Loki Appreciation 2018

[Raye]

Thank you! I won't be able to get this book for a few days, so this is great!

Well, so what happens? Loki wrestles control of Jotunheim and uses it to save Asgard?

It's looking like it may go that way. That page of him trudging through the snow was probably Jotunheim, if Odin was to banish him to any realm, it would be Jotunheim, send him back where he came from. But now, he will have spoilers:

Malekith and Laufey

end of spoilers to contend with. He may be able to worm his way into their good graces, but without being able to lie, that will be hard. He will likely have to usurp the throne somehow rather than try and keep the charade going.

[Rosebunse]

It's looking like it may go that way. That page of him trudging through the snow was probably Jotunheim, if Odin was to banish him to any realm, it would be Jotunheim, send him back where he came from. But now, he will have spoilers:

Malekith and Laufey

end of spoilers to contend with. He may be able to worm his way into their good graces, but without being able to lie, that will be hard. He will likely have to usurp the throne somehow rather than try and keep the charade going.

You see, that's the thing. How do you do anything if you can't lie? He can't even just not tell the truth. With a broken arm, he's certainly in no physical condition to do much of anything, and the Frost Giants are a society that, like the Asgardians, gives more respect to warriors than to tacticians. That's partially how they kept losing in the first place.

Maybe Loki will have to force himself to access some of his more, um, physical attributes to give himself the upper hand?

[Raye]

That's why I was going on about King Loki not lying last page. He may still be unable to lie, everything he has said has technically been the truth as far as we are aware, but he has learned to keep it more under control, apparently, so that he can still lie by omission and make jokes. So if Loki can do that, he can go there with a sob story about being banished from Asgard for killing his younger self and yeah, it's totally the old Loki in there again, he may be able to swing it... for a while, at least. Also, when Thor broke Gram, we see a lot of energy being released, it's possible that may have reversed the no-lying thing, at least partly, if it was the Truth Wave that did it in the first place. He hasn't said a whole lot since Gram got broken, so...

But yeah, likely will have to get physical at some point. So gianting up in issue 13. Also, while he does like to rely on his wits and/or magic most of the time, he is a skilled fighter. it hasn't been on display much recently, but he is. He can do this.

[Rosebunse]

That's why I was going on about King Loki not lying last page. He may still be unable to lie, everything he has said has technically been the truth as far as we are aware, but he has learned to keep it more under control, apparently, so that he can still lie by omission and make jokes. So if Loki can do that, he can go there with a sob story about being banished from Asgard for killing his younger self and yeah, it's totally the old Loki in there again, he may be able to swing it... for a while, at least. Also, when Thor broke Gram, we see a lot of energy being released, it's possible that may have reversed the no-lying thing, at least partly, if it was the Truth Wave that did it in the first place. He hasn't said a whole lot since Gram got broken, so...

But yeah, likely will have to get physical at some point. So gianting up in issue 13. Also, while he does like to rely on his wits and/or magic most of the time, he is a skilled fighter. it hasn't been on display much recently, but he is. He can do this.

Interesting thing about Gram. But wouldn't that just make him tell the truth more? Unless the sword's power wanes once it's destroyed, which would be an easy cop-out.

Of course, Loki isn't a bad fighter, but he's really not that great compared to people like Thor and Odin. He only beat Thor in Axis because he got the hammer. He's going to need his brains for this. Like I've said, I'm really interesting in just the craft of seeing Ewing write a story with a character who just can't lie, either in his thoughts or actions.

[Riimi]

Hmm. I hadn't thought that his inability to lie would last that long. Really, I could see it wearing off after his trial, since he guesses that one of the reasons for it is his guilt. Is there anything to indicate that King Loki is unable to lie? I might have missed it. Though it would be interesting to see how Loki (and Ewing) handled it.


I don't think they're getting rid of the current Loki (and I also think he's going to manage to beat King Loki). Funnily enough, I'm more confident of the latter after Al's last interview, if only because he seemed to be implying that the opposite were true. And I don't think he'd actually give it away. Unless it was a double bluff (really, I'm amused by how amused Al and Lee are by all of this). Also, on a pure marketing standpoint, I doubt they're going to get rid of hot young loki for old wrinkly Loki. Even if he did go evil (though I hope he doesn't). Also also, if Loki's arc in JiM had to do with how nobody is innately evil, I think Al's arc has been dealing somewhat with fate and the price of redemption. The second was setup in #9 imo - Loki wasn't truly worthy to wield Mjolnir because he hadn't atoned, or at least that was the idea I got from Al's interview before #10. The first was setup in issue 1 I would argue, with the whole spiel about magic and it not making a good story and how Loki was trying to change his story to avoid becoming evil (again), and then really hammered home in 5. And it would be depressing as hell if the message turns out to be "you can't ever make up for your sins, but that doesn't matter because you can't change anything, anyways."


Also also also, I really like current Loki and I don't want him to be gone. Or for the book to end. This is actually the first comic series I purchased --I've bought some elfquest comics or else it would be the only comic series I've purchased, though I'm seriously contemplating buying Thor-- so I really hope it doesn't get cancelled. (Seriously, a potential redemption arc that incorporates fighting fate in a metafictional manner and includes a sibling relationship that used to be modeled after Cain and Abel was too much for me to resist

[Raye]

Hmm. I hadn't thought that his inability to lie would last that long. Really, I could see it wearing off after his trial, since he guesses that one of the reasons for it is his guilt. Is there anything to indicate that King Loki is unable to lie? I might have missed it. Though it would be interesting to see how Loki (and Ewing) handled it.

Well, obviously when he had Gram sticking out of him, he wasn't lying. But wasn't it kinda weird that it didn't seem to really affect him at all? Almost like he couldn't lie ANYWAY? Also, read issue 4, the King Loki issue. Try and spot a lie. There isn't one. Every time someone asks him a question, he either kinda dodges it giving a vague non-answer, or he tells the complete truth. He tells Odin his real name, he tells them how he got the gold, ("I shot a fish with a bazooka" heh, never gets old), who the sword is for, everything, even if a lie probably would have served him better in most cases. Oh sure, some characters CALL him a liar, but... he didn't lie. but he still came across as kinda deceptive, anyway. He's learned to work around it.

I am pretty sure that particular issue is of critical importance, all round, really. I think a LOT of hints are hidden in that issue. In fact, now I think about it, it may even be Loki's current story in miniature. I bet you anything Odin will make Loki repay Kid Loki's death, just like he had to repay for Otr's death.

I don't think they're getting rid of the current Loki (and I also think he's going to manage to beat King Loki). Funnily enough, I'm more confident of the latter after Al's last interview, if only because he seemed to be implying that the opposite were true. And I don't think he'd actually give it away. Unless it was a double bluff (really, I'm amused by how amused Al and Lee are by all of this). Also, on a pure marketing standpoint, I doubt they're going to get rid of hot young loki for old wrinkly Loki. Even if he did go evil (though I hope he doesn't). Also also, if Loki's arc in JiM had to do with how nobody is innately evil, I think Al's arc has been dealing somewhat with fate and the price of redemption. The second was setup in #9 imo - Loki wasn't truly worthy to wield Mjolnir because he hadn't atoned, or at least that was the idea I got from Al's interview before #10. The first was setup in issue 1 I would argue, with the whole spiel about magic and it not making a good story and how Loki was trying to change his story to avoid becoming evil (again), and then really hammered home in 5. And it would be depressing as hell if the message turns out to be "you can't ever make up for your sins, but that doesn't matter because you can't change anything, anyways."

Yeah. While JIM had a pretty downer ending, it was with a purpose. It had a message that tragic ending got across. If Loki loses to King Loki (though, again, I don't think King Loki is what appears, but still) and goes evil again.. While it would prove Kid Loki's final words right and all, it's not a very nice message for the story to have... and then Kid Loki's death was completely pointless, too.

Also also also, I really like current Loki and I don't want him to be gone. Or for the book to end. This is actually the first comic series I purchased --I've bought some elfquest comics or else it would be the only comic series I've purchased, though I'm seriously contemplating buying Thor-- so I really hope it doesn't get cancelled. (Seriously, a potential redemption arc that incorporates fighting fate in a metafictional manner and includes a sibling relationship that used to be modeled after Cain and Abel was too much for me to resist

I did not realize you were so new to the fandom! Well, welcome aboard.

Now, I think the current VOLUME may end. It is selling just above 20,000, and when a book hits 20,000, that's generally the danger zone, and they frequently are axed not long after. But some books do hang on despite selling lower than this, due to digital and TPB sales, and I think Loki probably falls into this category, given it's audience. (I think it's a fairly safe bet that it has a LOT of female fans, and a lot of new fans, like you, and they seem to gravitate towards digital more than male fans, or more long term readers). Also, this would be an excellent place to relaunch, since it sounds like the King Loki story is coming to a close, and Loki is no longer the Agent of Asgard, so the title doesn't really fit any more. And a relaunch always provides at least a moderate sales boost, which will help keep it going, and if the relaunch is in the wake of Secret Wars, it could have an even bigger boosting effect. Of course, I am just guessing at a relaunch, but... it does make sense to have one, and Marvel has done that in the past with books that have flagging sales, including one of Al Ewing's other books, Mighty Avengers, just recently. Or for more story related reasons, like Thor, or Captain America.

If you hop on board Thor, I recommend getting the trades of Aaron's God of Thunder as well... just... cus they are good. It also sets up some stuff in the current Thor book, a bit, especially with Roxxon. I mean, you can read the current Thor book and follow along just fine, (and it's looking like that may be a good idea, given recent revelations pointing to Thor and Loki's stories being somewhat linked going forward) but I think it will be a fuller experience if you see King Thor in the future (it's the same future King Loki is from) and young Thor in the past, and how that all kinda ties together.

[ROSA13]

Thor #4 (2015) - Seite 21.jpg

that is loki's dadI call it now he will save loki's ass om AOA 12

[ROSA13]

Odin took his son Laufey is a terrible father but still loki is his son..

[Rosebunse]

I think Laufey will save Loki, but indirectly.

[Rosebunse]

You know, I was thinking, doesn't this just all seem very petty? I mean, you have the destruction of everything coming up around the corner, and you still have people wanting to play war. It just puts everything in perspective. What's the point?

Now, I don't mean this from the sense that there's no reason for this comic or any other to exist, I just mean the knowledge of what's happening just makes you realize how stupid so much of this is. Well, maybe not the punishing Loki part. He really should be punished for killing kidLoki.

[ROSA13]

You know, I was thinking, doesn't this just all seem very petty? I mean, you have the destruction of everything coming up around the corner, and you still have people wanting to play war. It just puts everything in perspective. What's the point?

Now, I don't mean this from the sense that there's no reason for this comic or any other to exist, I just mean the knowledge of what's happening just makes you realize how stupid so much of this is. Well, maybe not the punishing Loki part. He really should be punished for killing kidLoki.

I do not think he killed kid loki I bet we all still get a big surprise on AOA13.Odin seems to prefer this Loki.I think he will not return Loki to his biological father "Not Without A Fight"


i’ve never been 100 percent clear on his responsibility towards kid loki’s death, if he killed him in clear conscious or if he was only acting as ‘the murder weapon loki’ Mind Control - makes him innocent

[Riimi]

You know, I was thinking, doesn't this just all seem very petty? I mean, you have the destruction of everything coming up around the corner, and you still have people wanting to play war. It just puts everything in perspective. What's the point?

Now, I don't mean this from the sense that there's no reason for this comic or any other to exist, I just mean the knowledge of what's happening just makes you realize how stupid so much of this is. Well, maybe not the punishing Loki part. He really should be punished for killing kidLoki.

Quick reply to this (I saw your reply to my earlier comments, Raye, and I appreciate them, but I wanted to address this rq).

See, I'm not sure if I agree that Loki needs "punishment" so much as he needs atonement. I don't see that punishing him would accomplish anything (since he's already sorry) other than maintain a sense of justice, but then you get into the dicey issue of who is actually qualified to dispense justice.

If I were Odin, I'd probably sentence him to a lifetime of more or less "community service"-- have him actively do good stuff. Make that his story. For his first assignment, I'd send him to stop the end of the world.

[ROSA13]

Quick reply to this (I saw your reply to my earlier comments, Raye, and I appreciate them, but I wanted to address this rq).

See, I'm not sure if I agree that Loki needs "punishment" so much as he needs atonement. I don't see that punishing him would accomplish anything (since he's already sorry) other than maintain a sense of justice, but then you get into the dicey issue of who is actually qualified to dispense justice.

If I were Odin, I'd probably sentence him to a lifetime of more or less "community service"-- have him actively do good stuff. Make that his story. For his first assignment, I'd send him to stop the end of the world.

yes I am against physical torture Is torture ever justified?


People will say anything, or admit to anything, to avoid being tortured. In some countries with oppressive governments, people will accuse innocent people of criminal activity to save themselves, and innocent people are tortured until they admit to things they didn't do, and punished as scapegoats. Torture is cruel and useless.

[ROSA13]

Preview: Angela: Asgard's Assassin #3

[Raye]

Looks like Loki managed to dodge spilling the beans earlier, in these scene. This skirts awfully close to the whole 'mudrering his younger self' issue. But he managed to not lie while not revealing it, here.

You know, I was thinking, doesn't this just all seem very petty? I mean, you have the destruction of everything coming up around the corner, and you still have people wanting to play war. It just puts everything in perspective. What's the point?

Now, I don't mean this from the sense that there's no reason for this comic or any other to exist, I just mean the knowledge of what's happening just makes you realize how stupid so much of this is. Well, maybe not the punishing Loki part. He really should be punished for killing kidLoki.

Well, they don't realize the end is coming, yet. Remember, Avengers and New Avengers are several months in the future relative to all the other books, so while Thor knows about the incursions THERE, in the rest of the books he does not. We won't know if they put aside their differences or not when faced with the end of everything until Loki #14.

Loki will be in CM Punk's Thor annual story:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...ticle&id=58874





Loki can either REALLY hold his liquor, or he's not drinking. His Emo hair amuses me.