Hickman Talks "Secret Wars" #2, Shines Light on Battleworld's Secrets

[The Fury]

Agreed, but I say this as someone who loathed House of M. I hope things drastically improve from what we're getting. Hickman is a better writer than Bendis, so I do expect it.

Haha, really? nice one. Hickman is useless compared. House of M build up and execution was 18 times better than this.

[cranger]

While the art was lovely, this just felt like standard alt universe fare to me. Even Age of Ultron had an interesting first issue. :/

I put down issue #2 feeling very intrigued in this setting. However, that issue probably had more than two regular issues worth of pages. I really do not know if I would have enjoyed that as two separate $3.99 comics and now that the issues are settling back to $3.99 I really hope whichever direction this is going becomes much more focused and faster paced, and I trust Hickman after this interview that this was not all just done as the latest AoA/HoM/AoX/AoU/etc story.

[graffiX]

I don't exactly blame you. Issue #2 has much more of a "House of M" vibe to it than "Secret Wars." That's a bit disappointing. Not that I didn't like that former event, but I really feel that "House of Doom" won't leave us with many lasting changes. That FCB sneak peek of the post-SW universe and its Avengers story only strengthened my suspicion. "Secret Wars" may end up being a lot of fun, but I'm not sensing that it'll be anything more than a throwaway event so far.

The Marvel machine is too big for the writers to make any lasting changes. They've more or less said as much in the past, in reference to justifying the Ultimate universe's existence. Marvel will rough up their toys, but eventually just return them as they found them for the next person to play with. It's the same reason why we've come to think that death in comics is a joke or that identity changes will never last. Tony will never not be Iron Man in any permanent way. Steve will always somehow regain the shield. Jean Grey will always find a way to cheat death. Peter will always be the down on his luck slacker with woman issues.

Change is an illusion in comics. At least in mainstream ones. At the end of the day, come December or so, the Marvel Universe will mostly be as it was before this event. More than that, Marvel Comics will not have changed either, using this event as an excuse to renumber and release more #1 issues of familiar titles.

I know that sounds jaded, but does anybody think that anything we've seen so far will end up sticking? I'll enjoy the ride while it lasts, but know that it's only temporary.

Apart from the core series.... Anybody else not have a great feeling about the rest of the event? Based on what little we've seen of the MANY tie in issues, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of focus to the whole thing. "Secret Wars" #2 hasn't done a great job of letting us know why we should pick up the tie-ins. We're assured that every one of them will have a piece of a puzzle that makes up Marvel's new post-SW universe, but I have a hard time buying that. Thor cops. Zombies. A post-apocalyptic mutant world. A duck world. One based on the 90s X-Men cartoon.

If all of these tie-in comics have a piece of the puzzle then post-SW Marvel will look like some patchwork ratatouille thing. IF lasting change is coming, and I doubt that it is, the supposed importance of these tie-ins has me really worried. None of it makes sense together.

Yeah, I'm starting to think the same thing.

Even though I do NOT want a reboot, I would like to see some permanent changes. But the more I think about it I don't see much happening.

In the meantime I'm just going to enjoy the ride and dream of 'what may change'...until future solicits crush those dreams with the reality of nothing really changing.

[yet another]

Even though I do NOT want a reboot, I would like to see some permanent changes. But the more I think about it I don't see much happening.

I wonder if even Miles Morales will move to 616 permanently, he's apparently there in the FCBD issue, but he might just be visiting. Spider-Gwen will continue after SW, so obviously there will be some kind of multiverse, and in that case why not keep the Ultimate Universe as well?

[hawkeyefan]

Haha, really? nice one. Hickman is useless compared. House of M build up and execution was 18 times better than this.

Wow, not sure about that. While I actually kind of liked House of M for the most part, I don't know if the "build up" was all that impressive. All it amounted to was:

- Scarlet Witch goes nuts for unclear reasons
- Scarlet Witch leaves the Avengers in shambles
- The Avengers turn her over to Magneto for some unknown reason
- She rewrites reality into House of M

Not really sure how that is better than the saga Hickman's told over his Avengers/New Avengers run.

Yeah, I'm starting to think the same thing.

Even though I do NOT want a reboot, I would like to see some permanent changes. But the more I think about it I don't see much happening.

In the meantime I'm just going to enjoy the ride and dream of 'what may change'...until future solicits crush those dreams with the reality of nothing really changing.

Just enjoy the ride, like you say. Ultimately, they're all "throw away" stories. The stories that have permanent impact on these characters are few and far between.

And if you want to not be spoiled, just don't look at solicits.

[Yahnoos]

I'll admit, I did not see envision that Battle World would have Doom as ruler. So, it's basically House of M/Age of Apocalypse/Heroes Reborn but using existing characters rather than alternate versions/histories. I thought it would be a random hodge podge with no clear ruler, so this is a pleasant surprise. Looking forward to seeing how things go.

[MyriVerse]

Haha, really? nice one. Hickman is useless compared. House of M build up and execution was 18 times better than this.

There was no build up to House of M. Bendis dropped Wanda's plot cold for 8 months.

[frostywontons]

Haha, really? nice one. Hickman is useless compared. House of M build up and execution was 18 times better than this.

You and I read two different things apparently. As I recall, Wanda goes nuts in Decimation and Doctor Strange knocks her out with some unclear/inexplicable Agamotto magic and Magneto ferries her off to Genosha where she festers in her madness --- untouched by Bendis --- for some time. Claremont fiddled around with Wanda for a bit in Excalibur but it was a middling attempt. Fast-forward a few months and we have revelation that Wanda's madness is uncontrollable and everything's about to go apeshit!!!

[juggalord]

There was no build up to House of M.

To the storyline or within the storyline? If it's the former, then there definitely was. Avenger Disassembled led right into it. I suspect that you're referring to the later though. I wouldn't say that there wasn't any build up within HoM. I just think that it was, regardless of the reality-wide impact and bombast, a somewhat more personal story. It was really defined by smaller moments such as Wolverine's awakening, Pietro's deceit, Peter's marriage to Gwen, and so forth. If it seemed that Wanda's story got pushed to the back burner then I feel that it was wholly intentional. Wanda was, for better or worse, a pawn in this story. She was played and manipulated as badly as anybody else in that story. Worse. Her own brother took advantage of her mental illness. To me, the story ultimately turned out to be less about Wanda and much more about that one truly dysfunctional family. At least that's just my take.

wonder if even Miles Morales will move to 616 permanently

Well, that much is obvious. I think that biggest lasting changes will be Miles' integration into the 616 and the X-Men's (FOX motivated) exile from Earth. The 1610 has been on its knees begging for mercy since just after Ultimates 2 or 3. Ultimatum was the stray that broke camel's back and it just never recovered. Beyond the integration of Miles and middle finger to the X-Men, I don't see much changing. I could totally be wrong, but big change is really not Marvel. They belong to the House of Mouse now. Nothing changes there.

I really hope whichever direction this is going becomes much more focused and faster paced, and I trust Hickman after this interview that this was not all just done as the latest AoA/HoM/AoX/AoU/etc story.

I don't mind slow as long as it's also methodical. Hickman's Fantastic Four often moved at a snail's pace, but it was ultimately pretty brilliant. Definitely a high watermark for the series.

As far as this not being the latest AoA/HoM/AoX/AoU/etc story... It's worse, at least conceptually. It's meta. It's an event story built on other event stories. It's an alternate world built up of other alternate worlds. It's a Mighty Marvel Matryoshka. To me, while the execution is clearly different, it's amazing to me how both this event and DC's own Convergence both use the same sort of Battleworld idea and cannibalize their decades worth of stories for one event. And the fact that they both are out at the same time... This is part of what has me so enamored with and annoyed by Secret Wars (and Convergence.) It's like they're saying, "Come. Celebrate our history and watch our characters play. We're all out of new ideas so here's a clip show." I mean, not quite, but that these events share a common thread and take place at the same time, building off of old material like this, makes me wonder if there are any original ideas left at the big two.

Reading something like Secret Wars seems to bring to mind Kirkman's "Invincible" title.

- Holy crap! Mark's hero father, Omni-Man just turned heel and killed all of the heroes. WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?
- Vegas just got obliterated. WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?
- Robot took over the world and nobody cares. WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?
- Mark got violated. WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?

With Invincible, there are big, lasting changes that radically affect the book. No takesies backsiies. With Marvel, I don't have to ask, "WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?" I usually know that it'll end up being, "Same old. Same old." That is sort of depressing. The status quo is always changing at Marvel, but in a yo-yo sort of manner. "I hate you! Let's hug it out. I hate you! Let's hug it out. Spider-Man no more. I'm back! Spider-Man no more. I'm back!" As somebody who's been reading Marvel stuff for 30+ years, it's wearing on me. Marvel stuff is still as fun as it ever was, but it isn't as daring or unafraid of change as it was, maybe, 20 or 25 years ago.

Big picture: Secret Wars may be executed in a different manner than AoA/HoM/AoX/AoU/etc, but the end result won't be much different. Anything they change will eventually get changed back "Because YOU demanded it!"

[exiled]

The issue was amazing.

[The Fury]

Wow, not sure about that. While I actually kind of liked House of M for the most part, I don't know if the "build up" was all that impressive. All it amounted to was:

- Scarlet Witch goes nuts for unclear reasons
- Scarlet Witch leaves the Avengers in shambles
- The Avengers turn her over to Magneto for some unknown reason
- She rewrites reality into House of M

Not really sure how that is better than the saga Hickman's told over his Avengers/New Avengers run.

Because you don't need a confusing, world ending events involving everyone and their aunt to set the tone for a good story. These few things above (although point 3 is wrong) created the entire story.

Wanda's mind cracks because of the changing reality she was creating, ending the Avengers (for about a week), she was then given to Xavier for him to try and help her recover (at the time I don't think the Avengers knew Magneto was alive as he or Xorneto had just attacked new york and 'died'). Xavier was losing his battle so went to the Avengers and X-men to help, they agreed, went to Genosha but it was too late... things happened. No More Mutants.

Original Secret Wars, self contained in it's own series. Yet this Secret Wars, took 6 months in 2 books and many others before just to set the premise and even then it doesn't make sense.

There was no build up to House of M. Bendis dropped Wanda's plot cold for 8 months.

Exactly, if you read only Wolverine or Spider-man at the time, you didn't need to read 2 or 3 other series for a year before to understand it. You can read House of M in 1 TPB and understand what is going on, the plight and it's outcome.

[TakoM]

I don't exactly blame you. Issue #2 has much more of a "House of M" vibe to it than "Secret Wars." That's a bit disappointing. Not that I didn't like that former event, but I really feel that "House of Doom" won't leave us with many lasting changes. That FCB sneak peek of the post-SW universe and its Avengers story only strengthened my suspicion. "Secret Wars" may end up being a lot of fun, but I'm not sensing that it'll be anything more than a throwaway event so far.

The Marvel machine is too big for the writers to make any lasting changes. They've more or less said as much in the past, in reference to justifying the Ultimate universe's existence. Marvel will rough up their toys, but eventually just return them as they found them for the next person to play with. It's the same reason why we've come to think that death in comics is a joke or that identity changes will never last. Tony will never not be Iron Man in any permanent way. Steve will always somehow regain the shield. Jean Grey will always find a way to cheat death. Peter will always be the down on his luck slacker with woman issues.

Change is an illusion in comics. At least in mainstream ones. At the end of the day, come December or so, the Marvel Universe will mostly be as it was before this event. More than that, Marvel Comics will not have changed either, using this event as an excuse to renumber and release more #1 issues of familiar titles.

I know that sounds jaded, but does anybody think that anything we've seen so far will end up sticking? I'll enjoy the ride while it lasts, but know that it's only temporary.

Apart from the core series.... Anybody else not have a great feeling about the rest of the event? Based on what little we've seen of the MANY tie in issues, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of focus to the whole thing. "Secret Wars" #2 hasn't done a great job of letting us know why we should pick up the tie-ins. We're assured that every one of them will have a piece of a puzzle that makes up Marvel's new post-SW universe, but I have a hard time buying that. Thor cops. Zombies. A post-apocalyptic mutant world. A duck world. One based on the 90s X-Men cartoon.

If all of these tie-in comics have a piece of the puzzle then post-SW Marvel will look like some patchwork ratatouille thing. IF lasting change is coming, and I doubt that it is, the supposed importance of these tie-ins has me really worried. None of it makes sense together.

Seems similar to the discuss we had months ago.
True Marvel/ DC and co let their characters stuck in a endless loop like a hamster wheel but like you said not everything is like that some miner comics and most of the manga aren't that way. The reason why Marvel and co doing this this way is to make the characters well known and protect their value $$ it is similar like tv-shows "The simpsons" and Pokemon are made. I personally switched to mangas which are based on norvels which have relative complex stories about trying breaking free from the default concept of good and evil(demons vs humans)

The big problem I see is more what lies behind SW most of the classic heroes are hard to use again basically they archived to opposite of what they tried to do with the constantly resetting of the characters. I don't want to say which is a no no because I think every fan has it own bias about it and every character is a little different. For me there is a long list on the other hand without those strong characters like Cap(Steve Rogers), Reed Richards , Tony Stark, Narmor, Stephen Strange, Cyclops, Xavier, Jean Grey(the old) and so on Marvel would be a rainbow in grey colors. You can substitute one or another but without any of them it will be really hard to make comic which sale.

[TakoM]

Really enjoying Secret Wars thus far. Hickman has created a real spectacle within the first two issues. First, he destroyed the old world. Then, he established the one that rose from those ashes. While the second issue got a bit bogged down by Game of Thrones style bickering, it did nicely establish what Battleworld is like. It also established that there are survivors from the previous worlds who can take on Doom. Overall, the scope and scale of this story has been nicely established. However, Marvel has shown in the past that it has no problem starting off major events. It's finishing them where they've fallen short.

I think the similarity to games of thrones isn't random.

First Games of Thrones has become the head panco for all those mediums which follow the dark, darker, at darkest trend Which Hickman also follow with New Avengers and now SW.

Second those title follow another way than the classic in which the reader/watch identify himself with the main character, so they follow the series/season because they care what happened with them. Those like GoT follow more the dynamic of tension and primal instincts to hold the reader/watch like modern gladiator matches. You can care about the main character at first but for those stories it isn't necessary you stay with it. The interest in those stories snap when the tension is over which can either be the main character lose, or the last pure hearted side character die or became corrupted as well in this case nothing became worth rescuing.

I case of Hickmans story he took the whole world as a hostage , now the hostage is released(dead for the moment) the tension is over Hickman power to bind reader to this is more or less over, so he tries to reboot this tension with with bringing even more GoT into the story.

[Anubhavkumarc]

Why do I feel that Hickman is a Doom fanboy?

[vitruvian]

[COLOR="#000080"]Because you don't need a confusing, world ending events involving everyone and their aunt to set the tone for a good story. These few things above (although point 3 is wrong) created the entire story.

Wanda's mind cracks because of the changing reality she was creating, ending the Avengers (for about a week), she was then given to Xavier for him to try and help her recover (at the time I don't think the Avengers knew Magneto was alive as he or Xorneto had just attacked new york and 'died'). Xavier was losing his battle so went to the Avengers and X-men to help, they agreed, went to Genosha but it was too late... things happened. No More Mutants.

Perhaps it's been a while since you've actually bothered to read Avengers Disassembled? Or you never have and are going off of synopses?



The Avengers did indeed turn her over to Magneto at the end of Avengers Disassembled, and found out at that point that he was alive if they didn't know it previously.