Controversial Batfamily Opinions

[Nite-Wing]

Tim Drake had the 3 mini series that lead to his long running solo of 180 issues.
Nightwing had a mini that led to the first of many long runs-153 for volume 2.
Huntress had a mini.
Jean Paul after leaving Batman had his own solo run for 100 issues.
Catwoman started the first of many solo runs with a 92 issue run.
Harley started with a few minis and team book before her solo run.
Gotham Central went 40 issues.
Cassandra Cain started her now broken record for an Asian female solo run (by Ms Marvel) and PROVED a title called Batgirl could sell for 72 issues.

Orpheus, Michael Lane, Stephanie Brown, Damian, Luke Fox, Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Outsiders, Red Hood, Duke Thomas, Gotham Academy, Ivy, Joker, Punchline, Clown Hunter, Chase, Crispus Attucks, Mother Panic, Jace Fox, Babs Gordon, Jim Gordon and Renee Montoya all either saw a one shot, mini or ongoing or extend arc.

6 characters boast over 100 solo issues. With Cass, Batwoman and Harley needing 1-3 years to do the same.
5 females have over 50 solo issues.
8 women have had either a mini, one shot or ongoing
6 black males have had either an ongoing, one shot or mini.

Let me put it in context-

The ONLY franchise who can come close to this is SPIDER-MAN and he trails big time.

So where is this nothing has been done with them come from?

I am sure Flash and ESPECIALLY Green Lantern fans would love to be in Batman's shoes.

Batman as a franchise supports a lot of books mostly because DC needs to milk his name to make a profit to make room for books elsewhere(Didio even said as much for why a book like jonah hex could continue being published) my argument is that nothing of substance is being done with the large tent concept
All those characters and concepts drop in and out of limbo constantly
If DC is only keeping it around to produce more content then its a bad move.

I can't say its a good thing when a writer has no idea what to do with a character and they start being written badly or worst drop off the page entirely
Look at Ric Grayson
Look at what happened to Harper once Snyder left
Look at Damian currently

Its a creative dead end imo

[Mistah K88]

I was reading things like Batman: The Adventures Continue and Batman Annual #5 and felt that having Harley conveniently leave when Joker was about to kill or torture someone was such BULL. I could only imagine if Mad Love were written today the whole dentist scene where Joker about to put a drill to Gordon's head they would have had Harley exit the room rather than stand right beside him smiling. The fact that writers have to retroactively make Harley disappear when Joker did something horrific when they were together is rather jarring to me.

[Gaius]

I was reading things like Batman: The Adventures Continue and Batman Annual #5 and felt that having Harley conveniently leave when Joker was about to kill or torture someone was such BULL. I could only imagine if Mad Love were written today the whole dentist scene where Joker about to put a drill to Gordon's head they would have had Harley exit the room rather than stand right beside him smiling. The fact that writers have to retroactively make Harley disappear when Joker did something horrific when they were together is rather jarring to me.

Yeah, this is part of a problem of the character discussed earlier. They want the credibility of “the clown princess” title by making her Joker’s lackey but none of the consequences that it actually means and comes with it.

Like running around in an SS uniform because you think it looks cool but don’t really think what causally wearing that actually means.

[CPSparkles]

I think Nite-Wing refers to that apart from Thomasi non of the Batman writers in the past years, really used Damian that much as Robin.

Sad that batman and Robin hasn't really been a dynamic duo in the bat titles since Jason's tenure.

Still Nite-Wing's comment is a very odd one to make about the Bat character that's only behind Bruce and Harley in terms of writers using him.

Also the comment of only Bruce and Harley getting elseworld contentis also incorrect.

[CPSparkles]

Batman as a franchise supports a lot of books mostly because DC needs to milk his name to make a profit to make room for books elsewhere(Didio even said as much for why a book like jonah hex could continue being published) my argument is that nothing of substance is being done with the large tent concept
All those characters and concepts drop in and out of limbo constantly
If DC is only keeping it around to produce more content then its a bad move.

I can't say its a good thing when a writer has no idea what to do with a character and they start being written badly or worst drop off the page entirely
Look at Ric Grayson
Look at what happened to Harper once Snyder left
Look at Damian currently

Its a creative dead end imo

Bad examples. Dick and Damian are the two with upcoming content that's actually got fans excited.

[ZuLuLu]

Bad examples. Dick and Damian are the two with upcoming content that's actually got fans excited.

Plus Harper is also going to be a part of the upcoming Joker title with Punchline, and the one-shot she was in got good reviews.

[Stars & Stripes]

Plus Harper is also going to be a part of the upcoming Joker title with Punchline, and the one-shot she was in got good reviews.

Hoping that the backups are popular enough that it somehow leads to her being the lead in a mini or something.

[Gaius]

Arkham Asylum should either be abandoned as a concept in the Batman mythos or completely re-invented from the ground up as currently it only exists to promulgate stereotypes about the mentally ill (his rogues) and those who work in the mental health industry (Strange and Harley Quinn).

Ditto for Joker's "insanity plea" defense.

[Tzigone]

I have to admit to not being at all onboard with the idea that the bulk of Batman's rogues are mentally ill. Ventriloquist and Two-Face, okay, but not so many of the others. Including the Joker - much prefer him as just sane and evil.

[marhawkman]

Arkham Asylum should either be abandoned as a concept in the Batman mythos or completely re-invented from the ground up as currently it only exists to promulgate stereotypes about the mentally ill (his rogues) and those who work in the mental health industry (Strange and Harley Quinn).

Ditto for Joker's "insanity plea" defense.

Ah, but his is not universally true. Some actually are. But more often than not the writing just doesn't work.

It's often used as an excuse for why they don't get sent to death row or something... and honestly... that's a bad reason to do it. What's the point to intense psychotherapy if the patient is incurable... or just not really insane?

Also Gotham has Blackgate prison, which is a more conventional sort.

[SiegePerilous02]

Arkham Asylum should either be abandoned as a concept in the Batman mythos or completely re-invented from the ground up as currently it only exists to promulgate stereotypes about the mentally ill (his rogues) and those who work in the mental health industry (Strange and Harley Quinn).

Ditto for Joker's "insanity plea" defense.

Somewhat along similar lines, I think everything related to the Al Ghul portion of the mythos should be retired.

[Mutant God]

Arkham Asylum should either be abandoned as a concept in the Batman mythos or completely re-invented from the ground up as currently it only exists to promulgate stereotypes about the mentally ill (his rogues) and those who work in the mental health industry (Strange and Harley Quinn).

Ditto for Joker's "insanity plea" defense.

Ah, but his is not universally true. Some actually are. But more often than not the writing just doesn't work.

It's often used as an excuse for why they don't get sent to death row or something... and honestly... that's a bad reason to do it. What's the point to intense psychotherapy if the patient is incurable... or just not really insane?

Also Gotham has Blackgate prison, which is a more conventional sort.

I think Blackgate is for normal criminals and Arkham is for super powered criminals and irrational dangerous people who are up for life in prison since I think Death Penalty is illegal in Gotham. I actually love the theme of mental illness/complexes in Batman's Rogues since its one of the reasons his' are so unique.

[Mistah K88]

Methinks that Arkham can be problematic when IN UNIVERSE that it is well known as a lost cause...to the point a judge sent Warren White there out of spite. I will say that a good chunk of the Arkham inmates need to stop being serial murderers if we want to take that place semi-seriously.

[mathew101281]

Somewhat along similar lines, I think everything related to the Al Ghul portion of the mythos should be retired.

Why? I don’t feel the Al Ghul is inherently problematic. Which I feel is what your implying.

[Restingvoice]

Arkham's problem is they want it both to be a horror house and a legit mental institution. Arkham has a rep for the doctors abusing patients but they also have a facility for non-criminal.

Just like how GCPD is corrupt, I guess that kind of concept can work since that's basically Gotham. A horror house that Bruce and Gordon try to fix because there's a small portion of good in it, and they did make an effort to make it more secure and healthy before it's forgotten in the next arc because they want to do a Joker event

The Al Ghul is part of DC's problem with the Middle East in general. They made at least 2 Middle Eastern fictional countries in DCU known to be dangerous or under a dictatorship. Qurac and Khandaq. In comparison, they don't have fictional American countries where people are fat and eat burgers all day.

Then the number of good Middle Eastern characters they have that make a regular appearance. Baz... and Damian who they most often portray as mini-Bruce than anything representing Arabic culture... when they're not making him be a violent, murderous Robin.