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  1. #5176
    Ultimate Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleo_Rage View Post
    Yes, not every single Black person in that time was a slave but that doesnt change that if they want back south they would have been enslaved. Black people in the north escaped slavery or were freed by former slave owners. Thatt doesnt change the fact that during that time Black people were enslaved in the US and they were born into slavery in the US or that they were only seen as 3/5 of a person.
    Not all of them were EVER slaves. Some of them sere indentured servants and most of them were free men after their service contract ran out.

  2. #5177
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    A blonde wig with bangs, does not Illyana make. This cast is already too old for these characters. Illyana was like 14 during most of these New Mutants stories.
    Good thing this isnt the comics. Im also of the mindset that her age shouldnt affect her ability to play the role considering she's contemporary to the rest of the NMs and cast. From what little we've seen, Anya appears to be the breakout as Illyana
    Last edited by Havok83; 08-02-2020 at 09:03 PM.

  3. #5178
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    Good thing this isnt the comics. Im also of the mindset that her age shouldnt affect her ability to play the role considering she's contemporary to the rest of the NMs and cast. From what little we've seen, Anya appears to be the breakout as Illyana
    Agreed. The age thing sounds like complaining for no other reason than to complain.

  4. #5179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ambaryerno View Post
    Agreed. The age thing sounds like complaining for no other reason than to complain.
    Spoken like someone who's never met the fans

  5. #5180
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Not all of them were EVER slaves. Some of them sere indentured servants and most of them were free men after their service contract ran out.
    Yes like 1% of the pop.
    GrindrStone(D)

  6. #5181
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    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Not all of them were EVER slaves. Some of them sere indentured servants and most of them were free men after their service contract ran out.
    Boy if you don’t get off Beyoncé’s internet thinking you gonna tell me about slavery when I have ancestors who were slaves.

  7. #5182
    Astonishing Member mugiwara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    Good thing this isnt the comics. Im also of the mindset that her age shouldnt affect her ability to play the role considering she's contemporary to the rest of the NMs and cast. From what little we've seen, Anya appears to be the breakout as Illyana
    But when will we get (if we get) another New Mutants movie? I mean, this one isn't even out yet.

    All MCU movies have been delayed and there may even be other delays, depending of how things turn out with the virus.

    The mutants won't probably have a MCU movie before 2024. And, as much as I don't want it to be the case, it will probably be about the same X-gatekeepers who were already in 20 years of Fox movies.
    Maybe, just maybe, Illyana could appear before the other New Mutants, since she is quite popular.
    But a proper New Mutants movie? Not before they've milked Scott, Logan, Ororo, Kitty, Charles and Erik to death. So make it at least 2035.
    Bringing back the old, killing the young: that's the Marvel way

  8. #5183

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    The New Mutants can't exist independently of the rest of the X-Men universe. Illyana was taught white magic by Ororo. She is Piotr's little sister. Kitty is her best friend. The team was assembled by Charles(infected by a Brood Queen) and Moira. The Hellfire Club and Hellions and White Queen, Magneto, and Cable are all very important to their story. They are young teenagers in these old stories. This is the core of the characters. I don't understand how you can dismiss all those truths.

    This film is an outlier. It will be lucky to get any box office/theater action in this day and age, and it is a deadend creatively given the studio that greenlit it has been acquired by Disney. If Fox was so proud of this film they should have released it two years ago when they said they were going to. That they didn't is all on them. The cast are all in their 20's now, essentially a decade older than their characters. Even if by some random miracle Disney wanted to continue with them, they'd be over 30 before they even concluded their trilogy. That doesn't fly for teen-aged characters anymore.

    If you all actually want proper New Mutants content(be that shows or films), yes, you're going to have to wait a good long while.
    Let the flames destroy all but that which is pure and true!

  9. #5184
    Astonishing Member mugiwara's Avatar
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    Carol Danvers can't exist without Mar Vell. Scott Lang can't exist without Hank Pym.

    Yet, they've gone straight to Captain Carol and to Scott Lang movies, while Mar Vell and Hank were just support characters whose adventures happened before the movies.

    I'm sure they won't do the same with the X-Men, but if they wanted, they could. They could tell that all the X-gatekeepers existed in the last century but got erased from reality by Legion or by the Dark Phoenix. And that Dani, Sam and the others are the first of a new generation of mutants.
    Bringing back the old, killing the young: that's the Marvel way

  10. #5185
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    Considering that for years we didn't know if Limbo would be part of Illyana's backstory in the movie or that she'd still have her soul sword or armor, they can make many changes. Heck, the group isn't even gathered by Xavier and there was never any chance he would have been under the influence of the Brood even before we found out it takes place in a mental institution. Things like the alternate Storm were always not going to in a live action New Mutants because who wants to try to explain how alternate timelines work with Limbo in these movies. Movie universes are going to be different, from none of the X-Men movies having the 05 be the first team to the Avengers having Black Widow, Hawkeye, and Captain America as founding members instead of Ant Man and the Wasp and being brought together by Nick Fury and Shield instead of coming together on their own.

  11. #5186

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    Except they did use Mar Vell and Hank Pym. And they just used the Ultimates backstory more than the eccentric millionaires club from the 60's version for the Avengers.

    This project is already dead in the water. Why not see the truth of the situation instead of fiercely defending a film which has done nothing to warrant such loyalty?

    And if you think this film will outgross Captain Marvel, or even the Ant Man films.... good luck with that.
    Let the flames destroy all but that which is pure and true!

  12. #5187
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    It's one thing to complain about real problems like Roberto's casting or the delays. It's another to complain about things that would never be the way you describe even if everything about the movie was was absolutely perfect. The New Mutants could have been the greatest film since Citizen Kane and made The Dark Knight look like a cheesy children's film in comparison and there still would have been no old Storm teaching white magic to Illyana. The only way something like that would have been in the movie at all would have been if it was an adaptation of the Magik mini and not a New Mutants movie.

  13. #5188
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mugiwara View Post
    But when will we get (if we get) another New Mutants movie? I mean, this one isn't even out yet.

    All MCU movies have been delayed and there may even be other delays, depending of how things turn out with the virus.

    The mutants won't probably have a MCU movie before 2024. And, as much as I don't want it to be the case, it will probably be about the same X-gatekeepers who were already in 20 years of Fox movies.
    Maybe, just maybe, Illyana could appear before the other New Mutants, since she is quite popular.
    But a proper New Mutants movie? Not before they've milked Scott, Logan, Ororo, Kitty, Charles and Erik to death. So make it at least 2035.
    We wont, at least not with this cast. This will be a one and done thing which makes the complaints about age even more pointless

    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    The New Mutants can't exist independently of the rest of the X-Men universe. Illyana was taught white magic by Ororo. She is Piotr's little sister. Kitty is her best friend. The team was assembled by Charles(infected by a Brood Queen) and Moira. The Hellfire Club and Hellions and White Queen, Magneto, and Cable are all very important to their story. They are young teenagers in these old stories. This is the core of the characters. I don't understand how you can dismiss all those truths. .
    As is the Demon Bear, which this film has but you ignore. A film cant tackle every villian a team has infamously faced but this film has arguably the most iconic one thats tied to the classic run. Why dismiss that to try and make a point? The Demon Bear itself gives the film a chance to highlight aspects that are core to the NMs characterization. Dani's power and backstory with her family. Rahne's religious upbringing and how it shaped how she views the world. Illyana's ties to limbo and her own demonic ties. Sam and Bobby's own traumas with their father and girlfriend respectively. The Demon Bear as a unifier that brings them together is an interesting choice that could work and its a great way to introduce these characters and give them that development through a window into their fears
    Last edited by Havok83; 08-04-2020 at 07:45 AM.

  14. #5189
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunofdarkchild View Post
    Considering that for years we didn't know if Limbo would be part of Illyana's backstory in the movie or that she'd still have her soul sword or armor, they can make many changes. Heck, the group isn't even gathered by Xavier and there was never any chance he would have been under the influence of the Brood even before we found out it takes place in a mental institution. Things like the alternate Storm were always not going to in a live action New Mutants because who wants to try to explain how alternate timelines work with Limbo in these movies. Movie universes are going to be different
    Yes, I think we're all well aware of that.
    But to be fair he did say....
    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    If you all actually want proper New Mutants content (be that shows or films), yes, you're going to have to wait a good long while.
    So I don't think throwing some **** together and slapping the 'New Mutants' name on it will be counted as such....just look at the current
    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    Except they did use Mar Vell and Hank Pym. And they just used the Ultimates backstory more than the eccentric millionaires club from the 60's version for the Avengers.
    Yeeeeah that's what I was thinking

    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    This project is already dead in the water. Why not see the truth of the situation instead of fiercely defending a film which has done nothing to warrant such loyalty?
    Dude I know right? Brand Loyalty? Fake News Overload?
    GrindrStone(D)

  15. #5190
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post
    Yes, I think we're all well aware of that.
    But to be fair he did say....

    So I don't think throwing some **** together and slapping the 'New Mutants' name on it will be counted as such....just look at the current
    Yeeeeah that's what I was thinking

    Dude I know right? Brand Loyalty? Fake News Overload?
    What is the 'proper New Mutants content' that was talked about?

    "The New Mutants can't exist independently of the rest of the X-Men universe. Illyana was taught white magic by Ororo. She is Piotr's little sister. Kitty is her best friend. The team was assembled by Charles(infected by a Brood Queen) and Moira. The Hellfire Club and Hellions and White Queen, Magneto, and Cable are all very important to their story. They are young teenagers in these old stories. This is the core of the characters. I don't understand how you can dismiss all those truths."

    Sure sounds like what is being said is the movie has to have old Storm, Kitty Pryde, the Hellfire Club, the Hellions, the White Queen, Magneto, and Cable You know what the movie doesn't need at all? Old Storm, Kitty Pryde, the Hellfire Club, the Hellions, the White Queen, Magneto, and Cable. Every last one of those is superfluous in the Demon Bear story and only matter in the long run if you want a beat for beat retelling of the comics like the animated Dark Knight Returns and Batman Year One. It's like saying there has never been a proper Batman movie because they never showed that he was raised by Leslie Thompkins or Dick Grayson leaving to become Nightwing. These are important aspects of Batman's character in the comics, and yet they don't matter one whit when moving to another medium.

    I wasn't thrilled when I first heard the film would take place in a mental institution and not at Xavier's school. As a fan of the character of Magik I'm not 100% sold on her depiction in the film and won't be until I've seen how it all comes together. I'm not happy with the Roberto situation and not sold that making Dani and Rahne's relationship a romance is a good change. And I'm worried about how they can cover all the ground they need to with these characters in such a short runtime. But I'm also realistic about what elements can be included in a film to begin with. The movie would have to have a very specific plot to have Moira included at all. I was bracing for a long time for Illyana to just be a teleporter with no Limbo or soul sword even hinted at because of the seeming difficulty in adapting her to the fullest extent, and I'm thrilled that all the things I thought were going to be ignored are actually included. If this was set in the school I would have preferred that she be out of place and shunned, not sure how to interact with people her own age like she was in issue 14 when she first joined the New Mutants and only become a badass with sass when the film moves her into her element of fighting demons, but in the setting the chose it makes sense to me that she'd be the more confident one from the start since she alone could just leave at any time. New Mutants is not the movie I would have made if they came to me and asked me to write or direct it, and that's fine. I'm open to something that is it's own interpretation and differs from the comics. I'm not going to judge the setting or replacing Prof. X will Cecilia Rayes until I see how they play out

    You want to cover everything from the original New Mutants series, from Magneto to the Hellions to Inferno to Cable? It was never going to happen no matter how many movies they ended up making. The film medium doesn't allow for that. Only a tv show could possibly hope to cover that much material. There's wanting a good movie that capture's the spirit of the comics, which is fine and what we all want, and then there's setting a standard no comic book movie from any franchise has ever met or will ever meet because it's impossible.

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