Just how far can any villain, super or otherwise, in fiction, go, before they are beyond redemption?
Has any continutity, or Earth, or adaptation, of the Joker went to the point where you could say 'Yes, they could be a regular citizen/anti-hero/good guy', rather than just a killer, or tormenter, or villain?
One poster I remember saying here that Black Adam had gone too far in the comics, and yet, Geoff Johns still strove to bring him redemption, or be accepted as a hero, or anti-hero.
I think that myself sometimes, that, for example, by the end of Season 4 of Breaking Bad, Walt and Jesse'd gone too far, too far to be redeemed, to quit, or to simply stop killing, breaking the law, making meth.
Maybe some of you'd disagree with me, but in that finale, I just got that thought and feeling, towards the end, whether Season 5 was to exist or not. They were too far gone for me.
Now, for some, the Green Goblin, original flavour, would've gone too far. Killing Gwen Stacy (or not), sleeping with her and having his children. Sleeping with the ex-fiancee of his son, and having her child.
Killing Atlanteans, capturing, drugging and burying alive Aunt May, or trying to brainwash Peter to be the next Green Goblin.
Lots of Dark Reign stuff... and more.
But, in turn, could you accept Harry Osborn, despite his stint as the Green Goblin, as a good person? A friend, ex-husband, a father?
A businessman, a fiancee, a son, a good guy?
My question to all of you here is this:
Are there villains, in manga, anime, any shows, comics, films, games etc, that have, in one continuity or another, gone beyond the point where you could accept them as a hero, good person, or another citizen?
Are there villains that, always, or mostly, you could accept and see making that transition, like Otto Octavius, Helbut Zemo, William 'Sandman' Baker, or otherwise?
I'd like to know.