SECRET WARS #2 Spoilers

[ian0delond]

Maybe, but Wiccan seems to have been getting a steady power-creep over time. Even disregarding these panels, he's one of the strongest potential reality warpers, it's impossible for him to not be doing anything for Secret Wars. Also She-Hulk just made aside references, but with Wiccan it had story/plot relevance.

Anyway I found out he and Speed are appearing in a House of M Secret Wars tie-in, because apparently there's a Battleworld for alternate timelines, not just universes. I don't even know how that works but at least he's appearing again, so we can see what happens.

It can't do anything if he is dead.
Secret Wars 0 showed that even a reality wrapper such as Franklin is useless against an incursion.

Forget the path of reality wrapper.

[vitruvian]

I know it seems like it's flat but.... it can't be. Look at the map. It is a continuous landmass that wraps around, and the shape of the map itself indicates a sphere. It could be we are looking at something like a hollow planet, and (somehow) the Cabal's life raft ended up INSIDE it.... or alternately, Battleworld itself is what's on the inside of the sphere, like a Dyson Sphere, and the liferaft is on the outside.

There were stars on the other side, so it can't be the inside of a sphere... but then, the lead Thor tells us there are stars on the side that has Doomgard too, so that can't be the inside of a sphere either. But yeah, it wraps around on the sides....

Maybe we'll be able to tell when somebody draws a panel showing the view from Knowhere.

[Iron Maiden]

I hadn't read that before (too long thread) so thanks for re-posting, sounds like a plausible theory.

Yes, it is. I think there's a lot of things tied up with the intangibles like faith in god, believing a story etc.

edited to add. And when it comes to the power of story, who had more of it that Marvel's launching pad comic the Fantastic Four? Doom probably is the most storied character in the MU along with the FF themselves. They're going be major players I suspect. We just haven't seen where they all ended up yet.

[Haquim]

Nope, not 25 years. About 13, probably. He only started once the Molecule Man was created, that occurred after the Fantastic Four had their origin, and that happened no more than about 13 years ago in Marvel time. There were still about 12 years left on the fuse when the final Incursion happened. Some wiggle room here, it could be 14-15 years and therefore 11-10 years left on the clock, but Peter Parker had become Spider-Man by that point at age 15, and he is not 40 years old when boarding the life raft.

I wrote 25 years because IIRC that's the amount of time Molecule Man gave him before everything was erased (SA #33). It could be as you say though.

[Biclopcicle]

I wrote 25 years because IIRC that's the amount of time Molecule Man gave him before everything was erased (SA #33). It could be as you say though.

The fuse goes off in 25 years. That point was not reached

[Raye]

There were stars on the other side, so it can't be the inside of a sphere... but then, the lead Thor tells us there are stars on the side that has Doomgard too, so that can't be the inside of a sphere either. But yeah, it wraps around on the sides....

Maybe we'll be able to tell when somebody draws a panel showing the view from Knowhere.

There's no guarantee that the 'stars' are the same as on the real world, burning balls of gas billions upon billions of miles away. In fact, we know this most likely is not the case, since Battleworld and all on it is supposed to be the only thing in existence. The stars (and the 'suns') could be tiny little things.

[Bunai]

This issue made me laugh out loud. It was like Prince Valiant mixed with that Adventure Time episode when the Ice King wrote fanfiction and wanted it to come to life but then regretted it.

[vitruvian]

It can't do anything if he is dead.
Secret Wars 0 showed that even a reality wrapper such as Franklin is useless against an incursion.

Forget the path of reality wrapper.

There are no more Incursions happening, though... so what's to say Franklin isn't perfectly capable of creating new universes, even if he couldn't prevent the collisions of the old ones? Or Wiccan pulling a similar stunt once he comes into his own as the Demiurge?

For all we know, at the moment of the final Incursion, as Franklin's section of the raft seems to disintegrate, that's Doom pulling him away to join him, and Doom using his accumulated power to create the Battleworld from the Incursion zones he's been saving (perhaps that was what was in the well that shocked Strange?), while Franklin created a single physical universe in which to place it. With only a single universe, there can be no further Incursions, since there are no other universes with which to collide.

[vitruvian]

I wrote 25 years because IIRC that's the amount of time Molecule Man gave him before everything was erased (SA #33). It could be as you say though.

That was the length of the fuse, yes, but 25 years have not passed in the MU since the Molecule Man was created. If they had, then Peter Parker would be 40. Is he 40? If not, then it can't have been 25 years.

Also, the Incursions were not the product of that fuse reaching its end, remember... it's down to Doom causing the multiversal collapse early and piece meal by assassinating Molecule Men.

[Haquim]

The fuse goes off in 25 years. That point was not reached

Because Doom felt sure he had enough power when he challanged the beyonders and that accelerated the destruction of everything? That seems to work just fine. Thanks to you and Vitruvian for the precisation then

[vitruvian]

There's no guarantee that the 'stars' are the same as on the real world, burning balls of gas billions upon billions of miles away. In fact, we know this most likely is not the case, since Battleworld and all on it is supposed to be the only thing in existence. The stars (and the 'suns') could be tiny little things.

True, but even if they're tiny little stars pretty close by, they're still not on Battleworld... and neither is Knowhere. So the statement that Battleworld is the only thing in existence simply isn't correct regardless. It might be the only place where people live (well, except Knowhere), or the only thing that matters... but there is other stuff.

[Biclopcicle]

Because Doom felt sure he had enough power when he challanged the beyonders and that accelerated the destruction of everything? That seems to work just fine. Thanks to you and Vitruvian for the precisation then

He felt like, over the years of pondering possible weaknesses of the Beyonders, he had found a way to destroy them. And it was in the magical box

[Iron Maiden]

He felt like, over the years of pondering possible weaknesses of the Beyonders, he had found a way to destroy them. And it was in the magical box

Yeah, what was that anyway? A stack of time platforms??

[RLAAMJR.]

Did 616 Storm show up?

[Peter Parker]

I think it might be something covered in the Last Days of Loki and in any case I will be picking that up next week. And as was pointed out by the Loki fans earlier, maybe Ewing added more foreshadowing than we knew when Doom did confront Loki in the Axis tie in, they had a duel based on their stories. And Doom bested Loki on that count.

Could Doom be holding things together with the power of story? He seemed somewhat distracted and Susan seems to be their at his side for that reason. I think Val, Stephen and Sue are helping him to keep things going because there's really nothing else right now. Even back when Molecule Man and Doom were first talking in NA, Doom would ask MM about his story.

Of all the other writers @ Marvel sofar Ewing does seem to be the one most "bought in" to Hickman's concepts. Seems like Bendis (especially) and the others are just sort of ignoring whats going on in the buildup to Secret War. I would not be surprised to find some discontent there in feeling that everyone's books more or less are being editorally forced into an end of the world 8 months out.