Betsy Braddock: Psylocke Appreciation 2018

[Psy]

Meh, I am here for it. I don't see anything taboo with it at all and find it very interesting. Technically she is at the very least half Betsy and that's not even close to incest.

Maybe that'll be my next piece. It would be epic.

[WallStreeter]

Meh, I am here for it. I don't see anything taboo with it at all and find it very interesting. Technically she is at the very least half Betsy and that's not even close to incest.

Maybe that'll be my next piece. It would be epic.

It's not because it does nothing about Kwannon's characterisation, doesn't let us know who she really is, etc. Not a good development for Kwannon at all.

Kwannon should have her pre Psylocke merger past discovered and explored. Psylocke's British and Captain Britain ties have been too long neglected.

I would very much like to see Kwannon on X-Force or maybe on an Emma Frost lead Inner Circle (If Emma's team is somewhat heroic/anti hero). Or if Excalibur is relaunched and Psylocke goes there to join up, only then would I like to see Kwannon in the X-Men.

Psylocke and Kwannon were a part of each other in the sense that Carol Danvers is a part of Rogue. Rogue's absorption of Carol is what lead her to join the X-men in the first place and get help from Xavier. She doesn't have Carol's mind trapped in her in more, but that time Carol was a part of her, combined with any echo of ghost of Carol in her (those absorbed by Rogue leave echos of themselves in her) means that in that since Carol will always be a part of her. That does not mean Rogue and Carol should become girlfriends.

Similarly though Psylocke is in a British body, she is still using martial arts and applications of her powers (psychic weapons) she got from Kwannon. Kwannon is in her body, but she has telepathic and telekinetic powers because of the merger with Psylocke (before she was only an empath). So in a way they'll always be a part of each other.

And characters who are a part of each other like this do not belong in romantic relationships. It's not taboo, its extremely bad writing/poor taste.

[WallStreeter]

Randomly making straight characters gay also doesn't work. In Iceman's case it only worked because writers had left hints about this for years (he had relationships with two beings that could change their genders, Cloud and Mystique), he was involved with Polaris (but never had sex with her), the fact that he never stayed with any of his girlfriends for long, his depression and other personal issues, and the issues between his father and him left an opening that there could be sexuality issues, so they made him gay.

However randomly every character gay on the whim of fan fantasies is ridiculous.

And I'm gay btw. I've never seen any evidence that Psylocke is gay. When her boyfriend FantoMex had a female form Cluster she and Psylocke kissed (but that's basically her kissing a man trapped in a woman's body). Of course that went nowhere.

I'd rather Marvel give real LGBT characters like Karma and Northstar better development and exposure.

[Havok83]

Randomly making straight characters gay also doesn't work. In Iceman's case it only worked because writers had left hints about this for years (he had relationships with two beings that could change their genders, Cloud and Mystique), he was involved with Polaris (but never had sex with her), the fact that he never stayed with any of his girlfriends for long, his depression and other personal issues, and the issues between his father and him left an opening that there could be sexuality issues, so they made him gay.

However randomly every character gay on the whim of fan fantasies is ridiculous.

And I'm gay btw. I've never seen any evidence that Psylocke is gay. When her boyfriend FantoMex had a female form Cluster she and Psylocke kissed (but that's basically her kissing a man trapped in a woman's body). Of course that went nowhere.

I'd rather Marvel give real LGBT characters like Karma and Northstar better development and exposure.

Psylocke and Cluster had sex. It was more than a kiss

[WallStreeter]

Psylocke and Cluster had sex. It was more than a kiss

Still it with with her boyfriend in a temporary female form. It doesn't make her a lesbian, and to me was a poorly written story for shock value. Writing a story in which two real women embark on a relationship is very different.

[Havok83]

Still it with with her boyfriend in a temporary female form. It doesn't make her a lesbian, and to me was a poorly written story for shock value. Writing a story in which two real women embark on a relationship is very different.

It doesnt make her a lesbian; it makes her bisexual or sexually fluid

[Psy]

Still it with with her boyfriend in a temporary female form. It doesn't make her a lesbian, and to me was a poorly written story for shock value. Writing a story in which two real women embark on a relationship is very different.

Umm no, she was a full blown lesbian in that relation and a confirmed bisexual. If my husband were in a female body as a gay man. No, we would not be even kissing let alone having sex. I'm a gay man. It does not work like that.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

It wasn't confirmed in the comics, after all Buffy did much the same in the comics and only fans consider her bi...and it doesn't work also as having a female form of a guy either so...I wouldn't consider Betsy gay or bi or fluid...

[Havok83]

It wasn't confirmed in the comics, after all Buffy did much the same in the comics and only fans consider her bi...and it doesn't work also as having a female form of a guy either so...I wouldn't consider Betsy gay or bi or fluid...

What wasnt confirmed? Sex bc if thats what you are referring to, yes it was.

[Izanami]

It wasn't confirmed in the comics, after all Buffy did much the same in the comics and only fans consider her bi...and it doesn't work also as having a female form of a guy either so...I wouldn't consider Betsy gay or bi or fluid...

That is because the writers don't know anything about bisexuals and didn't realize that they made Buffy that way. Regardless how many word of gods they make saying she is straight. They made a mistake and continue with the whole bisexual erasure they previously did on Willow.
Betsy is fluid and bi at this point. Characterization marches on regardless if you like it or not. OTP is not an end all be all especially in comics.

[Tazirai]

I wonder if we’ll see Neal Shaara’s reaction to Betsy’s resurrection and her reversion to her original body.

Where has Neal been anyway? I wouldn't the two of them getting some makeup sex lol.

[Tazirai]

It's not because it does nothing about Kwannon's characterisation, doesn't let us know who she really is, etc. Not a good development for Kwannon at all.

Kwannon should have her pre Psylocke merger past discovered and explored. Psylocke's British and Captain Britain ties have been too long neglected.

I would very much like to see Kwannon on X-Force or maybe on an Emma Frost lead Inner Circle (If Emma's team is somewhat heroic/anti hero). Or if Excalibur is relaunched and Psylocke goes there to join up, only then would I like to see Kwannon in the X-Men.

Psylocke and Kwannon were a part of each other in the sense that Carol Danvers is a part of Rogue. Rogue's absorption of Carol is what lead her to join the X-men in the first place and get help from Xavier. She doesn't have Carol's mind trapped in her in more, but that time Carol was a part of her, combined with any echo of ghost of Carol in her (those absorbed by Rogue leave echos of themselves in her) means that in that since Carol will always be a part of her. That does not mean Rogue and Carol should become girlfriends.

Similarly though Psylocke is in a British body, she is still using martial arts and applications of her powers (psychic weapons) she got from Kwannon. Kwannon is in her body, but she has telepathic and telekinetic powers because of the merger with Psylocke (before she was only an empath). So in a way they'll always be a part of each other.

And characters who are a part of each other like this do not belong in romantic relationships. It's not taboo, its extremely bad writing/poor taste.

Agreed with all this.

Making them Romantic is beyond dumb and Fanservicey, and the epitome of hack writing just to ship someone or appear edgy for fans who need a LGBT Psylocke for whatever reason that has nothing to do with actual Character development.
They still haven't even dealt with her changes outside of that one Interaction with Tony Stark.

Marvel doesn't let characters grow anymore. Everything has ot be combat and flash and glam with a side of wack scripts and poor dialogue.

[Tazirai]

Still it with with her boyfriend in a temporary female form. It doesn't make her a lesbian, and to me was a poorly written story for shock value. Writing a story in which two real women embark on a relationship is very different.

Agreed when Humphries wrote this, it was hack writing and purely to making an already over-sexualized character. he tried so many things with her that just didn't work outside of looking cool for people who think looking cool is better than characterization AND looking cool.
Remember all the cursing that she did? She doesn't explore that anymore. Most writers pretty much ignored Humphries run with several characters.

It doesnt make her a lesbian; it makes her bisexual or sexually fluid

Not necessarily. If there were more instances of all this Bi-Sexualness and Sexual Fluidness most of us would be okay. I write a Bi-sexual Betsy
(Eliza) and it's a natural thing as she's always been that way and never hid it. Making her Bi-sexual for bisexuals sake does what?
It's one of the reasons I never had an issue with Northstar's coming out, but despised how they did it with Iceman.

[Psy]

Betsy is Bisexual, period.

IMO a Betsy and Kwannon relationship is better than any other idea I've heard in here or any of the absurd fanfic I've seen.

I'm down with it.

[Tazirai]

Betsy is Bisexual, period.

IMO a Betsy and Kwannon relationship is better than any other idea I've heard in here or any of the absurd fanfic I've seen.

I'm down with it.

You don't Publish her in a comic on a monthly basis or have any more direct inpu ton what she is than I do. You can say she is and add period at the end. If Marvel doesn't agree with you, then Marvel doesn't agree with you.
Kwannon and Betsy as a couple is a terrible idea, but hey that's just my opinion.