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  1. #3361
    Ultimate Member Gaius's Avatar
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    An "evil Batman" story could work but similar to what True Detective said, you can't just apply the "Evil Superman" formula and apply it to Batman. I think it'd have to be something far more small scale and it'd be something like taking the idea that stuff like White Knight dances with even further in that Batman, in-universe, does choose intentionally choose to go after the poor/mentally ill or Kingdom Come where he turns Gotham into his own little authoritarian state.
    Last edited by Gaius; 12-04-2021 at 07:06 AM.

  2. #3362
    Ultimate Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberstrike View Post
    DC needs to do a "evil Batman" story like they also do to Superman (Injustice, the DCEU, various TV episodes of various Superman/JL TV shows, stupid Elseworlds stories, etc) because that is what the kind of Batman story that would interest me. It's a story where Batman breaks his code and then Superman and the rest of the Justice League, and Batman's family would have to take him down. At least it would put that "Batman can beat anybody" nonsensical idea to the ultimate test and see if Batman can beat every hero and villain in the DCU.

    If Lois get murdered is enough to make Superman into a monster than it's only fair to see something like that happen to Batman in fact it's long overdue. No redemption, no last minute save, it's a story where Batman is a cold blooded killer and must be stopped.
    We've had lots of stories with batman losing or doing bad things and having to be taken down.

    Since Rebirth Batman has been losing and messing up. he has needed help from everyone from catwoman to Joker to Robin to Harley.

    There's a story where Catwoman teaches batman how to properly throw his Batarangs.

    I get that some enjoy seeing batman humbled or taken down a peg but enough. The character has been dragged enough. I'm sick of incompetent dumb weak Batman that we've seen in the last two batman runs [King and Tynion].

    Lois dies and Superman turns into a monster
    Selina dumps Batman and he turns into a monster.

    That happened less than 4 years ago! Are people just forgetful?

    Batman hasn't been given the chance to shine in his own title for at least 6 yeas now.
    That is a sad state of affairs.

    Batman beats his kids, abuses them mentally, got his father figure killed and then let his youngest kid take the fall.

    Batman's already Badman.
    Last edited by dietrich; 12-04-2021 at 07:13 AM.

  3. #3363
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Yeah, modern Bruce is such a clown I don't need to see him made worse. He needs to be built back up as an actual hero.
    May we never forget:

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    Daddy Zeus can hit the bricks.
    Truer words never spoken.

  4. #3364
    Astonishing Member TheRay's Avatar
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    Bette Kane needs to be used more.

  5. #3365

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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    We've had lots of stories with batman losing or doing bad things and having to be taken down.

    Since Rebirth Batman has been losing and messing up. he has needed help from everyone from catwoman to Joker to Robin to Harley.

    There's a story where Catwoman teaches batman how to properly throw his Batarangs.

    I get that some enjoy seeing batman humbled or taken down a peg but enough. The character has been dragged enough. I'm sick of incompetent dumb weak Batman that we've seen in the last two batman runs [King and Tynion].

    Lois dies and Superman turns into a monster
    Selina dumps Batman and he turns into a monster.

    That happened less than 4 years ago! Are people just forgetful?

    Batman hasn't been given the chance to shine in his own title for at least 6 yeas now.
    That is a sad state of affairs.

    Batman beats his kids, abuses them mentally, got his father figure killed and then let his youngest kid take the fall.

    Batman's already Badman.
    Ain't that the truth, but as I always say everyone ignores the numerous times Bruce is made to look bad because it doesn't fit the Batgod is evil narrative.

    Bruce as an out and out villain like Injustice Superman wouldn't go the way some would hope it would. If DC is so biased towards Bruce and hates making him look bad according to some people him as a villain would be their worst nightmare. Take "ha you fool, it was actually a Doombot!" "Thanos was right" Joker at his most untouchable and you'll get villain Batman.

    He'd be the ultimate cool villain who has backup plans upon backup plans, he'll be made to upstage everyone else with "cool" one liners and decimate the "lame" heroes who try to stop him. There's a large segment of fans who think villains are cooler than heroes so DC would make Bruce as uber cool and superior as possible to appeal to those fans. He's not going to be some sad sack despot the heroes berate before finishing off.

    DC's supposed bias towards him would surely insure he looks good even as the villain.

  6. #3366
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    I think Robert McCamon's short story "On a beautiful summer's day, he was" is a better snap shot of what the Joker's life was like pre-chemical bath than the Joker movie.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    Yeah, modern Bruce is such a clown I don't need to see him made worse. He needs to be built back up as an actual hero.
    Yeah, they really need to just stop writing stuff that makes him look bad/morally weak in general. And the continued beating up of him over it from other writers doesn't help the fictional character.

    Just write him as the hero he is. It can't be that hard.

    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    Lois dies and Superman turns into a monster
    Selina dumps Batman and he turns into a monster.
    The difference between these two is that the Superman stuff happens on a much bigger platform with stuff like Injustice or the original plans for the DCEU, whereas only a niche audience would read the Batman comics to see him act like a child when Selina dumps him.

    That said, the solution definitely would NOT be to do it more with Batman to even it out or whatever. DC should take better care of all their heroes in general
    Last edited by SiegePerilous02; 12-05-2021 at 09:30 AM.

  7. #3367
    Ultimate Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    Yeah, modern Bruce is such a clown I don't need to see him made worse. He needs to be built back up as an actual hero.
    Yeah reminds me of a comment about Pet Cemetary of all things.

    The undead cat in Pet Cemetary... well it basically just acts like a normal cat. Why? because cats are naturally inclined towards evil already.

    So in the case of Batman.... evil Batman is like normal Batman... but ...... Wait... HOW is he different? In Crisis on Two Earths, Owlman's main difference was that he wanted to use a fancy bomb to blow up the multiverse. He was the same condescending/scheming jerk as Batman.

  8. #3368
    Astonishing Member TheRay's Avatar
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    Batman has something for everyone to enjoy.

  9. #3369
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    In Killing Joke Joker fall into normal water and not chemical acids what makes him Joker was the One Bad Day that he had and not the acids that was the original intention that Moore wanted
    I dont understand why Joker should be a mysterious character in many stories they take Killing Joke as Canon and that he was once a man named Jack Napier and recently Arthur Fleck Joker can have a backstory like Batman too

  10. #3370

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    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Yeah reminds me of a comment about Pet Cemetary of all things.

    The undead cat in Pet Cemetary... well it basically just acts like a normal cat. Why? because cats are naturally inclined towards evil already.

    So in the case of Batman.... evil Batman is like normal Batman... but ...... Wait... HOW is he different? In Crisis on Two Earths, Owlman's main difference was that he wanted to use a fancy bomb to blow up the multiverse. He was the same condescending/scheming jerk as Batman.
    You know, for someone who doesn't seem to like Batman at all you sure do talk about him a lot.

  11. #3371
    Better than YOU! Alan2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediBatman54 View Post
    In Killing Joke Joker fall into normal water and not chemical acids what makes him Joker was the One Bad Day that he had and not the acids that was the original intention that Moore wanted
    I dont understand why Joker should be a mysterious character in many stories they take Killing Joke as Canon and that he was once a man named Jack Napier and recently Arthur Fleck Joker can have a backstory like Batman too
    Trying to take away Joker's origin has hurt the character alot more than it's helped.

    I also feel that Killing Joke and any other story where Joker tries to prove his point that anyone could be like him goes against his strenghts and theme as a character.

    If there's any Batman villain that should be going around trying to prove that one bad day is all it takes to ruin a person, it should be Two-Face.

  12. #3372
    Astonishing Member TheRay's Avatar
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    There’s room in the fandom for conflicting ideas.

  13. #3373
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Yeah reminds me of a comment about Pet Cemetary of all things.

    The undead cat in Pet Cemetary... well it basically just acts like a normal cat. Why? because cats are naturally inclined towards evil already.

    So in the case of Batman.... evil Batman is like normal Batman... but ...... Wait... HOW is he different? In Crisis on Two Earths, Owlman's main difference was that he wanted to use a fancy bomb to blow up the multiverse. He was the same condescending/scheming jerk as Batman.
    Give it another 40 years and they'll figure it out.
    May we never forget:

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    Daddy Zeus can hit the bricks.
    Truer words never spoken.

  14. #3374
    Ultimate Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The True Detective View Post
    You know, for someone who doesn't seem to like Batman at all you sure do talk about him a lot.
    Familiarity breeds contempt as the old saying goes. It's not even that I hate the IDEA of Batman. But recent takes make him.... an insane self parody.

  15. #3375
    Extraordinary Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    Give it another 40 years and they'll figure it out.
    They figured one part of it. Turning his distant albeit genuine familial love to a possessive familial obsession... but I only read that one version

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