Jason Todd: Robin, Arkham Knight, Red Hood Appreciation 2018

[Alycat]

After seeing A Most Violent Year, I could see Elyes Gabel playing a pretty good Jason Todd.



Of course, this would mean a minority version of the character, but I think it'd be kinda appropriate, and it'd be nice to see that, prior to him losing hope in his city, that Batman actually saw potential in the ghetto trash of Gotham, rather than terrorized them. How much better to do that than to have Jason played by a minority.

Now, if they got a white guy to play him I wouldn't mind, it's that it'd bring a different flavor to the character. It didn't hurt Deadshot.

Nah I gotta diasagree with you there. If anything I would find it pretty inappropriate and annoying that the minority is the kid from the streets, the one with problems. It's a flavor I don't want with anymore minority characters. Just one of the reasons I can't agree with those jason Todd Latino fanons. Also would kinda undermine that interesting angle of Of Batman maybe wanting another version of Dick.

[oasis1313]

Jason don't need no steenkin' Bat-family. He just needs plenty of ass to kick.

[Orujo-man]

Thanks for the answers. I agree with the most of your points of view. I think, like you said, Jason at last will follow his own ideals and maybe don't break totally with the Batfamily but gain their disappointment again. As much as I like the idea of having Jason in the Batfamily, I think it would be a mistake and a waste of potential. In fact, I think it's something that must be done to continue the growth of the character.

At first we saw in UTH Jason trying to impose his views on crime and their true motivations were the disappointment and anger with Bruce. Then he became more psychotic (I must say, I don't like this Jason). In RHATO we saw him more relaxed and trying to find their own place in the world alongside Roy and Starfire. Still having problems with Bruce but more than disappointment or anger is a mixture of rebellion and guilt for his past actions. Also receives some acceptance of Bruce, something he has always wanted.

And in the end we have RH/A. JD is important, but the focus is Roy. For Jason, Roy represents his own advancement, not only his best friend. Throughout the series, Jason is guided by Roy all the time. Jason clings to it because it's the only positive thing he knows. And it is at the end of the series when the change happens. Jason feels guilty about his abduction and sees himself as a toxic person, then he leaves.

Here's where it starts Rebirth. His failure with Roy takes Jason back to the only thing he knows, to seek refuge again in his father figure and the approval of Bruce. I think from here Jason must move ahead and stop having the shadow of Bruce in his life. This requires that after dealing with internal conflicts Jason makes the decision to pursue their own ideals and its own struggle against crime. Unlike UTH, this decision would be made not by resentment or disappointment to Bruce. It would be for their own ideals and self-acceptance.

Also keep in mind Artemis and Bizarro here. I don't know anything about Bizarro but Artemis seems to be an old-school warrior and I doubt that she cares if cuts some heads. That's my impression, mostly for her weapons.

I sincerely believe that this course would be good for the character and clearly reflects the maturation of Jason himself and his final transition from teenager to adult.

Or at least it is my vision of the character and how I would like to be managed.

[Rise]

That was seriously a very good analysis, Orujo-man. And I really enjoyed reading it.

[Aioros22]

http://nyobetabeat.files.wordpress.c...action-gif.gif

All this delicious conversation about Jason`s complex character. I may not agree with precisely one point or another but the general tone is something I go with. Particularly to the ending of RHAA and the moving forward. The journey for Jason consistant growth comes to not only acceptance in himself but how others may perceive him. And that`s an incredibly mature journey to make.

It started with Jason claiming that he was over Batman and Gotham in a more superficial (let`s call it, physical sense) but now the layers dig deeper, almost metatextually. This is why despite the last Eternal having been lackluster, his issue in beating the mind control is preeecious. The storytelling trick of going inside someone`s head won`t pay off as well with others as it does with Jay. This is merely one reason why he may be a harder character to deal with, but is so much richer for it.

I maintain it`s not about him not meeting with the others but meeting with the others more on his terms instead of other`s expectations. They didn`t live his life after all so the end game should only be a sure Jason Todd. On the other hand, let him keep learning and look at things the other way as well, since after all, that shortly brief psycho who was wearing the same name is in the garbage can where it belongs.

[Aioros22]

Nah I gotta diasagree with you there. If anything I would find it pretty inappropriate and annoying that the minority is the kid from the streets, the one with problems. It's a flavor I don't want with anymore minority characters. Just one of the reasons I can't agree with those jason Todd Latino fanons. Also would kinda undermine that interesting angle of Of Batman maybe wanting another version of Dick.

I don`t think that would matter much these days as it would a decade ago. You can also always point that the reason this kid got troubles is because whatever finances his family had was burnt out from paying his mother`s medical bills and he stopped going to school to get money for whatever means and so.

I can see your pov, that being said and it`s no easy concern for a studio to just shrug off but I do like the imagery of the actor as Jason. He looks standard "dark hair Robin" enough and he`s a good actor to boot. I don`t mind him much being one foot outside that standard while having another in.

[TooFlyToFail]

Nah I gotta diasagree with you there. If anything I would find it pretty inappropriate and annoying that the minority is the kid from the streets, the one with problems. It's a flavor I don't want with anymore minority characters. Just one of the reasons I can't agree with those jason Todd Latino fanons. Also would kinda undermine that interesting angle of Of Batman maybe wanting another version of Dick.

I honestly don't think that matters anymore. If anything, it would come across as more relatable, and more realistic, especially seeing how most of the people Clark interviewed seemed to be minorities. Pushing minorities towards the worst, and most crime riddled, parts of a city happens, and using Jason to bring such trials to life, and to give a voice to those of such predicaments, would make him more than just another comic book character brought to life, and would be very appropriate, as his and Batman's conflict would mirror whats going on now (no I'm not part of BLM, nor am I an SJW, despite being black).

Also, if you introduce Duke later, rather than Tim, then he wouldn't be the only minority Robin, as well as the only one that went "bad".

Also, as Aioros22 said, he's a good actor, and can pass a version of Jason easily.

[TooFlyToFail]

Thanks for the answers. I agree with the most of your points of view. I think, like you said, Jason at last will follow his own ideals and maybe don't break totally with the Batfamily but gain their disappointment again. As much as I like the idea of having Jason in the Batfamily, I think it would be a mistake and a waste of potential. In fact, I think it's something that must be done to continue the growth of the character.

At first we saw in UTH Jason trying to impose his views on crime and their true motivations were the disappointment and anger with Bruce. Then he became more psychotic (I must say, I don't like this Jason). In RHATO we saw him more relaxed and trying to find their own place in the world alongside Roy and Starfire. Still having problems with Bruce but more than disappointment or anger is a mixture of rebellion and guilt for his past actions. Also receives some acceptance of Bruce, something he has always wanted.

And in the end we have RH/A. JD is important, but the focus is Roy. For Jason, Roy represents his own advancement, not only his best friend. Throughout the series, Jason is guided by Roy all the time. Jason clings to it because it's the only positive thing he knows. And it is at the end of the series when the change happens. Jason feels guilty about his abduction and sees himself as a toxic person, then he leaves.

Here's where it starts Rebirth. His failure with Roy takes Jason back to the only thing he knows, to seek refuge again in his father figure and the approval of Bruce. I think from here Jason must move ahead and stop having the shadow of Bruce in his life. This requires that after dealing with internal conflicts Jason makes the decision to pursue their own ideals and its own struggle against crime. Unlike UTH, this decision would be made not by resentment or disappointment to Bruce. It would be for their own ideals and self-acceptance.

Also keep in mind Artemis and Bizarro here. I don't know anything about Bizarro but Artemis seems to be an old-school warrior and I doubt that she cares if cuts some heads. That's my impression, mostly for her weapons.

I sincerely believe that this course would be good for the character and clearly reflects the maturation of Jason himself and his final transition from teenager to adult.

Or at least it is my vision of the character and how I would like to be managed.

I never looked at it that way, but this makes me appreciate the first RHatO run and RH/A somewhat more than I did before.

Hopefully, once he reaches his potential as a person, is when he'll get his sidekick.

[SpentShrimp]

It's not about the looks, the character's core is there and the way Pitt carries himself over the course of the first 2 seasons

Okay, but get someone who can do that, who also looks the part.

[Orujo-man]

That was seriously a very good analysis, Orujo-man. And I really enjoyed reading it.

Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it.

[Orujo-man]

I maintain it`s not about him not meeting with the others but meeting with the others more on his terms instead of other`s expectations. They didn`t live his life after all so the end game should only be a sure Jason Todd. On the other hand, let him keep learning and look at things the other way as well, since after all, that shortly brief psycho who was wearing the same name is in the garbage can where it belongs.

I really like this paragraph especially, I agree with you. If we look back we can see clearly that since he started as Robin most other people with whom he associated did not have an objective view of it. Jason had to achieve very high standards left by Dick. But Jason is not Dick.

In my opinion, this is the cause of huge inferiority complex that has Jason and always tries to mask it with arrogance and now with the search of acceptance of Bruce. Just as the resentment he feels for Dick. It's a curious contradiction that while seeking acceptance at the same time is toxic for him because he never receive acceptance until not accept himself. If he follows the wishes of Bruce in the end he will have internal conflicts again because he simply doesn't have the same ideals. Sooner or later he will explode and the cycle will begin again. I think Jason need to meet new people.

As for the others, if you mean the Batmily I see it difficult. Perhaps Tim, is more open minded than the rest. Or even Dick but I don't know. I think apart from Jason, also it depends on the evolution of the others. It's very interesting, I'll keep thinking about it.

As I said before, I hate psychotic version in which he became after UTH series and hopefully never again take that path. Even if Lodbell makes some mistakes, it would be a real shame to stay stuck in that cliche again rather than keep evolving.

[G-Potion]

Thanks for the answers. I agree with the most of your points of view. I think, like you said, Jason at last will follow his own ideals and maybe don't break totally with the Batfamily but gain their disappointment again. As much as I like the idea of having Jason in the Batfamily, I think it would be a mistake and a waste of potential. In fact, I think it's something that must be done to continue the growth of the character.

At first we saw in UTH Jason trying to impose his views on crime and their true motivations were the disappointment and anger with Bruce. Then he became more psychotic (I must say, I don't like this Jason). In RHATO we saw him more relaxed and trying to find their own place in the world alongside Roy and Starfire. Still having problems with Bruce but more than disappointment or anger is a mixture of rebellion and guilt for his past actions. Also receives some acceptance of Bruce, something he has always wanted.

And in the end we have RH/A. JD is important, but the focus is Roy. For Jason, Roy represents his own advancement, not only his best friend. Throughout the series, Jason is guided by Roy all the time. Jason clings to it because it's the only positive thing he knows. And it is at the end of the series when the change happens. Jason feels guilty about his abduction and sees himself as a toxic person, then he leaves.

Here's where it starts Rebirth. His failure with Roy takes Jason back to the only thing he knows, to seek refuge again in his father figure and the approval of Bruce. I think from here Jason must move ahead and stop having the shadow of Bruce in his life. This requires that after dealing with internal conflicts Jason makes the decision to pursue their own ideals and its own struggle against crime. Unlike UTH, this decision would be made not by resentment or disappointment to Bruce. It would be for their own ideals and self-acceptance.

Also keep in mind Artemis and Bizarro here. I don't know anything about Bizarro but Artemis seems to be an old-school warrior and I doubt that she cares if cuts some heads. That's my impression, mostly for her weapons.

I sincerely believe that this course would be good for the character and clearly reflects the maturation of Jason himself and his final transition from teenager to adult.

Or at least it is my vision of the character and how I would like to be managed.

Like what you wrote here. Succinctly described the personal journey Jason has gone through. You can see that even in his most disliked "psychotic" phase, it still makes sense and is somewhat a natural progression, especially if one counts the event from Countdown where the death of Batman totally broke him. Likewise, in R/A, Jason was broken again by Joker's Daughter as his wish to redeem someone he thought similar to him totally blew up in his face, convincing him of his own hopelessness. I hope RHATO Rebirth would reveal more on his state of mind after the event of R/A, that he's not as okay as he seems.

[batnbreakfast]

Okay, but get someone who can do that, who also looks the part.

Pitt plays a young war vet, out to prove himself, thirsty for revenge, there's a estranged father/son/surrogate father relationship and a really twisted mother... why would you care if the actor has blond or black hair? Jason's look changes all the time with different artists anyway.

[Dark_Tzitzimine]

RED HOOD AND THE OUTLAWS #4
Written by SCOTT LOBDELL
Art by DEXTER SOY
Cover by GIUSEPPE CAMUNCOLI and CAM SMITH
Variant cover by MATTEO SCALERA
Retailers: This issue will ship with two covers. Please see the order form for details.
“DARK TRINITY” part four! The unimaginable has happened—Black Mask has gained control of one of the most powerful beings in the world: Bizarro! Can the Red Hood stop him before Black Mask’s reign of terror begins?
On sale NOVEMBER 9 • 32 pg, FC, $2.99 US • RATED T

[JasonTodd428]

Looks great and thus the final member of the Dark Trinity makes his appearance. Now some reviewers can stop nitpicking about Artemis and Bizzaro not having been in the book yet even though they've been on covers. I'm tired of hearing that particular nitpick.