What does Superman gain from a romance with Wonder Woman?

[Kandor Rising]

said well. smww did some headlines,.but it.never catched fire. now majoritybdoesnt care, it was a short stunts.
if they want a superpowered gf they could give.powers to lois, that made wonders to carol danvers.



well superman was a character that wouldbt looked down at women without powers or stay with sonebody because he is alone consequence of looking down normal humans.
I dont think it did well to.sales or for the characters, none of them is more popular

All DC is short stunts now. Didio's legacy.

[OpticDreams]

said well. smww did some headlines,.but it.never catched fire. now majoritybdoesnt care, it was a short stunts.
if they want a superpowered gf they could give.powers to lois, that made wonders to carol danvers.

Again, I ask why always back to Lois? Is it simply because that is what you want? Why not say Catwoman or any other DC women.

[Kandor Rising]

Again, I ask why always back to Lois? Is it simply because that is what you want? Why not say Catwoman or any other DC women.

Because Lois has been there since Action Comics 1. She is ingrained in every version of Superman. The Nu52 attempted to cut her out and her lack of presence is being felt. WW is a poor substitute and any other DC character would suffer a similar reaction.

[OpticDreams]

Because Lois has been there since Action Comics 1. She is ingrained in every version of Superman. The Nu52 attempted to cut her out and her lack of presence is being felt. WW is a poor substitute and any other DC character would suffer a similar reaction.

Things can change. Change can be good. If things didn't change the world we live in would be bland.

[dangleo61288]

Some of this is true but only in relation to the way comics were structured in the 80's and 90's, where writers used the superhuman/human relationships as means in order to develop conflict and angst. They pretty much rekindled the romance motif from the 60's comics and pulp novels. That made for some good character development at times but as time went by the trope got so pervasive that there wasn't a single issue that didn't delve into love triangles, divorces, or marital problems galore (comics became panels of soap operas). That was all well and good but times change and with it the theme lost strength. The "human" love interest (which was predominantly female mind you) is no longer in need of "much" saving anymore (ie. Mary Jane, Lois Lane). Those stories have been told countless times already and the question of "What happens when a Superhero falls in love with a human?" is no longer relevant since everybody knows the answer already (I'm obviously speaking in terms of story themes).

Doesn't mean that new story themes can't be done with a superhuman and a human dating. Or that a romance can exist with any drama.

In regards to Superman and Wonder Woman they do have a lot of similarities most people tend to ignore (and history as well but that's a topic for another thread entirely). Compassion, loyalty, truth and justice is what drives them (pre and post New52). But despite being very powerful they are alone in the burdens they have to carry on their shoulders. Superman, despite his very best efforts, can never be us because he is better than us by nature. No matter how hard he tries he is still an alien. The same with Wonder Woman - warrior, princess, ambassador. Whether she is clay or the daughter of Gods, she grew up in isolation and despite these hardships, she wants to help humanity with empathy and diplomacy (this isolation theme was more prominent for both of them pre-flashpoint). Hence lies the tragedy/sacrifice and true heroism of both these characters. They might have different approaches, but on this important thing they are the same.

The similarities are dependent on the writers' characterization. In Justice League for example WW and Superman were really different from each other. And the similarities you mentioned above compassion , etc, other characters have like Lois.
And them being burdened by their powers is cliched. Spider man beat them to it. What is wrong with Superman being happy with who is and what he does. Same with Diana. And your statement about Clark not being one of us. A person is who they think they are. I think therefore I am. He just has to choose to be human and he is. Same with WW.

So what do they both gain? On a character level, it creates more synergy. The concept of the Trinity is even better: brother, sister, lover, friend. All the positive relationship types are encompassed in just those three heroes. On a reader's level? It creates more opportunities for better stories.

Better stories. That is subjective. And the story that you and from most of what SM/WW shippers I have read, want is to be told than is that story just as predictable as Lois and Clark. DC writer actually giving you what you want and not doing something brand new.

[Black Angel]

Lets see sex

someone who he rely on to look after things when he can't

someone that can save him when he needs to be saved

Or do you want something more that suits you because people will have different reason.

[dangleo61288]

Things can change. Change can be good. If things didn't change the world we live in would be bland.

Superman can be no longer an alien or have powers,. Wonder Woman being a a science fiction hero, or Lois Lane being Wonder Woman are changes too. Open for any of them.

[manofsteel1979]

Again, I ask why always back to Lois? Is it simply because that is what you want? Why not say Catwoman or any other DC women.

Lois was created alongside Superman for the PURPOSE of being his love interest/foil. She's the only supporting character in the Superman universe to be there FROM THE BEGINNING. Her appearance was based on Joanne Siegel, Jerry Siegel's then to be future wife. Her place in the Superman mythos is iron clad.

Yes, he has other love interests over the decades, but yes, it DOES eventually come down to Lois. She is the ALPHA and OMEGA when it comes to that part of the mythology. Doesn't mean there can't be deviations and detours...but eventually like it or not all roads lead back to her. It's just fact. Sorry to disappoint you. Just how it is.

[manofsteel1979]

Things can change. Change can be good. If things didn't change the world we live in would be bland.

..and sometimes things just WORK better than others.Not all change is bad. Conversely not all change is good. S/WW for a temporary diversion if written well? Good change. S/WW permanent? NOT a good change.

[Sacred Knight]

I don't even look at it from a point of view of diversion or permanent. Because there's no reason to. Its an ongoing continuity for a reason; nothing is written in stone. They'll do what they feel is best for business, period. If they think that's Superman and Wonder Woman, it'll continue. If that starts to dwindle in popularity it'll stop. If they then thing putting him back with Lois is best for business then they'll do that. Or maybe they'll feel it best for them to still just do the close friend dynamic. Point being, they really can do what they want in this regard, nothing says they have to come back to this or stay with that or whatever.

Hell if they REALLY wanted to, and had any sort of sound business reason to, they could keep Lois out of the Superman books if they wanted to. I can't imagine that ever being a wise decision, but its just an exaggeration to point out the fact that they own these properties and can do as they like with them.

[OpticDreams]

..and sometimes things just WORK better than others.Not all change is bad. Conversely not all change is good. S/WW for a temporary diversion if written well? Good change. S/WW permanent? NOT a good change.

It all a matter of opinion. You may think SM/WW is bad and that is your opinion, and my opinion is that its good.

[dianalela7]

I'm still pretty new to the comics fandom. I'm enjoying SM/WW.

What DC is or isnt "pushing", I cant say. Even if I were to venture a guess at it, it seems that these things change pretty frequently. What I can say is that, I am enjoying reading how the dynamic of these 2 characters is playing out.

To me, what kinds of things they learn from each other is still ongoing. Im looking forward to more.

[The World]

Ironically, I think the book that got the Superman/Wonder Woman relationship right is Injustice. She has an unrequited love for him but he is so obsessed with Lois he will literally rule the world to avenge her death.

Reminds me of a quote

"Love is weakness" is a cliche. I don't believe there's some inherent fault in those in love and I don't sneer at families or friends, whom love makes stronger. I will say love is an intoxicant. Some people can take it - they're emboldened by it. I have nothing but respect for them. But there are those - and he is one - who drink it in like alcohol and end up messy and sobbing on the floor, useless. The morning won't be kind.

A character like Superman falls into the latter category people who I don't think can't really handle love, too much and he starts to fall apart at the seams. It's funny though because his very existence is reliant on the concept. The love of his parents lets him survive the destruction of Krypton and the love of the Kents helps him on the path to becoming Superman, but when we get to Lois it's starts to become an issue for him. Superman had to lose his powers and abandon the world before he could be with her in Pre-Crisis days. Kal-L got to marry his universe's Lois but went on to become a complete nut later on and eventually died for it (and then became a zombie). Pre-Flashpoint went bad like a tooth with an infected pulp; the more he began to get wrapped up in his own happy world with Lois the less it seemed he understood about the world outside of it and how to navigate it as a hero.

Some characters like Spiderman can function with the love of their life and be a hero; he can be strengthened by his love for MJ but he can stand perfectly well alone. But for Superman it's one or the other, the hero life or the love of his lie; one inevitably makes him lose focus of the other.

[Sacred Knight]

I'm still pretty new to the comics fandom. I'm enjoying SM/WW.

What DC is or isnt "pushing", I cant say. Even if I were to venture a guess at it, it seems that these things change pretty frequently. What I can say is that, I am enjoying reading how the dynamic of these 2 characters is playing out.

To me, what kinds of things they learn from each other is still ongoing. Im looking forward to more.

They do change pretty often. Then go back. Then change again. Then change. Then go back to the original. Its cyclical. So based on that the smart money does say Lois will be back in the picture at some point in the future, then will leave, then WW will reenter it, then someone new will be introduced, and so on and so forth. Just the nature of comics and the way they try and stay relevant with really old characters. Again there's nothing saying this has to be the way it goes forever, this regime could break that habit if they wanted to and business justified it, but just as easily the dance could remain the same.

But if you're enjoying this now I'm pretty confident in saying you can get comfortable for a while, as I don't think its going anywhere just yet.

[jimishim12]

Reminds me of a quote

"Love is weakness" is a cliche. I don't believe there's some inherent fault in those in love and I don't sneer at families or friends, whom love makes stronger. I will say love is an intoxicant. Some people can take it - they're emboldened by it. I have nothing but respect for them. But there are those - and he is one - who drink it in like alcohol and end up messy and sobbing on the floor, useless. The morning won't be kind.

A character like Superman falls into the latter category people who I don't think can't really handle love, too much and he starts to fall apart at the seams. It's funny though because his very existence is reliant on the concept. The love of his parents lets him survive the destruction of Krypton and the love of the Kents helps him on the path to becoming Superman, but when we get to Lois it's starts to become an issue for him. Superman had to lose his powers and abandon the world before he could be with her in Pre-Crisis days. Kal-L got to marry his universe's Lois but went on to become a complete nut later on and eventually died for it (and then became a zombie). Pre-Flashpoint went bad like a tooth with an infected pulp; the more he began to get wrapped up in his own happy world with Lois the less it seemed he understood about the world outside of it and how to navigate it as a hero.

Some characters like Spiderman can function with the love of their life and be a hero; he can be strengthened by his love for MJ but he can stand perfectly well alone. But for Superman it's one or the other, the hero life or the love of his lie; one inevitably makes him lose focus of the other.

This is one of the problems I have with Spidey x MJ iMO, it delegates parker as a lovesick reactor to be a hero than generally noble and heroic ideal.

As for the topic, Superman relates to Wonder Woman on a perspective level and emotional sense. Being with human love interests would be tragic in the long run for him if him or Lois or any other woman born on earth would be in a commitment with the man of steel, Like Thor and Jane Foster for example knowing that he's a god and she's a mortal he will out live her and be more elightened than her about the concept of fundamental existence between human life and godhood, so he ends up with Sif(another god) like in the legends. Superman is the same, and he marries Wonder Woman in the future anyways so it really doesn't matter. Lois may be a core function of Superman's character, but she's not the fundamental response that defines Superman's MO as a champion and a general character, that would be Lex or the Kents or Jor El. Lois(and sometimes Jimmy and Grant) IMO is just a side narrative piece that the human part of Clark interacts with for the sake of drama and suspense. Love between Lois and Clark was always kinda lackluster, Lois feels like a shallow representation of the human race because she's more immature and headstrong than superman on a professional level which you may as well make her robin to the more professional and direct batman, now with Diana she's as go getting as Lois but she holds her self with more composure and grace which I feel Superman would compliment Superman's rough and unpolished earnestness.

And this is all I have to say.