Captain America vs Agent Smith

[WarrenPeace]

MCU Cap verses Smith-I want to give Steve a chance here so
1. Smith is not allowed to fly
2. Smith is not allowed the use of his "me too" knife hand.

Standard rules

Oh, do you think Smith would call him Mr. Rogers...?

[buutenks]

Is this enhanced smith or normal one from matrix 1?

And im pretty sure he would call him Mr Rogers ^^

[WarrenPeace]

Either or, I guess...Trilogy Smith then. Just one though-I don't know if Cap could handle fifty.

[buutenks]

Either or, I guess...Trilogy Smith then. Just one though-I don't know if Cap could handle fifty.

Enhanced smith is way out of cap's league.

Smith from matrix one would be a good match since cap has his shield.

[krang]

The agents from the first Matrix are explicitly bullet timers. Unless Cap can completely no sell Smith's hits, which I seriously doubt, Smith blitzes for the win.

[Guy1]

The agents from the first Matrix are explicitly bullet timers. Unless Cap can completely no sell Smith's hits, which I seriously doubt, Smith blitzes for the win.

Their bullet timing was always a bit weird to me. They seem to need to plant themselves before doing the super speed thing as shown with the Agent on the rooftop and Smith's super speed punch thing. The rest of the time they aren't moving that fast.

[Jonathan]

I don't see how Cap can beat even Smith from the first Matrix honestly. I'm not even sure he could do all the things that the Matrix enhanced humans could do.

[buutenks]

I don't see how Cap can beat even Smith from the first Matrix honestly. I'm not even sure he could do all the things that the Matrix enhanced humans could do.

Well,he could do it strength wise,but not dodge bullets.Also agents dodge bullets fired from long range,short range they die.

Plus cap has his shield,which he could use to like decapitate smith perhaps,or cut a limb.He can cut metal with that quite easily.

Vs enhanced though,to powerful for cap to do anything.But normal he has a shot if he plays smart,since hes definitely durable,id say more so than neo considering with all the crap he went through.

[Cody]

Well,he could do it strength wise,but not dodge bullets.Also agents dodge bullets fired from long range,short range they die.

Said based on nothing at all. Trinity caught that one Agent by surprise. There is no reason to believe that they can't dodge up close.

Plus cap has his shield,which he could use to like decapitate smith perhaps,or cut a limb.He can cut metal with that quite easily.

Both Rogers, and the shield move far to slowly to tag Smith for that to ever happen.

Vs enhanced though,to powerful for cap to do anything.But normal he has a shot if he plays smart,since hes definitely durable,id say more so than neo considering with all the crap he went through.

He is curbstomped when he faced a non-enhanced Smith. It's even worse when up against an enhanced version.

[Lord Falcon]

Agents seem to have a specific, activated ability that allows them to dodge bullets by moving everything from their ankles up fast enough. They are unable to fight or move at bullet-time speeds in other respects.

If anything, Cap is the generally faster guy here, due to the superior choreography of Winter Soldier.

[Cody]

Agents seem to have a specific, activated ability that allows them to dodge bullets by moving everything from their ankles up fast enough. They are unable to fight or move at bullet-time speeds in other respects.

Blatantly untrue. The subway fight more than proves this to not be the case with Smith hammering Neo with a flurry of punches when he had him up against the wall. Then there is their short gunfight building towards it showing the bullets moving slowly while they lunge at each other.

They fight at that speed with no problems. They also are a lot stronger than Cap as evident by them casually ripping off car roofs like it's paper.

[Lord Falcon]

Blatantly untrue. The subway fight more than proves this to not be the case with Smith hammering Neo with a flurry of punches when he had him up against the wall. Then there is their short gunfight building towards it showing the bullets moving slowly while they lunge at each other.

They fight at that speed with no problems. They also are a lot stronger than Cap as evident by them casually ripping off car roofs like it's paper.

Let me rephrase:

Agents have specific abilities to go faster than they would otherwise be able to. Agent Smith had Neo set up against the wall, in no condition to dodge, and so activated a program to start punching really fast. Just as Agents who know they are about to be shot at activate their bullet time dodging. They can also leap further when they know they'll have to and so on. Agents in no way move that fast on a constant basis.

The subway gunfight shows that Smith was not moving at bullet time speed. They advanced on each other like normal human beings, shooting and missing, then leaped at each other and emptied their guns ineffectually into the air while holding each other's wrists. The fact that the camera pans around them and the video goes slo-mo should not distract from the fact that Neo and Smith were moving way too slowly to bullet-time, and weren't even dodging when they had a hold of each other.

[Beadle]

I don't quite get how two threads started at around the same time, one pitting Neo against Superman, the other pitting Agent Smith against movie Cap.

It should be obvious to anyone that at least one of those rumbles had to be a complete mis-match (though in fact it's both).

Cap <<< Agent Smith < Neo <<<< Superman

[Lord Falcon]

Just to note that I am engaging in Cap vs Matrix 1 Agent Smith.

If we're talking about the Agent Smith who can fly and fight with Super Neo, then yeah the outcome is obvious as Beadle said.

[Wavemaninawe]

I'm siding with Lord Falcon.

The Agents are guard programs inside the Matrix, so it would make sense that they have optional subroutines to deal with specific tasks. An AI program isn't going to spend resources on doing 20 different things simultaneously unless there is an actual need to do so. It isn't cost efficient resource managment.

The Agents only move at BT speed when they are specifically dodging bullets. I.e. that strongly suggests it being a consciously activated ability. They have no feats to suggest that it is their default speed.

If that was the case, then they would have effectively aim dodged the gatling gun.

If that was the case then the "dodge this" scene would never have worked, since Trinity would have had her face collapsed before she finished the first syllable.

If that was the case, none of the Hackers would ever be able to even put up a fight in close range. They would just get blitzed into the ground.


It would be one thing if they reacted that fast on an inconsistent but still noticeably regular basis. But I can't think of a single instance where did it without them having time to asses the situation first



I want to recall that there was an official ruling on this the last time around. Has it been covered yet?