What If Wonder Woman was Gotham's premier Hero?

[Amazon Swordsman]

Writer ignored such details because there aren't many people who cared about that stuff and its not like Wonder Woman had her metroplis or gotham. I have never seen anyone ask Azzarello about such trivial things.

They probably never asked because most readers didn't care about WW at all until he was on board. Actually, if you ask most people what they liked about Azz's run on WW, most people would say they liked how detached it was from the rest of the DC universe stories, the artwork, the new designs of the Olympians, etc...Rarely will people mention something about WW first, which shows how she was an afterthought in her own book.

That aside, are you new to WW? If not, you shouldn't be surprised with the ridiculous criticisms leveled against her. She's been criticized for being made of clay, being a feminist, not having a secret identity, not having a home base city (not themyscira), wearing a "bathing suit", showing too much skin, not having an iconic rogues gallery, etc. The list goes on.

If I may ask, why are you a fan of WW?

[SiegePerilous02]

I think the fact that writers sometimes portray these villains as committing crimes to get Bruce's attention contributes to that misconception.

Very true. But again, that's pretty much on them. He doesn't force them to do anything.

[Majesty]

Then it would be very awesome to see how Batman's Rogues gallery is written to deal with her.

If she was the hero then they'd likely be equipped with gadgets and such that could halt her which would make things interesting.

Scarecrow having a fear toxin that effects her and gives us a glimpse into her fears, Poison Ivy having different poisons and such that effect her, her going toe to toe mentally with Riddler whom would try to trick her to being a victim of her own demise by using her self confidence against her.

If written correctly it could be executed extremely well.

Venom would probably be exceedingly buffed to put Bane physically a hard fight for Wonder Woman as well.

Anyway if you put the proper writing behind it, it can be done very well.

Of course when Diana caught up with them they'd quickly be dispatched and sent to Arkham.

Then again that's no different than what happens when batman gets to them. It's what they put him through in order for him TO GET to them that the story had its strength.

If you write it right it can be done.

[LordUltimus]

Then it would be very awesome to see how Batman's Rogues gallery is written to deal with her.

If she was the hero then they'd likely be equipped with gadgets and such that could halt her which would make things interesting.

Scarecrow having a fear toxin that effects her and gives us a glimpse into her fears, Poison Ivy having different poisons and such that effect her, her going toe to toe mentally with Riddler whom would try to trick her to being a victim of her own demise by using her self confidence against her.

If written correctly it could be executed extremely well.

Venom would probably be exceedingly buffed to put Bane physically a hard fight for Wonder Woman as well.

Anyway if you put the proper writing behind it, it can be done very well.

Of course when Diana caught up with them they'd quickly be dispatched and sent to Arkham.

Then again that's no different than what happens when batman gets to them. It's what they put him through in order for him TO GET to them that the story had its strength.

If you write it right it can be done.

Leveling up the Gotham Rogues could be easily explained with: Circe wants to screw with Diana, so she hires the nutjobs, paying them with magical enhancements. Oh, and of course she'll find a way to make the curse that makes Gotham as bad as it is even worse.

And neck snapping aside, pre Flashpoint Wonder Woman would try to reform most of Gotham's villains. Like the Ventriloquist (in which case she'll only snap the neck of the doll), try to convince Harley that her relationship is toxic, setting up a meeting between Poison Ivy and Gaia, proof to Killer Cros that he can find love and acceptance looking like he does...

[LordUltimus]

As for the Bat-Family... Well, assuming Diania is not adverse to adopting, instead of Robin the Boy-Wonder, we would have Robin the Wonder Boy.

Jason still gets killed by the Joker, which is the final straw that causes Diana to finally kill him. This act also drives a wedge between her and Dick, who goes solo and becomes Nightwing.

Barbara Gordon becomes the first Wonder Girl. After being crippled by Circe, her new identity as Oracle is even more fitting. Cass and Stephanie also become Wonder Girls.

When Ra's, who instead of wanting Batman to impregnate his daugther in this case wants to impregnate Wonder Woman himself (or alternatively at least wants her to hook up with Nyssa), brings back Jason, but instead of Red Hood, he takes on the identity of Nemesis. Ironically, his relationship with Diana is now much better than her's and Dick's, because she killed the Joker.

Of course, big question is, how exactly would Diana live in Gotham? As an ambassador in an embassy? Simply as Diana while making no secret of her beign Wonder Woman? With a secret identity? That woudl sorta influence the fine details of how the Wonder family would live.

Hm. Let's say in this world Gotham has a museum with a permanent exhibition on ancient Greece. Diana's secret identity is somethign relating to that, and it would also get her in contact with Cassie.

Oh, and the mortal members of the Wonder family can use greek artifacts like the sandals of Hermes or the gauntlets of Atlas in order to stand up to the things that can fight Wonder Woman on even ground.

Also, Donna could replace Damien, only her creation involves a lot more convoluted Lazarus, golem and greek gods shenenigans.

[LordUltimus]

Then it would be very awesome to see how Batman's Rogues gallery is written to deal with her.

If she was the hero then they'd likely be equipped with gadgets and such that could halt her which would make things interesting.

Scarecrow having a fear toxin that effects her and gives us a glimpse into her fears, Poison Ivy having different poisons and such that effect her, her going toe to toe mentally with Riddler whom would try to trick her to being a victim of her own demise by using her self confidence against her.

If written correctly it could be executed extremely well.

Venom would probably be exceedingly buffed to put Bane physically a hard fight for Wonder Woman as well.

Anyway if you put the proper writing behind it, it can be done very well.

Of course when Diana caught up with them they'd quickly be dispatched and sent to Arkham.

Then again that's no different than what happens when batman gets to them. It's what they put him through in order for him TO GET to them that the story had its strength.

If you write it right it can be done.

With regards to Poison Ivy especially, it seems as though she's just as well suited to being a Wonder Woman villain as a Batman villain- IMHO, even more so. A lesbian ultra-feminist radical powerful enough to rival Swamp Thing as the DC-verse's supreme plant elemental, Poison Ivy harbors an extreme hatred of all men in general, and seeks to destroy man's world- especially Gotham- in order to create an Eden-like paradise for herself and her plants out of the ashes. Hell, she's effectively Gotham's home-grown equivalent of Circe, with power levels to match. Makes you really wonder why Poison Ivy and Circe haven't yet teamed up in any DC continuity thus far, doesn't it? Certainly, if WW were Gotham's primary hero, in a universe in which Batman doesn't exist, you'd think that this team-up would be more likely than not to happen.

Also, other thoughts- Catwoman would probably be a vigilante anti-heroine from the off ITTL; perhaps with Selina Kyle instead of Barbara Ann Minerva gaining the power of the Cheetah at a later stage, and becoming an even more tragic heroine on account of it. The Mad Hatter would probably go the same way as Doctor Psycho, with a stronger focus on his tendency towards paedophilia and his fixation upon little girls.

With WW residing in his city, Maximilian Zeus would almost certainly get a knock on his door from Ares with on offer he can't refuse far sooner, and become Ares' chosen vassal in Gotham.

Good ideas?

[Majesty]

Extremely good ones by all of you. Which show how well it can be done if the writing is done correctly!

[LordUltimus]

Extremely good ones by all of you. Which show how well it can be done if the writing is done correctly!

Thank you!

Additionally, if memory serves correctly, Clayface once went to fight Wonder Woman because he figured, since she was created from clay, he can use that to steal her powers. Don't remember how exactly that comic ended, but Clayface's original plan actually worked.

Furthermore, remember Baby Doll from Batman The Animated series? In her case, a fusion with Silver Swan might work.

[wagthedog]

Thank you!

Additionally, if memory serves correctly, Clayface once went to fight Wonder Woman because he figured, since she was created from clay, he can use that to steal her powers. Don't remember how exactly that comic ended, but Clayface's original plan actually worked.

Furthermore, remember Baby Doll from Batman The Animated series? In her case, a fusion with Silver Swan might work.

According to many here, who try to explain the Perez continuity and how Azz is merely continuing his run, this could have never happened since she was never clay in the first place.

[LordUltimus]

According to many here, who try to explain the Perez continuity and how Azz is merely continuing his run, this could have never happened since she was never clay in the first place.

Well, I'm not one of them.

And for the sake of not derailing the thread, that's all I'm willing to say on that matter.

[LordUltimus]

If Selina becomes the Cheetah, and not Barbara Ann Minerva, maybe Minerva becomes a Anti-Hero of sorts? Or maybe a hero, but just to get famous and such.

For Jason, his relationship with WW could be better, or maybe just as bad, for maybe in Jason mind, she took his revenge on the Joker, and she still fail to save him. Maybe his new outfit could be a Roman centurion, or something like that.

They also Zatanna. The two could do team ups even now and then. (Still thinking on her.)

[LordUltimus]

My question is, would WW's image be tailored somewhat to match the asthetic of Gotham?

This has always been a factor of the DC universe. Superman and Metropolis are inseperable, both being glossy, optimistic visions of the future, with a few inner demons (personified in Lex Luthor).

Gotham is the grimy darkness, the corrupt cess-pit against which the Dark Knight must stand.

Against that, the only city I can link Diana with is Washington DC, which is fitting with its classical architecture, politics and diplomancy. She is after all, an ambassador and heir to Hippolyta's throne.

So yeah, would the time in Gotham darken Diana's aesthetic? Would her image adjust to fit in with the gargoyles and gothic arches? Likewise, some of her expanded Wonder-family might need the capes and so-on for the practical reasons shown in-universe. Diana herself might be tempted to resort to operating under a disguise when she gains a mortal family, something that would distinguish her from Superman. Wonder Woman is invulnerable - her family is not, and thus it would become important to maintain a secret identity.

As for where she lives, I suspect an argument could be made for Wayne Manor. Imagine this as a backstory:

On that fateful night in Crime Alley, the entire Wayne family is murdered by Joe Chill, Bruce included. Wayne Enterprises either collapses, goes into recievership or ends up running under corrupt management. Without Bruce's influence, I could see Gotham go so far down the proverbial toilet that by the time Diana is on the scene, the city is a special administrative zone that the US government is desperately trying to pull out of the depths it has fallen to.

A side effect of this is that the vacant Wayne Manor is suitable for purchase, perhaps by Ms Diana Prince, a dynamic and enigmatic young philanthropist who seeks to invest in Gotham's salvation.

Meanwhile, as Wonder Woman, she not only fights crime, but would also act as ambassador and a play a direct role in the politics of trying to rescue Gotham.

It's kinda a mix of canon-Bruce, canon-Diana, and Power Girl's alias as Karen Starr. A mixture of superherorics, diplomatic politics, philanthropy and business investment, all in an attempt to turn Gotham around.

I would also find it interesting to imagine Diana living in Wayne Manor, unearthing the history of the family who once lived there, perhaps coming to gain a more nuanced view of Man's World through the example of human decency embodied in Thomas and Martha Wayne. You could even include (as the struggle takes its tole on her mental state), the 'ghost' of young Bruce Wayne as the embodiment of the innocents of Gotham: the lives she has to save.

[protege]

well, She would definitely kill the Joker, which I for one would applaud; I'm not sure Diana could realistically match wits with the riddler, either. Harley Quinn could be gunning for revenge. Penguin or Doctor Psycho? Otherwise,I'd see a mix of Diana and bruce's enemies forming her rogues gallery, with poison ivy a bit higher up on the food chain. Not sure about mr. freeze, though. And i'm not sure what her relationship with Gordon and the GCPD would be either. Maybe she could get a Wonder signal. Strangely enough, I think Having Diana in Gotham would be a bit more beneficial, with her serving as a symbol of hope, whereas bruce just maintains the status quo.

[LordUltimus]

Guess what I found?

[LordUltimus]

So, idea for how Diana ended up in Gotham in the first place that got sorta out of control:

Instead of Steve Trevor, Colonel Jake Kane is the one who crashes on Themyscira. After the initial culture shock, Hyppolita as usual decrees that it is time for the Amazons to re-join man's world, Diana wins the competition and is named their ambassador.
She accompanies Jake, who later might become a sort of father figure to Diana, to his residence in Gotham. There she befriends Jake's daughter Kate Kane, becoming a figure of guidance in a time where Kate is lost due to being expelled from the military and her breakup with Rene Montaya.
The initial plan after Jake explaining the situation to his superiors was for Diana to move out of the Kane's home and to Washington where an embassy would be set up. However Diana has become attached to Gotham. While at first repulsed by the rampant crime, violence, trash and corruption, thanks to her friendship with Kate she also got to see the better part of town and bore witness to people holding on to their decency despite the poor situation.
So she purchases Wayne manor which has been empty since the family's death many years ago, turning parts of it into an embassy (while leaving most of it in its original state).

Now, the clue would be that Diana and the Kane's would be tight lipped about her superhuman abilities. So as Diana the ambassador of Themiscyra, the help of the Kane family, Gordon (whom she knows through Kate who knows Rene who knows him) as well as Alfred she tries to fix Gotham the commercial way (going with a version of Themiscyra that isn't stuck in the bronze age and quite advanced, which would allow her to build an Enterprise (with the help of Lucious Fox and perhaps some other Amazon) that can invest in Gotham, gaining her influence on the political map as well).
What only a few people know however is that Diana, ever the warrior, also takes a more hands on approach to fixing the city. She assumes a masked identity to protect her non-demigod friends. Her and Kate discover the cave beneath Wayne Manor, with the assistance of some birds (because WW can talk to those) and make that their base of operation. Diana gets the Bat-costume from the post above because the bats in the cave were a good inspiration. Kate Kane takes on the identity of Flamebird as her sidekick.
While the two of them try to keep that a secret, it doesn't take long for Alfred to become aware. Next one is Jake Kane. He is quite upset, and after a lengthy argument, a solution is reached. The list of people in the know is expanded to Gordon (though perhaps not all the details) and on Jake's insistence, Kate is send away on a training journey, because unlike Diana, she can't survive a bullet to the chest.

Time passes, the usual Gotham rogues pop up. Diana witnesses the murder of the Graysons and adopts Dick. He becomes Wonder-Boy. Diana has her first run-ins with Selina Kyle, the Cheetah.
Ares seeks to destroy Diana, she only manages to defeat him with the help of Zatanna. Unfortunately, all the magic involved in the fight gains the attention of Circe.
Alfred catches Jason trying to break into Wayne Manor. He gets adopted too. Barbara becomes Wonder Girl.
For a while, everything seems to work out fine, Gotham is actually becoming a better place with the help of Diana and her new family, and her attempts to reform the villains actually seem to work for some of them.

Until Amazonfall.
Suddenly gang wars shake the city. The rogues run rampant, even those who seemed to be reformed have gone back to their old ways. Worst of all, while before they were no match for Diana on a physical level, aside from Selina, they have all gained new powers that place them on near equal footing with them.
While her Superhero persona is under constant strain trying to contain the gang wars, in her civilian life her enterprise is under attack as the billionare Maximilian Zeus is pushing his businesses into Gotham, doing everything to ruin Diana, because the Amazons don't fit his understanding of the Greek pantheon and his place in it.
In the end, it turns out that the ones behind all of this are Circe and Ares, who have teamed up with the one goal to destroy Diana/see her suffer. Under constant attacks from all sides, Diana can't stop Circe from crippling Barbara. Worn out and consumed by grief and guilt, Diana hoped that would be the end of it, for Circe left, being satisfied with having caused Diana pain. But it is then that Bane, chosen champion of Ares, confronts her while she is at her lowest. In the ensuing battle, he almost kills Diana and leave her for dead.

In the aftermath of that catastrophe, Diana's friends are forced to send her broken body back to Themyscira, the only place where she can be healed. And even there, her recovery will take time. Lots of time.
During that time, Diana's family in a Gotham ruled by Bane is left to pick up the pieces. Barbara becomes Oracle. After appealing to the Greek gods, Dick and Jason, after having to pass some herculean tasks, are granted several artefacts that help them in their fight with the powered up villains. This time also sees the return of Kate Kane, who assumes the name Batwoman. Plus she has Cassandra in tow, whom she picked up on her journey. Furthermore, though Bane more or less runs the city, his reign over the criminal underworld is not a stable one. Because of that, Poison Ivy, Selina Kyle and Harley Quinn team up to form the Gotham City Sirens.
After many battles, the wonder family with some help from Zatanna and the sirens manage to defeat Bane. Shortly afterwards, Diana returns. It is a happy reunion, and things are starting to look brighter.
For a time, they are. Until the league of assassins starts taking an interest. At some point, the Joker kills Jason, is in turn killed by Diana. This act shakes the foundations of the Wonder family. Dick leaves, becoming Nightwing and doing his own thing in Bludhaven. Later, Tim Drake figures everything out, it turns out he is a son of Zeus and becomes the new Wonder Boy.

After an arc about the Mad Hatter almost causing a war between Gotham and the Amazons, Jason returns. And with him comes Donna Troy, born from the same Lazarus Pit that revived Jason, in one of Ra’s schemes to conquer Diana, here involving the love of her adopted son.

Well, that would be my ideas. Anyone got suggestions how to include Stephanie?