manga its quite an issue,while anime gets a pass.

That being said , Piccolo definitely blew up the moon in a short time so even going by conservative estimates , Frieza is probably FTL . In the anime

Yep pretty much,i mean all these issues is mostly with manga.Manga(besides beerus,whis and ssj god goku) are very much weaker than anime versions.

I mean anime u got kid buu destroying a galaxy,buuhan breaking the fabric of reality,those feats in the freeza saga which were posted.Hell in the anime ssj3 goku vs kid buu took place all over the kai planet,you could see them battling all over it while manga just took place in a relative smaller area compared to anime.

[Anarchist]

According to the anime, Saiyan-Saga Vegeta is already a casual planet-buster. Think about that.

@ Topic
WW has the speed edge and doesn't even need to put her down, she could wrap her up in her indestructible lasso.

[buutenks]

According to the anime, Saiyan-Saga Vegeta is already a casual planet-buster. Think about that.

@ Topic
WW has the speed edge and doesn't even need to put her down, she could wrap her up in her indestructible lasso.

Edge in speed vs manga,anime runs circles around her,unless WW can move at FTL speeds.

[Anarchist]

No doubt.

But since the OP doesn't specify, I think manga is the default.

[buutenks]

No doubt.

But since the OP doesn't specify, I think manga is the default.

Hmm ye i guess.Manga she cant take it,WW wins.

[abmccray]

The best speed feat in the manga is probably Gohan waiting until the last second (ie. watching it come at him and thinking about it, then charging up) to bother even charge up to block Cell's kamehameha, which was illustrated at "instant" speeds of this type of distance.


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[buutenks]

The best speed feat in the manga is probably Gohan waiting until the last second (ie. watching it come at him and thinking about it, then charging up) to bother even charge up to block Cell's kamehameha, which was illustrated at "instant" speeds of this type of distance.


4279199-van2.jpg

Ye,actually cell reacted and could have possible side stepped vegeta's final flash a little so it wouldnt hit him dead center.Ofc problem is we dont know how fast it was traveling,could be one second could be 10th of a second or even faster.In the anime it shows traveling very far,so obviously anime its FTL,but manga no idea.

But ye considerng gohan could charge a kameha much faster than the speed of cell's kameha which i wrote early is superfast,perhaps even close to LS,id say that proly places him at low FTL.Ofc thats just throwing stuff in,we dont know exactly.Still doesnt look good for 18 since ssj2 gohan is leagues above her.

Best feat is the freeza beam dodging,since we know 18 is faster than ssj goku.

Meh i think only guys like beerus,ssj god goku and whis could speed blitz post crisis WW and supes and other fast characters considering,beerus was so fast ssj3 goku wasnt even able to turn his head around before beerus koed him with a pressure point.That and that multy planet busting feat.

[abmccray]

Ye,actually cell reacted and could have possible side stepped vegeta's final flash a little so it wouldnt hit him dead center.Ofc problem is we dont know how fast it was traveling,could be one second could be 10th of a second or even faster.In the anime it shows traveling very far,so obviously anime its FTL,but manga no idea.

But ye considerng gohan could charge a kameha much faster than the speed of cell's kameha which i wrote early is superfast,perhaps even close to LS,id say that proly places him at low FTL.Ofc thats just throwing stuff in,we dont know exactly.Still doesnt look good for 18 since ssj2 gohan is leagues above her.

Best feat is the freeza beam dodging,since we know 18 is faster than ssj goku.

Meh i think only guys like beerus,ssj god goku and whis could speed blitz post crisis WW and supes and other fast characters considering,beerus was so fast ssj3 goku wasnt even able to turn his head around before beerus koed him with a pressure point.That and that multy planet busting feat.

Goku unlocked could speed blitz Goku SSJ3 as well (and Super Buu was a great deal above him too). People always forget about the Gohan tier jump (which people like Vegeta after Bulma slapped far surpassed).

[buutenks]

Goku unlocked could speed blitz Goku SSJ3 as well (and Super Buu was a great deal above him too). People always forget about the Gohan tier jump (which people like Vegeta after Bulma slapped far surpassed).

Super buu is indeed stronger,but i doubt he can speed blitz ssj3 goku.Look at kid buu vs ssj2 vegeta,he wasnt speed blitzing him,he was superior but wasnt doing what freeza did to vegeta or perfect cell did to ussj vegeta.The power diff in buu saga is much closer than freeza or cell saga.Proly only buuhan and vegetto could speed blitz ssj3 goku freeza style.But then again that is just asumptions,i just said whis god goku and beerus due to the fact that they showed it(god goku was able to keep up with serious beerus and whis karate chopped him with easy).

[abmccray]

Gohan could basically blitz Super Buu, with Super being a jump above Goku. I agree with your assessment, basically, just showing where I'm placing the exact differences.