VS!: The Great "Runaways" or "Young Avengers" Debate!

[Songbird/Diamondback]

Never got into the Runaways series or the characters. Big fan of Young Avengers. It's shame Marvel hasn't made it an on-going. However, I knew the Runaways were going to win this poll once I saw it was G&M's run. The mass LGBTQ reveal really didn't sit well with a lot of people unfortunately.

Hey now, I unfairly hated the YA after Cassie died...and the Academy and Runaways were sent to Arena...I said a lot of bad things in those days...

[Anduinel]

Voted for YA, but I still only liked that run about half as much as I did Avengers Academy and New X-Men.

[FlashingSabre]

Though I love some of Gileon's writing, I think he just does the same thing too much... "Partying is God's gift to the world" Like, he kinda keeps emphasizing this amazingness of raves and concerts and stuff, that when I tried to get into that whole lifestyle, I just ended up really depressed at the end of the night. The YA run feels like it entirely hinges on "Life is a party, so party as hard as you can!" sort of thing. The original run felt like it had heart. The volume 2 felt like it had to be as loud as possible to stay hip. It just didn't click with me, and it felt like it had no real message besides "PARTY HARD CAUSE YOU ARE YOUNG!"

As much as I originally based the first volume of Runaways, it does end pretty strong. It's just that REALLY STUPID Vampire arc that brings the series down. That and I thing Runaways and YA Vol 1 had better teams. YA Vol 2 was just a bunch of bros.

EDIT: I swear, I'm the only person who loves Stature on this board...

I love Stature! And Patriot, for that matter.

[FlashingSabre]

Hey now, I unfairly hated the YA after Cassie died...and the Academy and Runaways were sent to Arena...I said a lot of bad things in those days...

Hah, I totally should have been on the boards back then. I wasn't even reading the book and I spent hours ranting about how out of character and illogical it was to people who obviously didn't care.

But seriously, Mettle does not bleed, and Nico's magic has NOTHING TO DO WITH BLOOD SACRIFICES.

Also, they took a dump on Darkhawk.

[Kieran_Frost]

Voted for YA, but I still only liked that run about half as much as I did Avengers Academy and New X-Men.

If I had to rank them I'd probably go:
1. Gillen's YA
2. Kyle&Yost's New X-men
3. Heinberg's YA
4. BKV Runaways vol. 2
5. Lobdell's Generation X
6. BKV Runaways vol. 1
7. Whedon's Runaways
8. Avengers Arena
9. Avengers Academy
10. New Warriors (any run)

[Fokken]

But seriously, Mettle does not bleed, and Nico's magic has NOTHING TO DO WITH BLOOD SACRIFICES.

Have we all been misinterpreting these Staff of One summonings?
Granted -- she IS the daughter of dark wizards, so her aptitude for magic and sorcerer may be genetic, and perhaps it is solely the Staff of One that requires her to make a blood sacrifice, but still.... blood sacrifice, dude.


Regarding Mettle's unfortunate demise -- I never interpreted that image of his exploding as "blood". I mean, the guy exploded. I assumed that some of the Iridium(?) that his body is made up of liquified as well as shattered.

...though it IS curious that Ken had tear ducts, but couldn't have blood(?)

[America / Bucky / Russia]

I wonder what these would have looked like if you switched the creative teams.

Well that would be pre-Phonogram-era, unknown Gillen in 2004 so... disastrously.

On the subject of Gillen, is Generation Hope worth checking out?

[Fokken]

Well that would be pre-Phonogram-era, unknown Gillen in 2004 so... disastrously.

On the subject of Gillen, is Generation Hope worth checking out?

Only if you have an exclusive interest in Hope Summers, imho.
Considering that the numutants affectionately referred to as the "Five Lights" didn't actually play a significant role within the Avengers vs. X-Men storyline, as they should have, its really just a few fun (depending on your interests) stories about their powers and rescuing/learning about (being) mutants.

Its not essential reading.

[Knight of DC]

Sooooo, after thinking on this for a bit, I've finally made my choice. Looking at these two specific runs, I'd have to go with Runaways.

I admit, Young Avengers is the team I like more, but the Gillen/McKelvie run hasn't held up to me with multiple reads. Oh sure, it's got points for the LGB representation, but that's really about it and even that I had some sour notes (I have a real problem when anyone tells someone else what their sexuality is, whether in a joking, flirtatious manner in this or the more serious manner in ANXM). And for all the talk about ass-kicking ladies, Kate and America barely interacted with each other outside of some exposition on MAC's abilities or that annoying aforementioned scene so I don't get why people think they're, at least, friends. The villain was, let's face it, boring. Noh-Varr barely felt like a character. And it's another Wiccan story. And Wiccan is my favorite Young Avenger, but considering the last YA story was a Wiccan story (when it wasn't being a crappy prelude to a crappy event comic), I'm kind of ready for him to not be the central character. People have praised some of the development Hulkling got in this series, but seem to forget it was all in context of his relationship with Wiccan.

And I think, the biggest difference for me is, the Heinberg/Cheung Young Avengers felt like a family. Gillen/McKelvie's didn't. And sorry, not using instagram photos as stand in for character development/interaction.

[BroHomo]

CHOOSE between the Runaways and the Young Avengers??



Okay so firstly, the specificity of the question seems entirely unbalanced and unfair.
We're talking about Volume 1 of the Runaways -- their inception and subsequent presumed finale (which we would be later/unexpectedly treated to a volume 2 and 3), versus Volume 2 (?) of the Young Avengers (Heinberg's being Volume 1, followed by a slew of participatory event morsels -- Civil War, Siege, Secret Invasion, Crusade--which let's be real, Crusade was volume 2, so Gillen's should really be called volume 3 imho).

My gawd.
Putting aside the massive aesthetic juxtaposition alone -- we're talking INTRODUCTION vs. HISTORY ---"Meeting for the first time" vs. "Hello Old Friends".

Okay, SURE, the BKV's Runaways volume 1 deals with a band of plucky powered youths trying to navigate/defeat evil adults/parents.
And, YEAH, Gillen's Young Avengers volume 2 deals with a band of plucky powered youths trying to navigate/defeat evil adults/parents.
You've got me there.


But we're seriously comparing Alphona's and Mckelvie's work?? New to the buffet vs. Brought his stretch pants and ziploc baggies?
Both artists WOW their respective readership with their sense of style and dynamism -- but each had remarkable support from additional artists. Norton's environment's took Mckelvie's figures to new depths and Strain's colors took Alphona's to incredible heights. And speaking specifically to their handling of the cast members, Mckelvie never misses an emotional or actiony beat, panel after panel,--The details! The Fashions! The camera angles! The Experimentation! Gah! Whereas Alphona's 2nd act stuff, and subsequent mastery (volumes 2, 3, and beyond) is exceedingly superior to his first act. The details! The Fashions! The camera angles! The Experimentation! Gah! So should consistency play a significant role in deciding who dominates, when the progression is something to marvel at as well?

But....
For myself, asking a question like this is tantamount to asking which leg I wish to have severed from my body. I'm significantly attached to both, and its just painful to think about.

sooooooo which one?

Honey no. Noh-VARR.
Not Northstar.

lol I was like whaaaaat

So sad what a truth bomb that is; win for prejudice.

A lot of people only picked up YA when they switched the focus from the straight black leader, and replaced him with the gay white kid.

I find this insulting, I read this for most of the run and I hated it not because of the LGBT stuff but because I didn't like the writing or art. The mass LGBT thing happened towards the end of the run so most people would have made up their mind on the series long before then.

Well I hated the fact that Prodigy came out as Bi (his conclusion to this MAJOR part of himself) was even more icky than the Bobby/Jeen scenes. Prodigy is just an eck character! Billly and Teddy were snoozeville, and Noh-Var's sexuality was never really explored past Kate (forgettable) Bishop.

[Songbird/Diamondback]

Only if you have an exclusive interest in Hope Summers, imho.
Considering that the numutants affectionately referred to as the "Five Lights" didn't actually play a significant role within the Avengers vs. X-Men storyline, as they should have, its really just a few fun (depending on your interests) stories about their powers and rescuing/learning about (being) mutants.

Its not essential reading.

I really enjoyed Gen Hope. Transonic is best.

[Fokken]

sooooooo which one?

I can't choose.
They each possess uniquely superior aspects to each other in my humble opinion that I continually find myself ping pong-ing back and forth.
Aesthetics, character development, emotional resonance, cameos, connections to canon/history, dialogue, style, etc.

A lot of people only picked up YA when they switched the focus from the straight black leader, and replaced him with the gay white kid.

If you're referring to Wiccan -- he's never been the leader. Heinberg's self-insert? Maybe.
He was most certainly the focal character in the Children's Crusade (but Kate was the appointed leader) and the team is technically disbanded in Gillen's run, so his involvement is less "leader" and more "I have to clean up the mess I made". I still feel an argument could be made that Loki is actually the focal character in Gillen's run, whereas Billy is his pawn.

[legion_quest]

A lot of people only picked up YA when they switched the focus from the straight black leader, and replaced him with the gay white kid.

I dunno about that, a lot of people were very annoyed he was missing from Gillen's run. Personally, I never liked Patriot, but not because he was straight or black, but because he was this black teen stereotype with the drugs and the attitude. Then, he never really got a comeupance for being a drug user because of the way that series was so quick and short lived.

If you're referring to Wiccan -- he's never been the leader. Heinberg's self-insert? Maybe.
He was most certainly the focal character in the Children's Crusade (but Kate was the appointed leader) and the team is technically disbanded in Gillen's run, so his involvement is less "leader" and more "I have to clean up the mess I made". I still feel an argument could be made that Loki is actually the focal character in Gillen's run, whereas Billy is his pawn.

I would say that Wiccan likely is the focus of CC and Gillen's run, but he shares the story with Loki for Vol.2. So yeah, you're right.

[HsssH]

Easy pick, Runaways. If it was original YA line-up then it would have been closer, but Runaways would still win it for me.

Also (and this is a personal pet peeve), nothing turns me off more than when someone starts speaking in "text speak." As soon as someone drops an "OMG," I'm out lol.

This is my pet peeve too. I'm not old (27 years old to be exact), but every time I see it used I think "do people in USA actually talk like that?", I hear it here (small country in Europe) from time to time, but its usually done by total nerds and even then as a joke. But in comics its usually portrayed as something cool, like all cool kids speak like that and even hashtag every second word. Its really bizarre for me.

[gurkle]

This is my pet peeve too. I'm not old (27 years old to be exact), but every time I see it used I think "do people in USA actually talk like that?", I hear it here (small country in Europe) from time to time, but its usually done by total nerds and even then as a joke. But in comics its usually portrayed as something cool, like all cool kids speak like that and even hashtag every second word. Its really bizarre for me.

They do it on TV too, where people on sitcoms will sometimes say "OMG" ("Oh-em-gee") or put "hashtag" in front of things.

Kids don't talk like that, but the writers of sitcoms and comics are middle-aged, so they write they way they think "cool" kids talk. It's like in the '70s, white writers decided they wanted to be up-to-date on writing black characters, so they wrote their dialogue in "jive talk" that no actual black person ever said.