Selina Kyle: Catwoman Appreciation 2018

[Michael24]

New character poster for Gotham.

[Enigmatic Undead]

Anyone read todays issue? I decided this is my last issue until there is a new writer. I am really not enojoying it anymore and half of it doesn't make sense. How did Catwoman get that car to South Asia... where the hell did Rat Tail come from? Why did Gotham City Cops travel to South Asia to stop the race...??

Catwoman Wacky Races Edition

[heyevaxx]

Ann Nocenti is at least consistent with her corny stories, weird, non-stop dialog and (worst of all) terrible characterization of Selina.

I still think the all time worst Catwoman writer is still Bronwyn Carlton who did 14 of the last 18 of purple suit Catwoman issues from 2000-2001. Carlton was simply writing another character, I really can't imagine what the editors were thinking if anything at all. Either John Moore tried to save the title and failed or he was simply brought in to wrap it up for the last 3 post-Carlton issues. But this set the stage for black suit Catwoman by Brubaker, the best run ever for Selina IMO.

But Nocenti, wow, it's bad. How many times does she have characters say "dude?" Old, young, cops, villains, etc - everyone has the same voice! And Selina completely lacks class and has almost no gravitas.

I know New52 Selina is supposed to be young and reckless but Nocenti writes her as silly and irreverent. Plus Nocenti's world feels ... off. Not realistic. Things happen that seem odd, even surreal. E.g. working for the GCPD, "Wacky Races" cars, suddenly appearing is South Asia, etc.

I can only hope that as Nocenti drives Selina's title into the ground so far (can it go any lower?) that Catwoman will have a Brubaker-esque resurrection soon.

But alas no. I thought Nocenti would do Race of Thieves (so, so stupid ) as a farewell before a new creative team does a restart. After Race of Thieves, Catwoman #34 starts a new story about Selina buying a house. Sigh. Maybe she won't be working for the GCPD anymore (what the #*$% ?!?!?).

I have to imagine the Catwoman title is a dream or an alternate Earth while all of Selina's other appearances are her *real* life.

[edit for spelling]

[spark627]

Ann Nocenti is at least consistent with her corny stories, weird, non-stop dialog and (worst of all) terrible characterization of Selina.

I still think the all time worst Catwoman writer is still Bronwyn Carlton who did 14 of the last 18 of purple suit Catwoman issues from 2000-2001. Carlton was simply writing another charterer, I really can't imagine what the editors were thinking if anything at all. Either John Moore tried to save the title and failed or he was simply brought in to wrap it up for the last 3 post-Carlton issues. But this set the stage for black suit Catwoman by Brubaker, the best run ever for Selina IMO.

But Nocenti, wow, it's bad. How many times does she have characters say "dude?" Old, young, cops, villains, etc - everyone has the same voice! And Selina completely lacks class and has almost no gravitas.

I know New52 Selina is supposed to be young and reckless but Nocenti writes her as silly and irreverent. Plus Nocenti's world feels ... off. Not realistic. Things happen that seem odd, even surreal. E.g. working for the GCPD, "Wacky Races" cars, suddenly appearing is South Asia, etc.

I can only hope that as Nocenti drives Selina's title into the ground so far (can it go any lower?) that Catwoman will have a Brubaker-esque resurrection soon.

But alas no. I thought Nocenti would do Race of Thieves (so, so stupid ) as a farewell before a new creative team does a restart. After Race of Thieves, Catwoman #34 starts a new story about Selina buying a house. Sigh. Maybe she won't be working for the GCPD anymore (what the #*$% ?!?!?).

I have to imagine the Catwoman title is a dream or an alternate Earth while all of Selina's other appearances are her *real* life.

Agree 100%. Her stories are pointless and contain elements that make ZERO sense. Again, how does a GC police officer have jurisdiction in South Asia? How the heck did Rat Tail randomly show up there as if South Asia is a train ride away...???

[FHIZ]

But alas no. I thought Nocenti would do Race of Thieves (so, so stupid ) as a farewell before a new creative team does a restart. After Race of Thieves, Catwoman #34 starts a new story about Selina buying a house. Sigh. Maybe she won't be working for the GCPD anymore (what the #*$% ?!?!?)..

There's noting to say that's a new story arc, could just be a one and done issue to fill a gap. The Eternal status quo shift should be coming fairly soon.

[Smart]

100 per cent agree. Weird murder mystery (clearly setting up the next catwoman buys house story - which makes me hope it's a one and done) told alongside nonsensical wacky races. This on paper should've been an easy story to write, just another arc ruined by bad execution. How can no one in editorial not ask "where did rat tail come from"?

Don't even get me started on rat tail, he was introduced as a dealer who uses kids to push his "product" when he landed in the pit in the underground arc he should've stayed there.

[teddyeatsyourface]

Nocenti's stories read like a script from Joel Schumacher's Batman movies. Campy as hell but with a touch of dark humor. It should be fun and entertaining but it just falls flat.

[chipsnopotatoes]

New video on Gotham. We see Camren and David explaining what their relationship will be like. I get the feeling this won't be all that different from nu52 Cats obsessed with Bats. Ugh! I see Geoff Johns ugly hand in this. Want him far far away from Catwoman.

[heyevaxx]

@chipsnopotatoes

New video on Gotham. We see Camren and David explaining what their relationship will be like. I get the feeling this won't be all that different from nu52 Cats obsessed with Bats. Ugh! I see Geoff Johns ugly hand in this. Want him far far away from Catwoman.

Thanks for the video link!

Geoff Johns doesn't have Gotham on his IMDB credits - is he involved somehow?

Is the Geoff Johns concern about Camren saying "later on I do know that I will get close to him?"

Here's what Camren Bicondova and David Mazouz said:
Camren: So far we haven't met each other yet ...
David: [he interrupts] I mean you're watching me like I've cre...
Camren: [she cuts back in] I'm talk [she giggles] but, um, later on I do know that I will get close to him and James Gordon because I know some information that they don't.
[later]
David: This is a chapter that has never been told before, so it's gonna to be a challenge because we all know where Bruce Wayne starts. So going from that to being Batman it's going to be progressively becoming that.

I really like the chemistry between the two young actors. Both seem energetic and smart and into their roles. And young Bruce had better learn not to talk over young Selina!

[OBrianTallent]

I'm thinking they are just letting Nocenti bide her time until the end of Eternal with the new status for Selina. That's the only explanation I can come up with. Although it would be cool to have a writer who could write stories that detail Selina's change along the way showing her slow change in attitude.

[heyevaxx]

I was wondering about the business side of how Catwoman is doing. While most forum commenters and reviewers dislike Nocenti and are anxious for a new team, it's probably just a dollar analysis by DC executives.

So I wanted to look at the sales figures for the last 9 Catwoman issues and compare it to the 2000s and 1990s runs of the same issue numbers. It seems that many titles putter out over time and get rebooted to boost sales so comparing the same issue numbers would be fare.

It's interesting - there may be hope for a change soon!

The last 2 issues, #30 and #31, written by Nocenti have fallen a lot to 118 and 121 with both issues below 21,000 sold. Black suit Catwoman didn't drop below 21,000 sales until issues #64 and #65.

Also, the stronger Nocenti sales from #23 to #28 might have been related to the Joker's Daughter, a guest writer or Gothtopia tie ins.

Kind of neat to see how highly ranked Purple suit Catwoman was. Maybe the competition was weak or Michelle Pfeiffer's performance gave the comic a lasting boost.

Here's the raw data. Note, in the 90s they listed an "order index" and not "est. sales."

ranking - title - issue - cost - sales - notes

Purple suit 1990s:
040 Catwoman #24 $1.95 65.30
032 Catwoman #25 $2.95 72.89
035 Catwoman #26 $1.95 70.61
039 Catwoman #27 $1.95 67.92
027 Catwoman #28 $1.95 68.70
029 Catwoman #29 $1.95 67.90
033 Catwoman #30 $1.95 67.30
025 Catwoman #31 $1.95 75.90

Black suit 2000s:
093 Catwoman #23 $2.50 22,924
113 Catwoman #24 $2.50 23,165
082 Catwoman #25 $2.50 26,299
085 Catwoman #26 $2.50 24,595
076 Catwoman #27 $2.50 25,030
082 Catwoman #28 $2.50 23,948
094 Catwoman #29 $2.50 23,811
098 Catwoman #30 $2.50 24,287
092 Catwoman #31 $2.50 24,238

Nu52:
085 Catwoman #23 $2.99 32,158 2 months sales
072 Catwoman #24 $2.99 35,134 Joker's Daughter
075 Catwoman #25 $3.99 29,471 Layman, Not Nocenti
075 Catwoman #26 $2.99 26,482 Joker's Daughter
087 Catwoman #27 $2.99 24,956 Gothtopia
087 Catwoman #28 $2.99 23,974 Gothtopia
105 Catwoman #29 $2.99 22,236 Fisch, not Nocenti
118 Catwoman #30 $2.99 20,968 Nocenti
121 Catwoman #31 $2.99 20,144 Nocenti

[ABH]

New fan art:


http://crisdelarastudio.deviantart.c...Meow-463982451

[Cape and Cowl]

With Sorrentino off of Green Arrow, he's now free to slide into Gotham with Catwoman.

[ABH]

With Sorrentino off of Green Arrow, he's now free to slide into Gotham with Catwoman.

I think Sorrentino is a fine artist, but not for Catwoman.

[Cape and Cowl]

Hmm...I don't know man. I think this style could really be special in a Catwoman series.