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  1. #5596
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Am I the only one who feels that the whitewashing tangent has kinda said said everything there is to say?
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  2. #5597
    Spectacular Member OblivionX33's Avatar
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    Nope you are right

  3. #5598
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Since this is a social/cultural thing outside comics, I'll just go with the first thing that pops into my head. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZypKcB-w5VY
    I don't think you could be any further from the point
    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Then again I'm pretty sure the Acolytes and Brotherhood(both of them) have done the same thing in comics.
    Yes in a similar way members of Christianity are called brother(monks) sister(nuns) father but those are inherently different and calling someone a sister or my brother
    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Alternatively one could argue that if it's only Storm she calls that then it's the same logic by which she called Cannonball "Cornpone".
    I mean one could argue a person arguing slang usage frim a culture they obviously know nothing about betrays an uninformed and supercilious mind....but yes like Hee nickname for CB sister is only correct when applied to Storm coming from another black char [/QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Speech? aside from the sister thing?
    Do you have examples of her speech reserved only for another minority group?
    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Yeah but I'm not the person who claimed she was consistently portrayed as "black". Also the darker ones are the relatively recent ones.
    This discussion got started because people asserted that the film casting was wrong because the character was absolutely definitely black..... So the real question is why do YOU want her to be black and not some other form of Hispanic person?
    lol what other forms do Hispanic people coming in? fact is it's not just me but dozens of websites list CeCe as a black superhero
    http://worldofblackheroes.com/2010/08/18/cecilia-reyes/

    The OG New Muabts creators/artists also commented on the lack of diversity within the cast her own Creator admitted a goal of his is to add diversity in comics Which he did 2fold as CeCe was only the 2nd black X-chick the first Hispanic to join in it's entire 60yr run which is really sad
    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Now you're being silly. I already pointed out why her appearance IS such a big question. You say "same skin tone as other black characters", but the original appearances(and at least some of the later ones) are of someone with a hair and skin tone that's not exceptionally dark and
    is light enough to be a non-black Hispanic.
    Bruh you posted ONE dusty image of her amid the many images of her much darker including 1st appearance... artists draw differently their stylized choice doesn't automatically become canon.....No one thinks Cap America is walking around like this all the time....
    C07EE624-DEA1-4843-B61B-F022BCF26E8D.jpg
    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Since you guys like data so much... Here's a pic of Iara dos Santos for comparison.
    Attachment 100361
    This is from the first scene in the comics when Iara is seen in human form in daylight. Or are you going to try to argue Iara should be considered black too?
    Is there anything that disqualifies her? Have you posted ANYthing that would eliminate black as CeCe's racial background?
    Quote Originally Posted by AtheistInRed View Post
    man linked a gospel song to his post Lmaoooo bruh
    I mean if that was what came to mind then.... I'll keep praying
    GrindrStone(D)

  4. #5599
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Think about the argument.. It has been established Cecilia Reyes is Afro Latina. But to prove that she isnt Afro Latina something already established. The character must prove they are black by saying "Hi I am black" "Hey look at me I am black" or do something positively confirm their blackness. As if Cyclops ever went "Hey I am American white not Latino white, Jewish white or middle eastern white" to confirm his whiteness.
    That logic still won't be enough for the X-Men racial brigade ie Sunspot... Smdh
    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    The person use one picture were she is a hint lighter than normally presented and that overwrites every single other time she has been presented with darker skin(Cece first time shown her skin was darker, the joe mad picture with the better colorist) . Oh yeah in the one picture she is lighter she is still clearly Afro Latina
    Right? Again I ask what evidence is out there for Cyclops being white? Or Rogue being a woman? Or the Hulk Green? But answering those questions will reveal there's a stricter set of creditentials for a black char Tobe black...smdh

    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Even worse "the tool" being misused in this thread "to measure skin tones" suffers from the same issue as comics and not all them have the same color charting and the system is designed to tell HOW WELL skin deals with sunlight not accurate represent skin color.
    Ugh Again Too Right!
    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    The only reason we are having this discussion because clearly Marvel doesn't have a clear standardize color set and apparently colorist can't go Storm is always 15, Monet is 11 and Cecilia is always 10. It is not important enough to Marvel that their characters are consistent colored the same and I understand why it happens but is annoying when people use it for a base for dumb arguments.
    I mean that's not the ONLY reason...
    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Am I the only one who feels that the whitewashing tangent has kinda said said everything there is to say?
    Quote Originally Posted by OblivionX33 View Post
    Nope you are right
    Welcome to the X-Forums..? hope you survive the cylindrical arguments experience
    GrindrStone(D)

  5. #5600
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    New Mutants has had 74% percent drop from last week( average drop for an MCU movie is about 58%) Dark Phoenix drop was about 71 %.

    New Mutants made 800k Friday sits at about 9 million domestic, 12 million overall/Worldwide.

  6. #5601
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    New Mutants has had 74% percent drop from last week( average drop for an MCU movie is about 58%) Dark Phoenix drop was about 71 %.

    New Mutants made 800k Friday sits at about 9 million domestic, 12 million overall/Worldwide.
    A sucky movie sucks. 'Enuff said.

  7. #5602
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post
    Lol damn the need for this to be a big conspiracy against the movie is better than the actual boring movie
    Could sort of see it if the movie was actually based on the New Mutants. But it's not.....

  8. #5603
    Incredible Member ClanAskani's Avatar
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    It's difficult to compare numbers right now since screens at drive-ins are so much different than indoor theaters. WB isn't releasing Tenet numbers until Sunday, but what I've seen from pre-sales are... meh. Maybe walk-up sales are better, but it could be disappointing restart to theaters opening.

    The bigger issue for New Mutants is likely is those most likely go to indoor theaters are men ages 18-34 who are the audience who will be most likely to dislike a PG-13 horror movie light on horror and heavy on teen drama. Unhinged is going to keep hanging around in theaters because it's directly aimed at that audience.

    New Mutants is most likely to appeal to preteens and teens who still need their parents to drive them to the theater and aren't going to wants to risk their kids getting COVID-19 to see a movie.

    Drive-ins do appeal to this market, but when ticketing is by person and not car, it's expensive and families are opting for budget double features of kids movies.

    There's going to be some release date changes announced next week and studios are adjusting September (and maybe October) releases to put out sacrificial lambs to help theaters.
    Last edited by ClanAskani; 09-05-2020 at 11:59 AM.

  9. #5604
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClanAskani View Post
    It's difficult to compare numbers right now since screens at drive-ins are so much different than indoor theaters. WB isn't releasing Tenet numbers until Sunday, but what I've seen from pre-sales are... meh. Maybe walk-up sales are better, but it could be disappointing restart to theaters opening.

    The bigger issue for New Mutants is likely is those most likely go to indoor theaters are men ages 18-34 who are the audience who will be most likely to dislike a PG-13 horror movie light on horror and heavy on teen drama. Unhinged is going to keep hanging around in theaters because it's directly aimed at that audience.

    New Mutants is most likely to appeal to preteens and teens who still need their parents to drive them to the theater and aren't going to wants to risk their kids getting COVID-19 to see a movie.

    Drive-ins do appeal to this market, but when ticketing is by person and not car, it's expensive and families are opting for budget double features of kids movies.

    There's going to be some release date changes announced next week and studios are adjusting September (and maybe October) releases to put out sacrificial lambs to help theaters.
    International Box Office

    Tenet 100 million
    New Mutants 2 million

    We all understand the uniqueness of what is happening but ain't that difficult to understand. Drive-ins numbers ain't going to magically save things.

  10. #5605
    Incredible Member ClanAskani's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    International Box Office

    Tenet 100 million
    New Mutants 2 million

    We all understand the uniqueness of what is happening but ain't that difficult to understand. Drive-ins numbers ain't going to magically save things.
    New Mutants hasn't opened as widely overseas, nor was it ever going to do as well. The planned reshoots were to address the issues of how to sell the movie internationally since PG-13 horror movies and teen romances historically never do well overseas. There was major concern at Fox about how even Logan could do overseas since it wasn't the typical blockbuster which does well with non-English speaking audiences with non-stop explosions.

    If you compare New Mutants to something like Fault in Our Stars, the bulk of the international box office came from Europe and South America, not Asia. And New Mutants hasn't opened in much of South America. It's only opening in the UK this weekend after limited previews last weekend.

    The situation in the US especially in areas with limited theater openings is making people go to movies they'd never normally see and those who typically would regularly go to the theater stay home. Heck, I'm getting roped into seeing Broken Hearts Gallery next weekend at the Sony Lot. I'd never in a million years have seen that in theaters nor would it actually have been released if in theaters had it not been for the pandemic. I'm not sure anyone actually wants to see it. I'm just going because I'm going to see how practical it is to eat ramen in a car while watching a bad rom-com.

    Sorting by highest gross per theater for the new releases, it's still drive-ins which are bringing in the most ticket sales. Tenet isn't playing at LA area drive-ins, but they've added showings of Black Panther following Chadwick's death so that could impact things. Last weekend's drive-in shows of that Metallica concerts reduced showing and drive-ins are doing odd things like that constantly.

    The comps have to be thrown entirely out the door. But overseas, I do think we'll see movies aimed at the 18-34 year old guys still being the most successful. And that isn't New Mutants. That's the reason for the reshoots - to make it appeal to that demographic and not 13 year old girls.

    And part of the reason I adore this movie so much is how much I would have absolutely loved this movie when I was 12 and became obsessed with X-books.

  11. #5606
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    I got some questions for you:

    1- Did the New Mutants mention the X-Men? How? Which way? I've heard so.

    2- Is the Xavier's School ever mentioned? Which name is used for the school?

    3- I've heard that there's some footage culled from "Logan"? A mutant facility? Tell me.

    Thank you so much, really.

  12. #5607
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClanAskani View Post
    New Mutants hasn't opened as widely overseas, nor was it ever going to do as well.
    I mean you could have stop here . Anyways there is no need to try to put optimistic spin on things New Mutants isn't doing good.

    The biggest tragedy of new mutants is that it had to come out in movie theaters when everyone knew it would have preformed better on demand in this environment. Good or Bad it would have been asset on Vods we have seen enough mediocre movies preform well on Netflix.

  13. #5608
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    I mean you could have stop here . Anyways there is no need to try to put optimistic spin on things New Mutants isn't doing good.

    The biggest tragedy of new mutants is that it had to come out in movie theaters when everyone knew it would have preformed better on demand in this environment. Good or Bad it would have been asset on Vods we have seen enough mediocre movies preform well on Netflix.
    Regardless if there was a pandemic or not, New Mutants wouldn’t have done well anyway. Sure, in a COVID-19-less timeline it’d be making more than its making now but it still likely face the fate of Dark Phoenix and be pretty much a financial failure, and its a shame Disney wasn’t legally allowed to put it on streaming like they should’ve. As you said, the movie likely would’ve been better off as a VOD option or a streaming original movie on Disney Plus than in theaters.

    As this point, Disney doesn’t care how New Mutant does. I bet they view this movie as bandaid they have to rip off just to get it over with, already. The movie can’t be delayed forever, and I guess releasing the movie in theaters could be used as a way to test the waters a bit — even if they don’t have big expectations for this movie.
    Last edited by Amadeus Arkham; 09-05-2020 at 08:29 PM.
    "I love mankind...it's people I can't stand!!"

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  14. #5609
    Incredible Member ClanAskani's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    I mean you could have stop here . Anyways there is no need to try to put optimistic spin on things New Mutants isn't doing good.

    The biggest tragedy of new mutants is that it had to come out in movie theaters when everyone knew it would have preformed better on demand in this environment. Good or Bad it would have been asset on Vods we have seen enough mediocre movies preform well on Netflix.
    It's not set to even open in some markets where it wouldn't have done well though - like Malaysia. The lack of a release in some areas are due to the fact a teen romance between two lesbian character isn't appealing or simply 18-34 males who drive ticket sales worldwide don't care about a PG-13 teen flick.

    New Mutants going to theaters at this point is the same as Unhinged or Broken Hearts Gallery - it's not about profits but trying to save theatrical distribution. This is saving jobs for everyone working in distribution and marketing at studios, doing trailers & tv spots, and so many others whose jobs are directly impacted by movie theaters being shut down.

    And it did have supporters at Fox who wanted it released, and that does come from some of the issues with Love, Simon and the fact that it's the first gay romance lead superhero movie than anything to do with it being an X-Men film or contracts. And certain territories saying they weren't happy simply due to the lack of a traditional male lead and an attractive female love interest and lots of action and explosions for the trailers and tv spots.
    Last edited by ClanAskani; 09-05-2020 at 08:27 PM.

  15. #5610
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    This is gonna sound rather weird, but New Mutants releasing in a time where the expectations have lowered for a movie making bank is oddly a blessing in disguise. If it were released in an alternate timeline where there wasn’t a pandemic, this would’ve crashed and burned financially and then be promptly forgotten about(like Dark Phoenix) but by it being one of the first new movies to open in the states since pandemic broke out. The movie had a fairly decent opening weekend in a time where there is reduced attendance capacity in theaters. A movie like NM opening to over a million in this day and age where it’s a risk just sitting in a room full of strangers is quite impressive. The standards for a movie making bank have lowered enough that even the paltry 7 million dollar New Mutants opening weekend can seem pretty impressive, whereas if the movie was released under normal circumstances it would’ve been considered a flat-out bomb, lol.
    Last edited by Amadeus Arkham; 09-06-2020 at 09:01 AM.
    "I love mankind...it's people I can't stand!!"

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