Fantastic Four #5 *spoilers*

[Rheged]

True, Franklin being her biological son should carry greater weight than for the other children. However, in Wu and Vil's case I think this can be considered an international incident due to their royal status. At the very least the court and SHIELD should have taken diplomatic relations into consideration. I can't see the Old Atlanteans being happy upon learning their heirs were shipped off to a SHIELD camp.

The court doesn't seem too interested in the rights of other countries, considering how they wrote off Namor's status as a ruling monarch. AFAIK, Old Atlantis has less interaction with the surface world than the moloids. I doubt they are even known about or recognized as a country.

TBH, I'm surprised Old Atlantis is even around, considering Sue dumped them on Namor after they did exactly what he said they would.

Under the care of one of Namor's oldest allies though.

Ray's talking about the Old Atlanteans, who were the enemies of Namor's Atlantis back in prehistory.

[klinton]

Huh. The Fantastic Four is litterally the very last book I'd ever expect Jim to show up in. Seriously. It was a nice sync up with his joining SHIELD at Steve's request over in Invaders. And, quite frankly, a much needed bright spot in a rather grim, unrelenting story.

I really enjoyed this issue, despite spending much of the time gritting my teeth and feeling the team's frustration at the severe stonewalling. It was a very well penned recap of some of the team's more notable feats.

Valeria's interactions with Doom were a nice aside nice too, although I'm full unsure what her endgame is. There were hints that it's not benevolent at all.

But seeing Hammond in yet another title was a much welcomed development. I've always liked him, and he gets far too little attention.

[davew128]

I've never seen Ben Grimm go to the bathroom in books, either, but I'm certain he does so.

I've seen Ben Grimm go to the bathroom in a book. An early Marvel Fanfare where Johnny was playing practical jokes all over the place on Ben thinking it was April Fools Day. Except it was March 31...

[pad]

Exactly. There are so many logical flaws with the arguments, even the judge should have caught some of those. The plantiff attourney (I mean, it's NOT a criminal trial, after all) is simply cherry picking his evidence, and She Hulk could have countered with cherry picking of her own-- how often would *positive* things have happened to the city because of the FF's presence, for example.

This would have been a good cross-over with She-Hulk, especially since a lawyer is writing her book. Jen did say she would appeal, so there is more to come.

[XPac]

I thought Doom soloing Nefaria (a guy that's an Avengers level team buster) was pretty cool.

Stark and Pym should take notes.

[Joe Acro]

I'm generally a big fan of comic books that spotlight how law works in a superhero world. She-Hulk and Astro City in particular have touched on this very well, as did Marvel Boy's story in New Warriors. That said, I was not a fan of this issue. Instead of a court proceeding, we basically just get a series of pages of the prosecutor accosting the FF. This isn't really a court case, because we see no rebuttal witnesses, She-Hulk doesn't know that the taxi situation is related to Thing and not Sue (which she would have, since both sides submit witness lists), and instead of focusing on the problem at hand, it slogs through past history that the FF really should not be held accountable for. Reed is not written well--I can't imagine him misplacing something as important as the Ultimate Nullifer (not that it's been in his possession anytime recently) or making such an admission in open court when not directly asked. I can't feel bad for Jen because I don't know how she failed. This guy's case seems pretty easy to shut down. She should be able to win, but we don't see why she couldn't.

It all made for an incredibly annoying read.

[Iron Maiden]

I do think Reed could have come up with a better answer about the Ultimate Nullifier maybe by invoking some kind of national, if not global security issues. "I am not at liberty to say" might have been sufficient without possibly perjuring himself I would think. Truthfully, I had to be reminded by another fan that we last saw it in Original Sin so the Watcher had it at one point. It certainly has been hard to keep track of over the years.

[XPac]

I do think Reed could have come up with a better answer about the Ultimate Nullifier maybe by invoking some kind of national, if not global security issues. "I am not at liberty to say" might have been sufficient without possibly perjuring himself I would think. Truthfully, I had to be reminded by another fan that we last saw it in Original Sin so the Watcher had it at one point. It certainly has been hard to keep track of over the years.

I don't think Reed stated that he misplaced the Ultimate Nullifyer. The lawyer threw that in there but all Reed really said was that he doesn't know where it is at the moment (which is likely true if it feel into the hands of a Mindless one somehow) and that he at one time possessed it (which again is true).

I'm assuming Jens cross examination can clear that up easily enough and it just wasn't show on panel. Unless Jen sucks at her job, which is distinct possibility. During Civil War I was half convinced she got her law degree out of a cereal box.

[CyclopsWasRight]

Guys, I'm loving it, absolutely loving it! Robinson already earned points from me for his use of Hammond, but now he's integrated him into the FF?

After Hickman, I didn't think we'd get a good Fantastic Four run for a while. While it's too far to call this a good run, it's gotten off to a damn good start. I never would have imagined this after the clunker that was Fractions run.

[xMatt]

Huh. The Fantastic Four is litterally the very last book I'd ever expect Jim to show up in. Seriously. It was a nice sync up with his joining SHIELD at Steve's request over in Invaders. And, quite frankly, a much needed bright spot in a rather grim, unrelenting story.

I really enjoyed this issue, despite spending much of the time gritting my teeth and feeling the team's frustration at the severe stonewalling. It was a very well penned recap of some of the team's more notable feats.

Valeria's interactions with Doom were a nice aside nice too, although I'm full unsure what her endgame is. There were hints that it's not benevolent at all.

But seeing Hammond in yet another title was a much welcomed development. I've always liked him, and he gets far too little attention.

Yeah, I certainly enjoyed the 'epilogue' scenes (Doom/Hammond scenes) more than I enjoyed the main part in court. If not for the amazing art, from such celebrated artists, Kirk included, I wonder how effective the issue would have been.

[Beacon]

What happened to Dragon Man?

[Dubbilex]

Does anyone know what issue Ben's incident with the taxi is from? And does it happen pretty much as the lawyer states?

[Cmbmool]

I hate to ask everyone this, but where the events of Civil War and World War Hulk and Secret Invasion mention during the issue considering the team involvement in those recent events ?

[Joe Acro]

What happened to Dragon Man?

Considering he's essentially an android brought to life, he might have been lumped with Reed's inventions and been quarantined within the Baxter Building.

[Hypestyle]

the kids will come back eventually.