If Parallax went to save the multiverse..did "Final Night" happened? If not..oh boy.....

[BohemiaDrinker]

Maybe, but I tend to believe the intent is that these things have the least disruptive effects. Which would mean, in an extreme way, that after the Crisis, "Earth 1" turned into the post-Crisis Earth (with JSA and everything) and the rest of the Earths were cut off, but not destroyed. This status continued until Infinite Crisis, at which point all of them were transformed into that 52 Earths. Yes, Mr. Mind was chomping around but the universe was guiding him. So to put it another way, post Crisis was like post Infinite Crisis - you had a JSA running around on the same Earth as the JLA, but then another Earth with just a JSA, with the two not really knowing about each other.

The result being that very little actually changed storyline-wise.

I mostly agree with you; but I believe post-Crisis Earth would be a New Earth altogether, not an update of Earth 1.

[GlennSimpson]

I mostly agree with you; but I believe post-Crisis Earth would be a New Earth altogether, not an update of Earth 1.

Well, the text suggested that after the initial multiverse, subsequent Earths evolve from previous ones, but I suppose nothing prevents the creation of new ones specifically from the event. That would leave the old Earth 1 to eventually evolve into the current Earth One.

[Sirzechs]

I believe Final Night still happened. During the Crisis there would have been two Hal Jordans, one the one that was supposed to be there, the other Parallax. Parallax would have done whatever he did to prevent the fall of the Multiverse during the Crisis, then presumably went away. The other Hal would go on to rejoin the Corps, then then later become Parallax himself. This one would go on to sacrifice himself to save the Earth in Final Night.

Yep its like Eobard Thawne dying in the past, he'll still be born in the future.

[Master X]

Interesting ideas but dammit I would have not had a problem with just the Flash and Supergirl going back along with her timeline Superman(I'm assuming he was back at their citybubble) but for Superman and the rest of his family as well as Parallax to tag along makes for one hell of a headache. Cause we are missing that storyline as to how they "helped/save/evolve" the multiverse.

I forgot to mention, the bright spot outta all of this was the "evolution" of waverider but....there's also that "Female" waverider out there somewhere.

It was a "hell yeah" moment...until you turned the page and realised they weren't even going to show it. Would have been an epic moment.

[philosopop]

Hourman 1 million had a series after DC one million, in which it was established that there are chunks of time that can't really be changed (solid time?) .... maybe the events themselves play differently once Hal and the others get to the Crisis, but the end results are the same: supes and lois get married, joker gets defeated, etc...but with different players (like when Mechanique held the Crisis time wave in all star squadron for a while) ...

[DeathFalcon182]

I swear Convergence is being made a bigger deal than it actually is too much around here. Event was a mess and nothing but a filler. There are way too many plot holes and continuity error in this hot mess. But i guess forums need something to talk about.

[vaf2675]

Simple answer, it could have been a different Parallax from another universe who went to save the multiverse, and we still had the Parallax who died in Final Night.

How do you like them apples?

[GlennSimpson]

Interesting ideas but dammit I would have not had a problem with just the Flash and Supergirl going back along with her timeline Superman(I'm assuming he was back at their citybubble) but for Superman and the rest of his family as well as Parallax to tag along makes for one hell of a headache. Cause we are missing that storyline as to how they "helped/save/evolve" the multiverse.

I forgot to mention, the bright spot outta all of this was the "evolution" of waverider but....there's also that "Female" waverider out there somewhere.

I don't know if they ever really intended to show that, but I imagine having to devote those pages to the Earth 0 heroes standing around not doing anything (which they probably had to stick in there at the last minute to make fanboys feel like this "mattered") took away the opportunity.

[j9ac9k]

I look at it this way: anything that happened in a comic book, that we've read, has happened and those worlds will always exist. Whether or not any comic book story exists in the same continuity as any other story only happens when we're shown that they're connected. Otherwise, each and *every* comic book should be considered its own universe. (because there are an infinite number of parallel universes - some being only minutely different from each other, some very different)

[Etreiw]

I came on board with Green Lantern when Hal went evil and Kyle was chosen to be the only Lantern at that time. So I have all the "issues" related to Hal redeeming himself and once again becoming the hero that he is now...aka renegade Lantern now of course....but just to see that Parallax is out and about is so frustrating after all the "fear entity" can never age.....

[AlexanderLuthor]

It all happened. All of those timelines and worlds...they all happened. Morrison made it clear and Convergence confirmed that is DC editorial policy. If you read it then it happened in some timeline or on some world that exists in the Multiverse

[Patrick_C]

I don't know if they ever really intended to show that, but I imagine having to devote those pages to the Earth 0 heroes standing around not doing anything (which they probably had to stick in there at the last minute to make fanboys feel like this "mattered") took away the opportunity.

Oh, come on...

[Dataweaver]

Well, the text suggested that after the initial multiverse, subsequent Earths evolve from previous ones, but I suppose nothing prevents the creation of new ones specifically from the event. That would leave the old Earth 1 to eventually evolve into the current Earth One.

I've detailed an “it all happened” interpretation in another thread that seeks to explain everything in the context of, well, all of it happening. But let's try a different approach here, where the result of the Saviors of the Multiverse interfering with the First Crisis still resulted in lost continuity and a much more constrained Multiverse.

In this model, there were only two Crises: the original Crisis on Infinite Earths, and Flashpoint. There was no Zero Hour, Infinite Crisis, or Final Crisis. When Hal, Clark, Lois, Jonathan, Kara, and Barry intervened in the original Crisis, they changed its ending so that it gave birth to the Orrery of Worlds. The Earth-0 that was created was similar to the post-IC/pre-Flashpoint continuity; the Earth-16 that was created was similar to the DCU of the 90s; the Earth-2 that was created was similar to the pre-Crisis Earth-2; and the Earth-1 resembles the world we saw after CoIE#10 and before John Byrnes' Man of Steel started retconning everything.

None of them were exactly the same as they were before the Crisis, as each has a streamlined history that irons out the messy continuity glitches that plagued the versions that were originally published while possibly introducing (and resolving) a few new ones: for instance, it's possible that the post-Crisis/pre-Flashpoint Earth-2 incorporates Robinson's Starman and JSA and closely related characters; this would introduce a few glitches (such as the times that Jack Knight or the JSA interacted with Justice League characters), but those could be resolved without much trouble either by substituting more appropriate Golden Age characters (e.g., have Jack's adventure with Batman actually be with the Robin we recently saw in Convergence: Detective Comics) or by saying that the tradition of inter-Earth travel was still a thing in this “interim Multiverse” (such as when the JSA and the JLA teamed up). As well, their continuities aren't limited to the boundaries described: The interim Multiverse's Earth-0 has a history that stretches back before 2005, although that history only approximates the earlier comics that lead up to that point: if you want stories that more closely resemble the original tales of the 90s, go to the interim Multiverse's Earth-16.

Eventually, Flashpoint happens; and the Orrery is reformatted into its current form. Not that it matters; because in this arrangement, the “interim Multiverse” is every bit as gone as the pre-Crisis Multiverse; all that's left is the post-Flashpoint Orrery.

[Avengers1986]

Actually I was wondering if Barry didn't die during COIE due to Parallax being there does Barry being around later help Hal get through the Coast City destruction that happens in the 90s and prevent him from going crazy? I would think Barry if anyone would have prevented/talked to Hal from becoming Parallax when it happened due to their deep friendship. No Parallax, no Zero hour, which means no Final Night savior.

[GlennSimpson]

Actually I was wondering if Barry didn't die during COIE due to Parallax being there does Barry being around later help Hal get through the Coast City destruction that happens in the 90s and prevent him from going crazy? I would think Barry if anyone would have prevented/talked to Hal from becoming Parallax when it happened due to their deep friendship. No Parallax, no Zero hour, which means no Final Night savior.

I'm under the impression that Barry still died, Parallax didn't change that. He just fixed it so that the multiverse didn't narrow down to a single Earth. It's possible he did it all behind the scenes without actually changing what we see in the actual COIE series.