Why no Hero's Reborn in Secret Wars?

[Uggha]

It has arguably been on of the biggest events in the Marvel U over the last 20 years. Any thoughts as to why it wasn't included?

[William300]

Two reasons
One: The characters in Heroes Reborn were the same as 616 (except for Thor), just transferred to another universe by Mr. Fantastic's son.

Two: No one liked Heroes Reborn, it was garbage.

[Panfoot]

I'm pretty sure I saw heroes reborn iron man on the cover to one of the battleworld books, can't remember which though.

[Ravin' Ray]

One: The characters in Heroes Reborn were the same as 616 (except for Thor), just transferred to another universe by Mr. Fantastic's son.

Except for the native heroes like She-Hulk, Doc Samson and Inhuman Royal Family except Crystal, and others.

Two: No one liked Heroes Reborn, it was garbage.

The Avengers title was perceived by many to have improved when Simonson took over mid-run.

[Tony Stark]

I'm pretty sure I saw heroes reborn iron man on the cover to one of the battleworld books, can't remember which though.

You are correct. He was on the cover of Secret Wars Battleworld #1.

[Kurolegacy]

Didn't Franklin "kill" them all at the end of the latest Fantastic 4 run?

[t hedge coke]

Except for the native heroes like She-Hulk, Doc Samson and Inhuman Royal Family except Crystal, and others.

She-Hulk went back with them... I wonder if that was ever "resolved."

The Avengers title was perceived by many to have improved when Simonson took over mid-run.

I loved the second half of Avengers, and flat out all of Iron Man and Fantastic Four. Those were great IM and FF runs, especially coming off the mess Iron Man had just been. Might be the first time Hydra ever felt legitimately scary to me. Like a serious terrorist outfit.

And, Avengers wasn't actually worse than it had been just before, for the most part.

[MyriVerse]

Two reasons
One: The characters in Heroes Reborn were the same as 616 (except for Thor), just transferred to another universe by Mr. Fantastic's son.

Two: No one liked Heroes Reborn, it was garbage.

Considering we're seeing a lot of 616 permutations, I'm betting it's more the latter.

[Jody Garland]

Two reasons
One: The characters in Heroes Reborn were the same as 616 (except for Thor), just transferred to another universe by Mr. Fantastic's son.

I don't know if it was always this way, but they were just in Robinson's FF and were portrayed as essentially golems that were 'possessed' by the essence of the 616 characters. They existed independently of the 616 guys afterwords. I expect them to show up somewhere in Secret Wars, if just for one issue.

[TakoM]

I think we should see it in relative different phases.

I will start with what happend when Heroes Reborn ended, besides the characters who went back Franklin gave up his control over his own creation to the Celestial Ashima and Eternity, Ashima stayed guard and Eternity took control thanks to Dr.Strange who had no idea what he is doing.

Dr.Doom stood behind and took over Franklins world like he would do in every other world. After a while the Dreaming Celestial took control over the world the same type Franklin had and Dr.Doom moved out of this reason Franklin's Earth to the position of a Counter-Earth.

Later Jolt moved to this world and stayed as a hero on that planet.

After M-day suddenly the counter-earth was in it old universe and no hero had ever left this world, this was when Franklin battled Onslaught on his own.(with his variant of the Avengers). He also fixed Wolverine memories back than.

I don't know if it was always this way, but they were just in Robinson's FF and were portrayed as essentially golems that were 'possessed' by the essence of the 616 characters. They existed independently of the 616 guys afterwords. I expect them to show up somewhere in Secret Wars, if just for one issue.

I must say when you read the end of Heros Reborn it doesn't make much sense what Robinson did that everyone on this planet should be puppets. Ashima originally wanted to take Franklin away and that Franklin erase his own doing but Franklin showed her that everyone on this planet has a soul , feelings and because of this everyone in this world is a significant existence and not a lab experiment which can easily wished away. By the way Robinson forgot Ashima altogether.

I must say I a little bit sad because Ashima was the only Celestial with which you could talk in a half-way normal manner. I think she also projected herself as human in Franklins world were she went to a cafeteria for coffe. The whole setup had a real great potential which no author ever picked up.

[Ravin' Ray]

The evil Heroes Reborn "heroes" in FF were new iterations that Franklin created, like the other iterations he created in Onslaught Reborn.

Also the HR She-Hulk and Inhumans were merged with their 616 counterparts, according to handbooks.

[Anubhavkumarc]

Ashema absorbed that universe in herself right? So they died along with her.

[TakoM]

Ashema absorbed that universe in herself right? So they died along with her.

Her outer body worked as a container for Franklins dimensions how that worked , why that was necessary was never explained but when the Dreaming Celestial took over she walked around again, at the end she was again tied to her old job as (guard)keeper of Franklin's dimension.

if she would have been there(is this correct?) , she had stopped Pyscho-man I think. In theory Franklin could also simply absorbed the whole world's essence similar like Thanos did to the universe in "The End" to recreate it later.

I think there is a big story hole what happened around the time of M-Day in the story, maybe it got smashed and that universe was something was Ashima did.

To be true I have no idea what happened to Ashima

By the way was Jolt part of Avenger Arena ? if not she is also missing then.

[Spazzy_D]

I really liked Hero's Reborn Fantastic Four, actually.

As a matter of fact, I have to say that it was a much better reimagining of the FF than the Ultimate version, although I did like what they eventually did with Reed in the Ultimate universe.

[t hedge coke]

Also the HR She-Hulk and Inhumans were merged with their 616 counterparts, according to handbooks.

Interesting. Good to know, too.

I really loved the short comic Kurt Busiek did covering some of the effects of the heroes returning (and other things), like Hawkeye's hearing being returned, Tony being effectively a merger of three different Tonys/lives.

It'd be "off brand" maybe, but I'd love to see more done with stuff like that, similar to what we're getting with Monica right now and her lost year of Nextwave.